Quote Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
To my knowledge, that's the only religion [Islam] that tosses sexually confused men, women and children off of roofs.
Again, Why do you feel the need to belittle my point by comparing what I'm saying to Islam? I don't believe in Islam, et al. I am a Christian who promotes the Bible. What I am saying comes from the Bible, not from the Quran.
You promote the civil law punishments (some it appears, not all) that were given to Israel in the Old Testament, which are no longer applicable under the New Covenant. Like Islam, there is no room for repentance in your world. Don't take my word for it, read what you wrote below:
In a righteous society, as long as the criminals were executed swiftly and painfully, it wouldn't matter how they were executed. There wouldn't be any need to restrict or prohibit such punishments.
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
I've told you numerous times to study up on Jewish civil, ceremonial and moral laws.
And I've told you that I agree that there are differences between the ceremonial/symbolic laws that were meant only for Israel and the moral laws that apply to everyone.
Question: Are all civil laws meant for only Israel? Are all civil laws meant for everyone? or are there some that are meant for one and not the other?
You're confusing God's universal moral code with ancient Israel's civil laws, which stoned adulterers and homosexuals to death.
However, do you think that all civil laws given in the Bible were ONLY for Israel? Or could some of them be applied elsewhere?
They can be applied, but the civil laws that we're talking about were only for theocratic Israel, so they're not mandated by the Bible.
So tell me: Should a 12 year old boy who was sexually molested as a young boy and because of that contracted homosexual desires be executed?
Quote: Originally posted by aCultureWarrior
and stop the LGBTQueer movement and agenda dead it it's tracks, while still giving individuals an opportunity to repent. Just think of all of the good people who have left homosexuality and transgenderism behind that wouldn't be around to help others if you had your way:
The Bible shows us the best way to bring people to repentance. It's to use the Law against them.
Hence the title of this now 4 part thread. However, enforcing righteous laws and
"swift and painful execution" are two different things.
The Bible also shows us the ratio of people who will repent when faced with their own mortality. It's about 50%. What do you think the ratio of people who get saved from being locked away in a prison is compared to how many reject God?
I would imagine it's not very high, certainly not higher than 50%.
Prison ministries have helped many a lost soul.
So which method would you rather use? Death penalty for convicted criminals who committed capital crimes? Or prisons, which aren't guaranteed to bring very many people to God?
Except homosexuality in and of itself isn't a capital crime, unless...(drum roll)
you live in a Muslim nation, or are going by theocratic Israel Old Testament civil laws.
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aCW, I'd still like an answer to these questions. If you would, please.
QUOTE=JudgeRightly;4963984
So in order for you to make your views of the issue look better than mine you compare my position to Islam?
To my knowledge, that's the only religion that tosses sexually confused men, women and children off of roofs (it's "swift", but probably not as "painful" as you'd like).
Who was Jesus sent to to minister to? The Jews? Or the world?
The world, which has nothing to do with Jewish theocratic civil laws and the punishment of sexual sinners.
Did Jesus abolish the 10 commandments and the rest of the Law? Did He abolish some of them? Or did He say He did not come to abolish the Law, but to fulfill it?
Universal moral laws are applicable until the end of time.
Is the Law a tool of the wicked? Or a tool of the righteous, to be used as a tutor to bring the unsaved to Christ?
Look at the title of this 4 part thread again.
The law is good for the lawless. But it is not good for those who are freed from the law.
Who is promoting lawlessness here? Me? Or Dante and the homos? What did God say about men who lay with men? Did God change his mind about this in the Bible ever?
Once again: You're confusing God's universal moral code with the punishment that theocratic Israel used against homosexuals and adulterers, which is not mandated in the New Testament.
Hopefully this article will help:
What Does the Bible Say About the Old Testament Law?
Conclusion
The teachings of Jesus, the Council of Jerusalem, and other New Testament teachings (John 1:16-17, Acts 13:39, Romans 2:25-29, 8:1-4, 1*Corinthians 9:19-21, Galatians 2:15-16, Ephesians 2:15) make it clear that Christians are not required to follow the Old Testament rules about
crimes and punishments, warfare, slavery, diet, circumcision, animal sacrifices, feast days, Sabbath observance, ritual cleanness, etc.
Christians still look to the Old Testament scripture for moral and spiritual guidance (2*Timothy 3:16-17). But when there seems to be a conflict between Old Testament laws and New Testament principles, we must follow the New Testament because it represents the most recent and most perfect revelation from God (Hebrews 8:13, 2*Corinthians 3:1-18, Galatians 2:15-20).
However, freedom from the Old Testament Law is not a license for Christians to relax their moral standards. The moral and ethical teachings of Jesus and His apostles call for even greater self-discipline than those of the Old Testament (Matthew 5:21-22, 27-28, 31-32, 33-34, 38-42, 43-48, 7:1-5, 15:18-19, 25:37-40, Mark 7:21-23, 12:28-31, Luke 12:15, 1*Corinthians 13:1-13, Galatians 5:19-21, James 1:27, 2:15-16, 1*John 3:17-19).
Here are a few examples of Old Testament laws that Christians generally do not observe:
The death penalty for:
Attacking or cursing a parent (Exodus 21:15,17)
Disobedience to parents (Deuteronomy 21:18-21)
Failure to confine a dangerous animal, resulting in death (Exodus 21:28-29)
Witchcraft and sorcery (Exodus 22:18, Leviticus 20:27, Deuteronomy 13:5, 1*Samuel 28:9)
Sex with an animal (Exodus 22:19, Leviticus 20:16)
Doing work on the Sabbath (Exodus 31:14, 35:2, Numbers 15:32-36)
Incest (Leviticus 18:6-18, 20:11-12,14,17,19-21)
Adultery (Leviticus 20:10; Deuteronomy 22:22)
Homosexual acts (Leviticus 20:13)
Blasphemy (Leviticus 24:14,16, 23)
False prophecy (Deuteronomy 18:20)
False claim of a woman's virginity at time of marriage (Deuteronomy 22:13-21)
Sex between a woman pledged to be married and a man other than her betrothed (Deuteronomy 22:23-24)
http://www.christianbiblereference.org/faq_OldTestamentLaw.htm
Thoughts?
