Historically He gave them all and for a specific reason. Once the reason was performed then there was no further need.
ECT As many people doubt the scripture regarding speaking in tongues:
- Thread starter oatmeal
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Historically He gave them all and for a specific reason. Once the reason was performed then there was no further need.
No more need you say?
1Co 12:1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
1Co 12:2 Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.
1Co 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
1Co 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1Co 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
1Co 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1Co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
1Co 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
1Co 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
1Co 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
1Co 12:14 For the body is not one member, but many.
1Co 12:15 If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?
1Co 12:16 And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?
1Co 12:17 If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling?
1Co 12:18 But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.
1Co 12:19 And if they were all one member, where were the body?
1Co 12:20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.
1Co 12:21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.
1Co 12:22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary:
1Co 12:23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.
1Co 12:24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked:
1Co 12:25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.
1Co 12:26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it.
1Co 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
1Co 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
1Co 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
1Co 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
1Co 12:31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.
Eph 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Eph 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
Eph 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Rom 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
Rom 12:4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
Rom 12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Rom 12:6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
Rom 12:7 Or ministry, let us wait on our ministering: or he that teacheth, on teaching;
Rom 12:8 Or he that exhorteth, on exhortation: he that giveth, let him do it with simplicity; he that ruleth, with diligence; he that sheweth mercy, with cheerfulness.
Rom 12:9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
Rom 12:10 Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;
Rom 12:11 Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;
Rom 12:12 Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
Rom 12:13 Distributing to the necessity of saints; given to hospitality.
Rom 12:14 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
Rom 12:15 Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
Rom 12:16 Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
Rom 12:17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
Rom 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
Rom 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
Rom 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
Rom 12:21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
LA
oatmeal
Well-known member
So, you do not have a scripture that refers to speaking in tongues as a gift.
It is a manifestation of the gift of holy spirit. See I Corinthians 12:7-11
oatmeal
Well-known member
of course, that's why I can't judge, all things are possible for those that believe Pilippians 4:13 KJV - anyone can play the "card" - YOU DON"T BELIEVE - that's not what scripture says about the gifts (see DAN P posts) so i have reason to doubt and question. i certainly wouldn't base my faith on the gift of 'tongues', especially since it goes against scripture -atrol:
The common error of calling the nine manifestations of spirit gifts is one reason for the great deal of confusion on this subject.
The nine listed in I Corinthians 12:7-11 are not gifts they are ways to manifest the gift of holy spirit.
Since all believers have the gift of holy spirit, they also have the God given ability to manifest the spirit.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Speaking in tongues is speaking in tongues regardless of who is doing it, or when or in whatever circumstances.
Take for instance, God's design for man and woman or more specifically, husband and wife. Sexual intercourse is for husband and wife only, in private, not in public.
Sex is sex whether done in some porn film or out in the street or wherever a couple might disgrace themselves.
God's design is very good, but people's misuse of it does not negate the very goodness of God's design and intent for it.
As for your interpretation challenge, of course, you ten "interpreters" would have ten different interpretations. They do not understand that the one speaking in tongues, the same one is the one to interpret. I Corinthians 14:27-28,13
The Corinthians were making the same ignorant error.
They confused interpretation with the prophecy. Your ten "interpreters" would not be interpreting, they would be giving their own word of prophecy
If you really wanted to dig deep into God's instructions on the use of the manifestations, rather than all the private and pretty much ungodly private intepretations of those scriptures, you should read the book, study the book, "receiving the holy spirit" by VP Wierwille, who spent decades on the subject.
Until you read the book that clarifies all these issues according to God's instructions, you simply won't get it.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Acts 2 is the only place in scripture that speaking in tongues was done publicly and some understood some of that which was being spoken.
That record, as some have erroneously concluded, is not an indication that speaking in tongues is a way of preaching.
Cross Reference
New member
A modern day Simon the sorcerer, of sorts. I suspected as much by your many attempts at promoting your falseness.
Thanks for confirming the obvious.
When you distinguish an opinion from an observation, let me know. Tongues is part of Pentecostal 'worship,' and that's my observation, your opinion.
John 4:24 KJV "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit AND IN TRUTH."
Since you didn't render specifically who Paul was referring to in Romans 9:6, 7, 8, 9, 10... I suppose that was a bit of a tongue-twister for you? How about a little Bible-speak, instead of babble-speak, as evidence the Holy Ghost resides within? So, what's the TRUTH, explicit truth, in those verses, Andy? Even Pilot knew the truth (John 18:38 KJV) before Paul arrived, when Pilot wrote "THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS" (Matthew 27:37 KJV), disputed by... who exactly were they who instigated His crucifixion (John 8:33 KJV, John 8:37 KJV)? Sinners? THAT's speaking in tongues.
Or, is TRUTH not a component of Pentecaustic worship anymore, since Pentecostals allegedly have the spirit? Don't we "worship him in spirit AND IN TRUTH"? Two separate concepts, yet inseparable: SPIRIT + TRUTH. Pentecostals seem to get a little tongue-tied when it comes to speaking TRUTH. You can allegedly interpret one another, claiming Paul spoke in tongues, but can't 'interpret' explicitly who Paul was referring to in Romans??? You guys think you have the spirit with your tongue flailings... then flail out the interpretation those words Paul spoke in tongues in Romans 9:6, 7, 8, 9, 10. Cat got your tongue?
Pilot said Jesus was the "King of the JEWS" (Mark 15:10 KJV). But those who instigated the crucifixion" (John 8:37 KJV, Mark 15:10, 11, KJV) took Jesus to task: "Let Christ the king of ISRAEL descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe" (Mark 15:31, 32). Did you 'hear' that subtle distinction, Andy? Pilot said Jesus was king of the Jews, while those instigating His crucifixion said Jesus was the king of Israel. Did you catch that distinction? Think that Jew-Israel might have a little bearing on who Paul was specifically distinguishing saying "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel" (Romans 6, 7, 8, 9, 10)? When you get over yourself... do you hear any connection with Revelation 2:9, 3:9?
Quite frankly... Pilot knew Jesus better than most Christians walking the street, including self-exalting tongue speakers. So, put your money where your mouth is, Andy... render Romans 9:6, 7, 8, 9, 10 as Paul spoke in tongues. Meanwhile... I await Oatmeal's rendering as evidence.
kayaker
"I speak in tongues as instructed in scripture."-you
Shuck your translators, then.
I thought so. Fraud.
Raise the dead, drink anti freeze, and tells about it, "as instructed in scripture," "all scripture is written specifically to me, is about me, is for my obedience, and is applicable for all time" charlatan.
Watch the dodge ball, spin, deceitful response, as usual...Watch...
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Otis Campbell, the Great, could do it.
And give oatmush a leg of lamb, right across his wolf choppers.
i admit, i was "conditioned" to not openly question or doubt "tongues", i haven't, mostly out of politeness, respect, reverence etc. and i do not say it's impossible. i don't have family or friends, that can or will discuss these things. i know it's hard to walk up to strangers and talk in detail about Jesus Christ, or any Bible subject for that matter. and many self-proclaimed Christians "already know" everything. i could have searched this out years ago, should have. MAD is helping me see the whole Truth and they don't get paid, they don't have a church in every neighborhood, (although they should); just the Truth - for free - atrol:
atrol:
oatmeal
Well-known member
Yes, there are many tales out there and on this website
Lots of opinion but topics like this thread, very little scripture
oatmeal
Well-known member
musterion
Well-known member
oatmeal
Well-known member
And those that dismiss speaking in tongues, etc are among them
oatmeal
Well-known member
And your evidence for that is what?
oatmeal
Well-known member
Well, maybe you should reread your post:
So either you are stupid and careless or you are a liar, or what?
You don't understand your own posts?
oatmeal
Well-known member
Since you seem to be promoting a lot of stuff, why aren't you doing it?