glorydaz
Well-known member
I don't need to lie. I confess the LORD Jesus Christ as Creator, Saviour, and God.
It's the unbelievers that have the problem.
Who will answer my questions?
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I don't need to lie. I confess the LORD Jesus Christ as Creator, Saviour, and God.
It's the unbelievers that have the problem.
marhig
Well-known member
Not according to Jesus
Revelation 22:12
And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Yeah, you workers have a lot to look forward to, don't ya?
Do you know what the Gospel of Grace is?
You can't earn eternal life...no matter how hard you try.
There are many similar comments like this by Jesus. That is what He means when He says we know them by their fruit.
God cannot be mocked.
Yeah, you workers have a lot to look forward to, don't ya?
Do you know what the Gospel of Grace is?
You can't earn eternal life...no matter how hard you try.
Why do you take light of Jesus' word of encouragement?
We will not be saved if we are not blessed by Him. And we are not blessed if we don't strive to follow Him.
Christianity's basic principle is to strive to follow Jesus' teachings. And this is milk stage.
What they don't realize is that we can go so far just trying to fulfil this simple concept.
Too many Christians take so light of basic principle.
And that is tragedy to say the least. That is the root of deception IMO.
What they don't realize is that we can go so far just trying to fulfil this simple concept.
Too many Christians take so light of basic principle.
And that is tragedy to say the least. That is the root of deception IMO.
marhig
Well-known member
It's not our works, it's the works of God, Jesus said we are to do works, it's up to you whether you believe him or not.Yeah, you workers have a lot to look forward to, don't ya?
Do you know what the Gospel of Grace is?
You can't earn eternal life...no matter how hard you try.
And there's only one gospel, and that's the gospel that Jesus preached as did all those who truly follow him.
marhig
Well-known member
Amen!!
That's Judaism's basic teaching, not Christianity's.
You can't attain righteousness through your own actions. IT'S NOT POSSIBLE.
The only deception here is you being deceived by your ignorance of the Scriptures.
The verse YOU JUST QUOTED it talking about the works of man.
IT'S NOT TALKING ABOUT CHRIST'S WORKS!
Is law grace? Is grace law? You are trying to make them the same by saying there is only one Gospel. There are two. There's the Gospel of Law made for Israel. There's the Gospel of Grace made for the entire World, including Israel after they were cut off.
By the way, are you going to completely ignore the Gospel Paul preached which is completely different than the one Jesus preached during His earthly ministry?
marhig
Well-known member
No JR, we have a choice, obey God or not, we can either listen to him and let him into our hearts and listen to him live by him and his will and as he does the works within we then live it out and obey him. Or we can disobey God and live by the works of our flesh.
Also, if you believe that verse in revelation 22:12 is talking about the works of man, then why don't you believe Jesus when he says that there are works to do?
And there is one gospel not two!
Because I know that He was speaking to a group of people whom I am not a part of, Israel.
Is law grace? Is grace law? You are trying to make them the same by saying there is only one Gospel. Law is not Grace, and Grace is not Law. There's the Gospel of Law made for Israel. There's the Gospel of Grace made for the entire World, including Israel after they were cut off.
By the way, are you going to completely ignore the Gospel Paul preached which is completely different than the one Jesus preached during His earthly ministry?
marhig
Well-known member
The book of Revelation isn't only for Israel it is for all of us, as is everything that Jesus preaches.
And no I don't ignore what Paul taught I believe that Paul is an apostle and preached the gospel of God as Jesus did.
You seem to ignore the teachings of Jesus because you believe that they are for Israel and only go by what Paul teaches.
I follow Jesus, so I listen to what he preaches and believe in him!
And if there are no laws, what does Paul mean when he says that the laws are written in our hearts and in our minds? And that the law and the prophets hang on the two greatest commandments?
popsthebuilder
New member
No. Y9u accused me of lying and I'm asking how you can do that based on the scripture provided.
I wasn't accusing you of lying; just repeating what you said towards me.
popsthebuilder
New member
And not using a gift is the same as not appreciating or receiving it.Yeah, you workers have a lot to look forward to, don't ya?
Do you know what the Gospel of Grace is?
You can't earn eternal life...no matter how hard you try.
popsthebuilder
New member
The gospel St. Paul preached is the same that Christ preached is the same that John the baptizer preached is the same that Elias preached and those before him.
We should do a discussion on the two gospels you claim, based on the words of both Christ and St. Paul, and St. Peter too while we are at it.
There isn't a single verse that can be said to be against the gospel of Christ, which St. Paul wrote, unless stripped of context.
Is it the same as the gospel James preached?
Jesus taught keep the law.
Paul taught "if you keep the law you're cursed."
Does that sound the same to you?
Start a thread and tag me in it. And let's add the rest of the New Testament AND the Old Testament to the discussion. The Entire Bible will be used.
James wrote:
Spoiler
Paul said:
What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh?For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:“Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven, And whose sins are covered;Blessed is the man to whom the L ord shall not impute sin.”Does this blessedness then come upon the circumcised only, or upon the uncircumcised also? For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness.How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised.And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of the faith which our father Abraham had while still uncircumcised.For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect,because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression.Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all(as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations” ) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did;who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.”And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb.He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God,and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform.And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him,but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead,who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification. - Romans 4:1-25 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans4:1-25&version=NKJV
Those two verses are the antitheses of each other. James says works + faith, Paul says faith alone. The only way Paul's message can be said to be the same as Christ's is if it is stripped of context.
But again, start a thread and tag me in it, and then make your assertion.
popsthebuilder
New member
Silly; they both say that works pleasing to GOD are secret, and a product of faith in GOD and not due to one's wants or attainment, but due to the free gift of faith, and the will of GOD.
popsthebuilder
New member
Yes; the whole Bible would he acceptable for reproof. I won't be making the thread though. You can, if you want. Just let me know if you do, or mention me so I can find it.
It would be a fun discussion.