The Two Faces of the Sabbath

[God's Truth]

No you didn't. That is why I am asking for it. referring to your post: ["Paul did not teach the old law but he upheld it while it still stood when he wanted to go to Jerusalem."]

You are trying desperately to act like you did not say what you did.

I said Paul upheld the old temple law but did not preach it or teach it.

 

[God's Truth]

Jesus did not tell them to do what the Pharisees said to do.

Matthew 23:3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you.

 

[God's Truth]

What do you mean by "Temple Laws"?

An unclean person could not go to the temple. The people had purification/ceremonial laws to be kept to go to the temple.

 

[Samie]

Do you think you are fooling anyone?

I think you are the one trying to fool people. Here again:

So why did you resort to deception and lied about what you said? Shown and proven. Here again:

1. You posted this on Jan 2, 2017 2:26 PM:

Jesus did not go to church on Saturdays. He went to the temple every day.​

2. You posted this on Jan 3, 2017 2:23 AM

Jesus didn't go to church on Saturdays.
Jesus went to the temple on Saturdays and every day.​

3. And here's the deception and the lie you posted Jan 3, 2017 7:12 AM:

Jesus did not just go to the temple or the synagogues on the Sabbath; he went every day.

I proved all that with scripture.

That is what I told Samie.
​

You see I got proof you're trying to fool people.

 

[God's Truth]

I think you are the one trying to fool people. Here again:You see I got proof you're trying to fool people.

It is not there Samie.

 

[Samie]

It is not there Samie.

Really? Here again:

So why did you resort to deception and lied about what you said? Shown and proven. Here again:

1. You posted this on Jan 2, 2017 2:26 PM:

Jesus did not go to church on Saturdays. He went to the temple every day.​

2. You posted this on Jan 3, 2017 2:23 AM

Jesus didn't go to church on Saturdays.
Jesus went to the temple on Saturdays and every day.​

3. And here's the deception and the lie you posted Jan 3, 2017 7:12 AM:

Jesus did not just go to the temple or the synagogues on the Sabbath; he went every day.

I proved all that with scripture.

That is what I told Samie.
​

Still pretend to not see it? I will post it again.

 

[clefty]

You did not believe the scripture that plainly says what I said it said.

Jesus said to do what they say but do not do as they do.

Yup...HalleluYah...I agree!

What the Pharisees taught and what they did were indeed not the same...later Yahushua even demonstrates that though they taught the Sabbath Pharisees included their own traditions and safeguards which they enforced rather than what Moses wrote...

"Keep the commandments" was the answer when asked by the rich young ruler. Some where listed referring to the OT set...yes a set all or nothing...you can't expect Jews to think that because "don't make an image" wasn't included here that they were able to begin making images...

Oh wait never mind some Christians think the believing Jews did just that...lol

Ok so six (five in Luke) were listed and Jews see it as a reference to the 10...most Christians do too unless they suspect you are mindful of the Sabbath one...lol

He also told the adulteress to go and sin no more...which of course is observing the Law...

Paul kept on keeping on as well making it quite clear here:

Acts 24: "12 My accusers did not find me arguing with anyone at the temple, or stirring up a crowd in the synagogues or anywhere else in the city. 13 And they cannot prove to you the charges they are now making against me. 14 However, I admit that I worship the God of our ancestors as a follower of the Way, which they call a sect. I believe everything that is in accordance with the Law and that is written in the Prophets, "

The false charges Pharisees were pressing on Paul were that he taught a change to the laws and customs of the Jews...and their Temple...

And not just Paul other believing Jews continued to be faithful

Acts 21:"19Paul greeted them and recounted one by one the things God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. 20When they heard this, they glorified God. Then they said to Paul, “You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of them are zealous for the Law. 21But they are under the impression that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or observe our customs.…"

So James had him prove otherwise...he did.

See? rumors and false witness and slander all around as Paul was accused of changing the law...tragic how Christians continue that lie...

Paul hurried to Jerusalem for the feasts and instructed believers celebrate Passover with the new unleavened bread of spirit and truth...

He began as a Jews Jew in a desire to please and serve God and finished the same race...the same way...

 

[clefty]

You said the scripture says pray to keep the Sabbath. The scripture does not say that.

Sure it does...and not only here but here as well:

"Pray then like this: 'Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name. Your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. "

You gonna try and spin it twist it and insist in Heaven His Law is not kept? Lol...So we are to pray that what is done in heaven is also done here on earth...

 

[clefty]

The Judaizers talked the Galatians into observing the old law that was to observe special days and to get circumcised.

not the issue here...here it was they returned to a time they did not know God and observed things that by nature where enslaving observing things which were by nature gods.

Well they certainly weren't God's things either...but the commandments were and those that keep them know God...

Or rather they are known by Godfor He knows those who keep His commandments as they are His people...but alas they were turning back to the weak and beggarly things...lol...as if Paul would describe the Law in such manner...

Pagans observed special days for their worship too, and the Jews talked them into doing those weak things again.

yup you got it...

It's so ironic you think Jews made pagans return to pagan ways because they also got Christians to believe lies too...their lies he taught the law changed...as if Paul did not teach observance to the law..."we establish it!"

Compared to Jesus, special days are nothing as far as salvation.

that is true...Sabbath was because people are saved...just like Adam was created then given Sabbath...Hebrews were saved from Egypt then given Sabbath...keeping Sabbath is what His people do because they already are saved not to get saved...duh!

You keep the Sabbath to merely reveal the One you worship...lord of the Sabbath and who you are loyal to...Yah > man's traditions...

Galatians 5:2 Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all.

yup expecting a ritual that is done to babies to save you is expecting it to save babies too...I don't support infant baptism and I certainly understand circumcision is not salvific...Abraham was 99 when cut saved and considered righteous long before that...Moses too chosen...then cut...and not even by his own decision...lol how does that save?

Galatians 5:6
For in Christ Jesus, neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. All that matters is faith, expressed through love.

even pagans have faith and love each other and their god...you must define WHO you have faith in by the works you are compelled to do and love with a love JUST AS HE LOVED...His Way as He did includes sabbath keeping...His love surpasses and is different than all other loves ever loved...

Even Peter were afraid of these Jews and it caused him to act out of line with the gospel.

Fear of the Jew was a real thing...in fact that first day of the week when He was supposed to have risen the disciples were not celebrating His power over death...but hiding for fear of the Jews...some Easter celebration...Christians still fear the Jews...elevate them and their lies

Galatians 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.

blamed for what eating ham? No because he continued the appearance that the goyim were unclean...

In Him there no longer was Jew or Gentile and even we are through Him now citizens of Israel...to do as they do as those Gentiles came to them...and did as believing Jews did...as Moses was read to them every sabbath...

 

[clefty]

Correct, but entole does not refer to the Mosaic Law.

b. ethically; α. used of the commandments of the Mosaic law: ἡ ἐντολή τοῦ Θεοῦ, what God prescribes in the law of Moses,

While that covenant remained it was God's Law, but when Jesus came, the Law changed and was made old [out of use] so the Kingdom of Heaven could be preached.

the covenant changed the law of priesthood changed...are you mean to say we don't have to keep the other 9 laws either...

It's always this silly argument...keep God's laws except the Sabbath...lol...

Christ's house is the Sabbath Rest. The house rules are belief in Him, love for God, and love for mankind.

heathen love their gods each other and themselves...big deal...

What you need to say is "love just as Christ loved you" and well that includes a day of rest known as the Sabbath...

As an employer you would allow six days of work and a seventh day of rest...because you love...as He did...and well even pagans would know who you love...duh...lord of the sabbath...all the other bosses would work them seven days a week...or 10 days or whatever other number man's traditions has tried...

The Mosaic Law was the covenant [by the blood of animals] which was replaced by the new covenant in Christ's blood.

yup...it signed and sealed that new covenant and not only His followers continued to keep the Sabbath but His own first day in the new covenant was rest and then being refreshed...nothing says refreshment more than rising from the dead...

His first full day in the new covenant was rest...ironic or planned? Just like the first full day of of the Edenic covenant...

Jesus said that Rest is now found in Him, not in a day.

He said He will give you rest...and He being Lord of the Sabbath can...you get the Sabbath...other gods have holy days but rest is not really the intent is it?...

"I will give you rest" and "I am the new Sabbath day rest replacing the old Sabbath day" are very different...the former was written...the latter was contrived much later...

Notice how even in Greek the author reaches back to the Hebrew to better say...sabbatismos...a sabbath keeping and NOT paradise...had it been that that would have been said...but to convey in the letter to Hebrews what was the law and custom of the Hebrews...they would see their sabbaths would remain...as it always did with His people and not some paradise...

You impose what is not there...you add to the word...sabbath keeping means six days of work first...not paradise

He also said that nothing going into a man is unclean, but all is cleansed and comes out the other end. He said that the unclean comes from within one's heart.

If anything unclean went into a Jews mouth it means the heart was unclean first...

As if eating Ham would be considered by a Jew...would you eat poop? Human flesh? Rotting carcasses? There are some that do...

There is no day or night in His House - it is quite simply .. eternity - without beginning, without end.

ummm no...out of His eternity He became flesh mortal and well that after making time itself...and for us the count remains and will remain seven days and the Sabbath as Isaiah affirms will be kept...

Living in the rest of Jesus Christ is not like a football game. And it's not a team sport.

never mind...you don't understand His parables or analogies I should expect you do understand we do something because we are something...doing something

The physical edible manna is no longer His manna.

says you...somebody take it from Him?

He is the Manna from Heaven, the Living Bread and the Living Water - we eat and drink from Him 24/7 and will continue to do so for all eternity. Read John 6.

Ummmm well yes we eat and drink from Him...not Him Himself...from Him we receive many things...some of them you reject...we receive rest...literally...now...a whole day...not just in paradise...

 

[clefty]

You are arguing against the scripture that says he was at the temple every day.

You are trying to twist it to say I am saying, or that the scriptures are saying every day of his ministry.

Even if he only did it for a week---IT PROVES YOU wrong.

He was traveling about the land and not at the temple everyday...He was making the point that they could have arrested Him all those other days....but by Design it was to be before Passover...for Passover...

'Every day' is hyperbole as is smoke rises from sodom forever...as if it's still rising...

 

[clefty]

Unclean meat and clean meat are symbolic of people, as was the other purification/ceremonial works...they are symbolic of a deeper meaning that Christ would fulfill.

Unclean meat represented a nation and ethnicity of people; as did clean meat.

Now no one is considered unclean when God has cleaned them with His blood.

Yup...

Not just any gentile but believers...their faith makes them no longer foreigners but citizens of Israel and they are expected to do as Isael was supposed to do...grafted into the trunk and roots and to bare the same fruit...

Just like the strangers traveling in the desert who also received the Sabbath specifically...

Now no meat is unclean when eaten with thanks.

really? Even meat offered to idols? Strangled? Meat full of blood? Human flesh? Road kill sitting there in the open sun for a few hours...days...

Just give thanks...and eat...

Lol...

 

[clefty]

1 Corinthians 10:29 the other one’s conscience, I mean, not your own. For why should my freedom be determined by someone else’s conscience? 30 If I partake in the meal with thankfulness, why am I denounced because of that for which I give thanks? 31 So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all to the glory of God.

I prefer if your eye causes you to sin...pluck it out...

Don't be a stumbling block ok?

Your heart should flee evil...not rationalize ingesting it...with thanks...

This text is about what to do when you don't know if it's offered to idols...unclean...

http://biblicaltruth.net/dietary-law-biblical/1-corinthians-10/

 

[clefty]

How do you ever get that I believe the false accusation of the Jews? Paul broke NO temple rules. What don't you get about that?

thought you said he kept the temple law but taught otherwise...meaning he taught not to keep it...which is exactly what false witnesses were accusing him for...

[/quote]Paul preached Jesus crucified and why else do you think he was prosecuted?[/quote] he had enemies that wanted to accuse him of things he didn't do?

Oh and they did the same with Yahushua...and were still trying to destroy Him His memory...still do...

But funny how Jews today are realizing He wasn't against the Law and are finding Him despite the lies Christians say...lies that were themselves first century Jewish false witness accusations...

He did not break the earthly temple laws but he did preach Christ crucified.

Yup and said "copy me as I copy Christ"...sabbath, festivals, kosher etc...just like Yahushua...who Himself said live and love as He did...keeping His Father's commandments and remaining in His love...

What Jews didn't like to hear is exactly that they killed their messiah who was one the right hand side of God...killed Stephen for saying it...

Gentiles were all excited about hearing of One who beat death...and crowded the synagogues every sabbath to here why He had to die and how He was able to come back to life...heard all about Moses too...

 

[clefty]

You cannot nullify scripture with scripture.

That is sooo rich...the irony...

Christians nullify the OT Law...especially the sabbath scripture all the time with scripture...

Lol...LOL

 

[clefty]

I never said Jesus is a literal day.

so it remains...

The Sabbath is now not a literal day. Jesus' literal rest is Heaven, not a day of earth time.

yes the spiritual rest is also to come...but it's here now too...so is the literal rest still with the people of God...

He did not rest on the literal Sabbath day, why should we?

He said He did...He said He did His Father's will Kept His Law...was One with Him...and did so as an example for us...that's why we should do it...it's His Father's will...even in times of trouble...just pray we can keep it and not have to flee on it...

There is no such thing as a day of rest. If you think you are resting on the 7th day and honoring it as a "Sabbath", you are just kidding yourself.

Well lucky for me you ain't the final say on this...

 

[clefty]

Jesus did not tell them to do what the Pharisees said to do. They told the people to do things that were not in the Law of Moses. The only thing that Jesus referred to was what the Pharisees were reading from the Mosaic Law and that the people should do. What the Pharisees taught outside of the Law was rendering the Law invalid.

Mark 7
1 Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem. 2 And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault. 3 For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders. 4 And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables. 5 Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands? 6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me. 7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. 8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.

9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition. 10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death: 11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free. 12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother; 13 making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

See? The Pharisees were teaching Sabbath and you just said He agreed with them...keep the 10...

So what is your problem with doing the same?

Making up and adding your own interpretation and traditions to the word of GOd...like a good Pharisee hoping to redefine what the Sabbath is...

LOL...Christians talking to each other always agree the 10 commandment remain binding...until they get to the Sabbath thingy...lol...

Six days work...seventh day rest...be refreshed...do good works...live and love JUST AS HE DID

 

[clefty]

Matthew 23:3 So you must be careful to do everything they tell you.

So should you...

 

[clefty]

What are you going on about? God made all animals clean, just like they were at the beginning according to what he told Noah.

Gen 9
And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth. 2 And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered. 3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things. 4 But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.

Hey lookie there...it's a qualifier..."even as the green herb have I given you all things"

So how about a poison ivy, hemlock, Strychnine salad?

Maybe clean and unclean animals on Noah's ark were not just for sacrifices?

Even if all meat was given to eat big deal...there were people and then there were His people...His people were given later instructions that separated them from the rest of the bug eaters ya dig?

A peculiar people...healthy too...

 

[God's Truth]

So should you...

Haven't you heard that there is no more earthly temple and no pharisees?