The Word Made Flesh
- Thread starter Word
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Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant and coming in the likeness of men. (Philippians 2:5-7)
In the two verses that use the word "form" we see that Christ was in the "form" of God and that he took the "form" of a servant.
According to your theory Christ being in the form of God did not make him God and being in the form of a servant did not make him a servant.
The problem? The problem is Jesus asked, "For who is greater, he who sits at the table, or he who serves? Is it not he who sits at the table? Yet I am among you as the One who serves." (Luke 22:27)
Your claim contradicts Jesus' plain statement.
After that, He appeared in another form to two of them as they walked and went into the country. (Mark 16:12)
Since Christ appeared in a different "form" you would claim that he was no longer Christ, right?
And again you would be wrong.
Derf
Well-known member
Don't forget to include in your logical determinations:
[Jhn 10:17 KJV] Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.
[Jhn 10:18 KJV] No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
You're saying if he was "really" dead, he didn't have the power to raise himself. But he said he had that power. The Jews didn't think it was possible either:
[Jhn 10:20 KJV] And many of them said, He hath a devil, and is mad; why hear ye him?
If Jesus said he had that power, and you say he didn't--what does that make you?
If Jesus said he had that power, and he really didn't--what does that make him?
Young's has a better translation of verse 18: "no one doth take it from me, but I lay it down of myself; authority I have to lay it down, and authority I have again to take it; this command I received from my Father."
The word "power" is translated from two different Greek words. There is dunamis used in Acts 1:8 and there is exousia used in John 10:18.
Jesus had authority from the Father to lay down his life and had faith in the Father's authority to restore him.
keypurr
Well-known member
Logically speaking, his God raised him. I am aware of the verses in question.
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Derf
Well-known member
I'm not sure "authority" changes the gist of the passage. But adding "faith in the Father's" is certainly more than the passage states.
Derf
Well-known member
Is that your logic or his? His made people think he was mad, so it would probably seem illogical to us. Maybe that's just because of the raising from the dead and not the doing of it himself. But the point is that the statements he was making didn't fit with the logic of the time, nor our own logic, really, since "logically" people don't rise from the dead today any more than they did back then.
Paul explained, "But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you." (Romans 8:11)
keypurr
Well-known member
It was not Jesus that appeared in different forms, it was the spirit son, the express image. You do not understand that. That spirit was given the power of God yet was not God. God is a title, a position. The most high created his exact image, but it is just an image, not the most high.
keypurr
Well-known member
I question the translation errors not the Words of Jesus. If Jesus died he would not know what was going on, for the dead know nothing. Using human logic any one with half a mind would question what is expressed in the conflicting verses. I do not put my trust in using the KJV only.
keypurr
Well-known member
You might consider this thought, Christ, the spirit son, spoke through Jesus. On the cross did That spirit go back to God when the flesh died? If so, all the verses in question would be correct and there would be no conflict. Certainly something to consider.
I don't know of anyone who claims the Son of God is the Most High.
keypurr
Well-known member
You missed the point friend.
Example: Joe is the President, he had a son. The son is NOT the President.
God had a son, the son is not God.
There are a few who are listed as gods but non is greater than the creator, even Christ.
keypurr
Well-known member
I disagree BR, your faith is in the church. You believe what they tell you. And that is only part of the story of God and his Christ. I left the church because there is a lack of evidence for their doctrines. 90% of the Protestant doctrines come from the RCC. And they are lies.
Lon
Well-known member
Cross Reference
New member
And I don't know any Christian who believes Jesus was a created being.
The word "president" is a singular noun. The word "god" is translated from the Hebrew elohim which is a plural noun.
The word "fish" can be singular or plural depending on the context. The word "god" can be singular or plural depending on the context.
Humans reproduce after their kind and God reproduces after his kind. You must be born again, not of woman but of the Spirit.
You shall have no other gods before Me. (Exodus 20:3)
The word "gods" is plural in the Hebrew and translated plural in English.
There is one God and he is a family since he has children, the children of God. (Romans 8:16)
Derf
Well-known member
That's an interesting thought. [Ecc 12:7 KJV] Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Does that mean
- That the "spirit", once given, remains a separate entity at death, and is in the presence of God?
- Or is the "spirit" a part of God at the first, is given in measure to enliven the flesh temporarily, then becomes part of God again?
- Or perhaps the "spirit" is authority/power to live, which God takes away when life ceases?
I lean toward either the second or third option, at least for that verse's meaning, since the first implies that all people, once dead, are in the presence of God as spirits. But I don't think any of the above applied the same to Jesus as they would to us. The last one could apply if Jesus is God, because that authority/power is retracted from the body, but not from Jesus (in whatever form he was after his human body died) as God.