Real Science Friday: A Leading Telescope Designer in Studio

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian suggests:
You should try to do small things every day.

Barbarian, Jesus sacrifice on the Cross is a free gift that you can't possibly pay for not even if you bought backpacks for every child on Planet Earth.

Still, He says whether you spend eternity with Him or with the devil depends on how you treat the needy. Set your pride aside and believe Him.

Barbarian observes:
Asking me to catalogue what I do, shows you don't understand. You see, in telling you about the backpack, I already got my reward here. When you do for others without thinking of your reward, then you're on the right track, Tom.

If you volunteer at a food pantry, you are violating Paul's admonition: "He who does not work should not eat."

Jesus says he saves those who feed the hungry. I can believe you, or I can believe God.

Barbarian observes:
About every other year on the net, someone tells me that I convinced them that Christians have gotten a bad rap, and sometimes, they become believers. I don't keep notches, but some of the notes they've sent me are among my fondest possessions. I have a couple from people here.

How in the world can you lead someone to Christ when you are unsaved yourself.

You can't, Tom. First, you've got to accept Him without any of the reservations you have now. Then you can do it.

Jesus spoke of you: "They are the blind leading the blind. Both shall stumble and fall in the ditch."

Barbarian observes:
And it's not just atheists and agnostics; I'd say that there are about four former YE creationists out there who have come to fully accept God and His creation because of me. Not bad.

If you are leading any YE's to disbelieve in Genesis

Remember, YEs don't believe in Genesis. "Life ex nihilo" is a direct contradiction to God's word in Genesis.

And it gets worse. I will be your judge.

Jesus will judge. You are not God, Tom, as much as you want to be.

Barbarian observes:
Most of the positive rep I get is from theists, but because I'm a Christian, I treat atheists and people of other religions with respect as well. Long as they are respectful and decent here, I treat them that way. And being an orthodox Christian, I know that they aren't necessarily going to hell, so I don't feel the need to be aggressive to get them to believe as I do. Faith should be a net, not a sharp stick.

You are not a Christian.

Fortunately, you aren't in any position to judge what Christians are.

Barbarian observes:
You know, Tom, you have more in common with atheists than I do.
I believe all of Scripture. They don't believe any of it. And you believe only parts of it.

Instead of gathering, you have whittled your faith down into a sharp stick to poke at unbelievers and Christians alike.

Jesus did not make know it all's comfortable.

You're uncomfortable, because deep inside, you know you're on the wrong path, Tom. You know it's wrong to reject any part of scripture, no matter how uncomfortable it makes you.

Put down your pride and accept God on His terms.

 

[some other dude]

Barbarian suggests:
You should try to do small things every day.



Still, He says whether you spend eternity with Him or with the devil depends on how you treat the needy. Set your pride aside and believe Him.

Barbarian observes:
Asking me to catalogue what I do, shows you don't understand. You see, in telling you about the backpack, I already got my reward here. When you do for others without thinking of your reward, then you're on the right track, Tom.



Jesus says he saves those who feed the hungry. I can believe you, or I can believe God.

Barbarian observes:
About every other year on the net, someone tells me that I convinced them that Christians have gotten a bad rap, and sometimes, they become believers. I don't keep notches, but some of the notes they've sent me are among my fondest possessions. I have a couple from people here.



You can't, Tom. First, you've got to accept Him without any of the reservations you have now. Then you can do it.

Jesus spoke of you: "They are the blind leading the blind. Both shall stumble and fall in the ditch."

Barbarian observes:
And it's not just atheists and agnostics; I'd say that there are about four former YE creationists out there who have come to fully accept God and His creation because of me. Not bad.



Remember, YEs don't believe in Genesis. "Life ex nihilo" is a direct contradiction to God's word in Genesis.



Jesus will judge. You are not God, Tom, as much as you want to be.

Barbarian observes:
Most of the positive rep I get is from theists, but because I'm a Christian, I treat atheists and people of other religions with respect as well. Long as they are respectful and decent here, I treat them that way. And being an orthodox Christian, I know that they aren't necessarily going to hell, so I don't feel the need to be aggressive to get them to believe as I do. Faith should be a net, not a sharp stick.



Fortunately, you aren't in any position to judge what Christians are.

Barbarian observes:
You know, Tom, you have more in common with atheists than I do.
I believe all of Scripture. They don't believe any of it. And you believe only parts of it.

Instead of gathering, you have whittled your faith down into a sharp stick to poke at unbelievers and Christians alike.



You're uncomfortable, because deep inside, you know you're on the wrong path, Tom. You know it's wrong to reject any part of scripture, no matter how uncomfortable it makes you.

Put down your pride and accept God on His terms.

I was going to respond to this, but then I remembered.

This is all just a game to barbie.

 

[Arthur Brain]

If you volunteer at a food pantry, you are violating Paul's admonition: "He who does not work should not eat." Hunger is a great motivation to work. But you, as a nicer than God person, takes away that motivation.

Are you serious? So we should just ignore those on the streets or down on their luck by depriving them of a meal? Do you think Paul was addressing the world in general when he said that or specific communities at that particular time? Newsflash Tom, not everyone who goes hungry is in that position because of an unwillingness to work, and as I also recall Jesus had some things to say about feeding the hungry, clothing the needy etc.

lain:

 

[some other dude]

Tom, do yourself a favor and don't get in a discussion with this fruitcake. If you do, he'll be spewing invective at you in three posts. He has no self control.

 

[The Barbarian]

as I also recall Jesus had some things to say about feeding the hungry, clothing the needy etc.

Yep:

Matthew 25:32 And all nations shall be gathered together before him, and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats: [33] And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. [34] Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. [35] For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink; I was a stranger, and you took me in:

But Tom is "uncomfortable" with that one, because it goes on:

41 Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. [42] For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. [43] I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. [44] Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? [45] Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.

[46] And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

 

[TeeJay]

=Arthur Brain;2769813]Are you serious? So we should just ignore those on the streets or down on their luck by depriving them of a meal? Do you think Paul was addressing the world in general when he said that or specific communities at that particular time? Newsflash Tom, not everyone who goes hungry is in that position because of an unwillingness to work, and as I also recall Jesus had some things to say about feeding the hungry, clothing the needy etc.

lain:

AB, go into a city near you. Walk up to a street person and offer him a job. Then get back to me.

Tom

 

[Arthur Brain]

AB, go into a city near you. Walk up to a street person and offer him a job. Then get back to me.

Tom

I'm in no position to offer anyone a job Tom. Thanks to the recession I lost my own as did a lot of other people. What I did do on occasion was give homeless people something to eat and drink. Do I deserve 'admonishing' for that? Please also answer the question regarding who Paul was addressing and what Jesus had to say.

 

[TeeJay]

=The Barbarian;2769832]Yep:

Matthew 25:32 And all nations shall be gathered together before him, and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats: [33] And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. [34] Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. [35] For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink; I was a stranger, and you took me in:

But Tom is "uncomfortable" with that one, because it goes on:

41 Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. [42] For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. [43] I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. [44] Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? [45] Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.

[46] And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

Barb. Jesus is talking to Jews. Peter is not your apostle, you silly man! Paul, the "apostle to the Gentiles," is your apostle. Unless you accept Jesus' free gift of salvation (Rom. 10:9-10) you are going to hell (not Purgatory). Purgatory does not exist. I am going to have to let you go to Hell.

Would you do me a favor? Get your Bible, if you have one, and tear out all of Paul's epistles.

Tom

 

[TeeJay]

=Arthur Brain;2769952]I'm in no position to offer anyone a job Tom. Thanks to the recession I lost my own as did a lot of other people. What I did do on occasion was give homeless people something to eat and drink. Do I deserve 'admonishing' for that? Please also answer the question regarding who Paul was addressing and what Jesus had to say.

AB, it does not matter. None you ask will accept a job.

But nicer than God Christians give them money. They immediately go and buy a cheap bottle of wine and drink it. They then pass out and vomit all over themselves. I, as a law enforcement officer, then had to take them to jail. When I had to handle these smelly creatures, I noticed that the nicer than God Christians were never around to help.

Tom

Tom

 

[Arthur Brain]

AB, it does not matter. None you ask will accept a job.

How do you know that Tom? Are you the judge and arbiter of why every person who is in the position of not having a roof over their head, or what they would do if offered such? Let me answer that for you Tom. You ain't. I guess Lazarus wouldn't have had any crumbs from your table as well right? lain:

But nicer than God Christians give them money. They immediately go and buy a cheap bottle of wine and drink it. They then pass out and vomit all over themselves. I, as a law enforcement officer, then had to take them to jail. When I had to handle these smelly creatures, I noticed that the nicer than God Christians were never around to help.
Tom

These "smelly creatures"? Those are your human neighbours Tom. How nice it must be to sit on that moral high horse and pass judgement on everyone who isn't in employment or without a home. Tell me Tom, just who was Jesus referring to with regards to the hungry and thirsty etc if it wasn't those in need? I notice you give no answer to that, nor who Paul was addressing also.

Do I also deserve admonishing for giving a homeless person a meal? Did that make me 'nicer than God'?

lain:

 

[The Barbarian]

Matthew 25:32 And all nations shall be gathered together before him, and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats: [33] And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. [34] Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. [35] For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink; I was a stranger, and you took me in:

But Tom is "uncomfortable" with that one, because it goes on:

41 Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. [42] For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. [43] I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. [44] Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? [45] Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.

[46] And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

Barb. Jesus is talking to Jews.

Hell is crowded with people who said "Oh He doesn't mean me." Unfortunately for you, it doesn't say anything about being just for Jews. That's just a story you tell yourself so you can pretend you're right with God anyway. You have made a god of Paul, and have turned your back on Jesus.

 

[The Barbarian]

Do I also deserve admonishing for giving a homeless person a meal? Did that make me 'nicer than God'?

I notice that God expects us to do for those people who are in want. Nowhere does He say that if someone is at a bad pass because of his own bad judgement, we are to ignore their need.

For a good reason. What we do for others is not just for them. It's for us, too.

 

[some other dude]

Isn't it interesting Tom, that barbie and artie seem to find a verse in there that says "For I was hungry, and you gave me some cash for booze and walked on feeling smugly superior" ?

 

[Arthur Brain]

I notice that God expects us to do for those people who are in want. Nowhere does He say that if someone is at a bad pass because of his own bad judgement, we are to ignore their need.

For a good reason. What we do for others is not just for them. It's for us, too.

Exactly. It's so easy to look down on people and 'justify' why they 'deserve' their fate in life, but then again judging folk is easier than charity anyway. The 'Rich man' seemed to think so.....

lain:

 

[The Barbarian]

Exactly. It's so easy to look down on people and 'justify' why they 'deserve' their fate in life, but then again judging folk is easier than charity anyway. The 'Rich man' seemed to think so.....

And how sad to think that anyone would suppose that charity is only provided by people who want to "feel smugly superior."

One is reminded of C.S. Lewis, and his depiction of the devil as put out at God, because he thinks God is hiding ulterior motives for redeeming mankind.

 

[Stripe]

Isn't it interesting Tom, that barbie and artie seem to find a verse in there that says "For I was hungry, and you gave me some cash for booze and walked on feeling smugly superior" ?

These two morons can twist anything away from the actual meaning. Aren't we talking about telescopes?

Salvation is based on faith and grace. No matter how much money you give to the poor, your salvation will not be affected. Yet we might be able to find evidence that you are saved from your treatment of the poor.

 

[The Barbarian]

Salvation is based on faith and grace. No matter how much money you give to the poor, your salvation will not be affected. Yet we might be able to find evidence that you are saved from your treatment of the poor.

Jesus says otherwise. He says whether or not you help the unfortunate will determine whether you spend eternity with Him or with the devil.

I think you should believe Him.

 

[Arthur Brain]

These two morons can twist anything away from the actual meaning. Aren't we talking about telescopes?

Salvation is based on faith and grace. No matter how much money you give to the poor, your salvation will not be affected. Yet we might be able to find evidence that you are saved from your treatment of the poor.

What was being 'twisted' exactly? :AMR:

 

[Arthur Brain]

And how sad to think that anyone would suppose that charity is only provided by people who want to "feel smugly superior."

One is reminded of C.S. Lewis, and his depiction of the devil as put out at God, because he thinks God is hiding ulterior motives for redeeming mankind.

Exactly. I've never donated anything out of a feeling of smugness to those lesser off. Just another typical SOD "soundbite"...

lain:

 

[TeeJay]

=Arthur Brain;2770881]How do you know that Tom? Are you the judge and arbiter of why every person who is in the position of not having a roof over their head, or what they would do if offered such? Let me answer that for you Tom. You ain't. I guess Lazarus wouldn't have had any crumbs from your table as well right? lain:

Yes, I am their judge. And no Lazarus would get food from my talbe if he was willing to work.

These "smelly creatures"? Those are your human neighbours Tom. How nice it must be to sit on that moral high horse and pass judgement on everyone who isn't in employment or without a home. Tell me Tom, just who was Jesus referring to with regards to the hungry and thirsty etc if it wasn't those in need? I notice you give no answer to that, nor who Paul was addressing also.

If you believe this, go get one and take him home. And you may not have noticed, but you are judging me for judging. I think Jesus called that hypocritical.

Do I also deserve admonishing for giving a homeless person a meal? Did that make me 'nicer than God'?

lain:

Yes.

Tom