In the twinkling of an eye

[genuineoriginal]

I think of the Bible as an overall effort of a single Author that knows to include legends for its own terms and symbols. So as He guided Paul he would also know to include the necessary reference to specific trumpets before or after in the canon. We are given the enumerated trumps in reference to Christ's return in Revelation, and since Paul speaks of Christ's return and the last trump it isn't a difficult fit.

But even if Exodus 19:16 was the "first trump" of God (which is a pretty loose definition of a trumpet) it certainly doesn't mean that the the last trump should come before other trumps (or else the designation of "last" becomes meaningless.)

All the qualifiers of the trump are important.
For the last trump of God, the qualifiers are last and God.
The last trump of God can be followed by other trumps that are not trumps of God without changing the last trump of God to something other than the last trump of God.

 

[genuineoriginal]

And just why would I want to answer a guy that uses the Bible as a word search puzzle and thinks that words have the IDENTICAL meaning everywhere they're found?

Your dispensational eschatology has been checked against the Bible and found to be a lie.

 

[Right Divider]

Your dispensational eschatology has been checked against the Bible and found to be a lie.

You are consistently wrong.

 

[genuineoriginal]

You are consistently wrong.

You show a remarkable talent for not seeing the truth.

 

[Right Divider]

You show a remarkable talent for not seeing the truth.

You are still consistently wrong.

 

[genuineoriginal]

You are still consistently wrong.

Keep telling yourself that to justify your blindness.

 

[Right Divider]

Keep telling yourself that to justify your blindness.

I see fine.

 

[Rosenritter]

Rude? LOL

The over-sensitive one has spoken again! K:

The catching away that Paul speaks about is clear. I don't know why it gives you such heartburn. There are several other catching away's in the Bible.... can you find them?

When someone refuses to answer a simple question after multiple restatements, it is pretty good evidence that they are insincere and are trying to avoid getting trapped against the sticky contradiction spikes that will not bend because of their own ego. So persist in your chest-pounding Mr. Kong... carry on. I'll try not to upset your nest any further.

 

[Rosenritter]

Which is exactly why I didn't answer it.

I think it's more of a proof that Dispensationalism produces stupid people.

 

[JudgeRightly]

When someone refuses to answer a simple question after multiple restatements, it is pretty good evidence that they are insincere and are trying to avoid getting trapped against the sticky contradiction spikes that will not bend because of their own ego. So persist in your chest-pounding Mr. Kong... carry on. I'll try not to upset your nest any further.

:think:

You seem incapable of grasping the concept of paradigms.

You might as well be asking whether the pre-trip rapture doctrine can stand alone, apart from the bible.

Can circles stand alone, apart from curves?

Can money stand alone, apart from economics?

Can electronics stand alone, apart from electricity?

Can the truth stand alone, apart from reality?

It's a stupid question! Or else it's a question designed to separate a debate opponent from his own premise and cause him tacitly to adopt yours.

(He will think I've answered his question with a "Yes".)

 

[Rosenritter]

All the qualifiers of the trump are important.
For the last trump of God, the qualifiers are last and God.
The last trump of God can be followed by other trumps that are not trumps of God without changing the last trump of God to something other than the last trump of God.

And wouldn't the angels that sound that herald the return of the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords (God) be the trump of God? Whom are the angels sounding the trumpets for? At whose command and for what power?

Revelation 8:2 KJV
(2) And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 KJV
(16) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Revelation 20:5 KJV
(5) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

The first resurrection seems to include the items that went before, which includes the final Armageddon and the sealing of the devil in chapter 19 and the beginning of chapter 20.

But for all this, I cannot seem to remember there being a specification of "the last trump of God" in any passage. It simply says "the last trump." We only know from another passage that this "last trump" is a "trump of God." So this would mean that "the last trump" is not followed by other trumps, merely that "the last trump" is also a "trump of God."

 

[Rosenritter]

I see fine.

John 9:41 KJV
(41) Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

 

[ok doser]

When someone refuses to answer a simple question ...

i'll give it a try


ask your simple question

 

[JudgeRightly]

John 9:41 KJV
(41) Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

Once again, taking things out of context.

Why am I not surprised...

 

[genuineoriginal]

I think it's more of a proof that Dispensationalism produces stupid people.

Dispensationalism does not produce stupid people.

Dispensationalism is a highly published theology, it is taught as if it was truth in Bible Seminaries, and believing in Dispensationalism is as much of a sign of true Christianity in Evengelical Christian churches as believing in the Trinity.

It is a good thing that salvation does not depend on a belief in Dispensationalism.

 

[Right Divider]

When someone refuses to answer a simple question after multiple restatements, it is pretty good evidence that they are insincere and are trying to avoid getting trapped against the sticky contradiction spikes that will not bend because of their own ego. So persist in your chest-pounding Mr. Kong... carry on. I'll try not to upset your nest any further.

No, they are simply avoiding your loaded questions.

 

[Right Divider]

I think it's more of a proof that Dispensationalism produces stupid people.

A false accusation from a confused straw-man beater.

 

[Right Divider]

John 9:41 KJV
(41) Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

I never claimed to be sinless, you loser.

 

[Rosenritter]

i'll give it a try

ask your simple question

In the context of defining "Rapture" as "being caught away from the earth some time (years) before Jesus returns as Lord of Lords" is [pre-tribulation] Rapture Theory separable from what is being called "Dispensationalism" in these forums? Meaning,

a) Can one believe in Pre-Tribulation Rapture Theory without accepting Dispensationalism?
b) Can one believe in Dispensationalism without believing in Pre-Tribulation Rapture theory?
c) Are these two concepts (beliefs) linked or depending on one another that they cannot be logically separated?

I didn't think that this should be an offensive question at the time, but if it is offensive can you please explain why?

 

[Rosenritter]

Dispensationalism does not produce stupid people.

Dispensationalism is a highly published theology, it is taught as if it was truth in Bible Seminaries, and believing in Dispensationalism is as much of a sign of true Christianity in Evengelical Christian churches as believing in the Trinity.

It is a good thing that salvation does not depend on a belief in Dispensationalism.

I didn't mean "stupid" as in low intelligence but rather in the ego-driven sense but regardless, that was a callous remark made in frustration. I was hoping it would spur someone to want to disprove the stereotype (and I think OK Doser might be willing to help.)