THE ANGEL of YHWH appeared to Moses out of the burning bush - Exodus 3

[daqq]

The key to understanding the supernatural image of God is knowing that it has a special name. In KJE it is LORD. God is an eternal spirit ... but the LORD God is the invisible God becoming visible.

So by default you are simply proclaiming the oneness doctrine because in KJE, "LORD", in all caps is the Father YHWH. By default then your "key to understanding" simply replaces the Father with the Son. Yeehaw, (no thanks) . . . :yawn: :chuckle:

 

[beameup]

for if ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins

 

[Zeke]

for if ye believe not that I AM, ye shall die in your sins

What about all that reconciliation of the world and the desire that all men be saved? plus you are dead to you're divine nature until the law does its Job and kills the carnal strong hold which is mostly programming through religious/cultural deception that passes down through generational brain washing, Luke 15:45, Galatians 4:20-28, the observational fraud Luke 17:20-21 ingrained in you're mind is the falling away promoted by ego and fear that trick the emotions into wearing that veil 2Cor 3:6, been there done that.

 

[Ben Masada]

And THE ANGEL of the LORD appeared unto him [Moses] in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed. And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt. And when YHWH saw that he turned aside to see, GOD called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I. And HE said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is HOLY GROUND. Moreover he said, I AM THE God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God. - Exodus 3:2-5. *now daqq will tread on this quote from God's Word with some cultish nonsense.

Yes, indeed the angel of the Lord did appear unto Moses in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush but... in a dream... or was it a vision? Either way, Moses was tending the flocks of his father-in-Law Jethro, the Medianite in the desert and time had come to take the sheep to the well at the foot of Horeb and water them. The day was hot and Moses was tired. He found a place to sit down while the flocks drank and slumbered thinking about the fate of his People in Egypt. That's when he had a vision of the angel of the Lord from the burning bush. That was expected to happen because Moses had somehow been cut out to be the greatest of the Prophets in Israel and, the Lord said, "When a prophet of the Lord arises among you, I'll make Myself known to him in a vision; I'll speak with him in a dream." (Numbers 12:6) That's what happened between Moses and the burning bush. The first dream/vision of Moses as a Prophet.

 

[Apple7]

As already said to beameup in the quote posted above herein: because you do not believe the Testimony of Yeshua you also appear to serve a god of war and physical bloodshed and murder; and it is revealed in your carnal understanding of the Torah and the Prophets when you say, "This is why we see God wholesale slaughtering the ancients who incorrectly worshiped Him". That is only what YOU see when you read the Tanach because you see all things as carnal and physical and therefore you see physical death, murder, and mayhem, and you love to have it so or that God which you see in the machinations of your imagination would not be your God.

Matthew 11:12-13 KJV
12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

All the Prophets and the Torah prophesied until Yohanan. There is no "wholesale slaughtering" of literal physical human beings in the holy and spiritual writings but rather the cutting off of sins and the devil and his children, (which are doctrines). You cannot see it because your heathen land is full of Amorites, Hittites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Evite-Hivites, Jebusites, and Girgashites, seven heathen nations which are seven mountains with seven kings and they are greater and mightier than you. You are to smite them and destroy them; you are to make no covenants or marriages with them; you are to destroy their altars, tear down their images, cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire: but you refuse to do those things and cut off their gods from your midst as the scripture says, (and they will become Legion). :chuckle:

You mean like this…

Yahweh is a Man of war; Yahweh is His name. (Exo 15.3)

 

[daqq]

You mean like this…

Yahweh is a Man of war; Yahweh is His name. (Exo 15.3)

Since you have already explained how you understand that: NO, not like you understand it.
My heavenly Father does not go around physically killing His own creation.
He kills the devils and their doctrines that have infected His creation.
The Testimony of His Son teaches me these things.

 

[Apple7]

Since you have already explained how you understand that: NO, not like you understand it.
My heavenly Father does not go around physically killing His own creation.
He kills the devils and their doctrines that have infected His creation.
The Testimony of His Son teaches me these things.

Exo 15.3 is very clear.

Not only is Yahweh a Man...but He is a Man of war.

Simple.

 

[Apple7]

Yes, indeed the angel of the Lord did appear unto Moses in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush but... in a dream... or was it a vision? Either way, Moses was tending the flocks of his father-in-Law Jethro, the Medianite in the desert and time had come to take the sheep to the well at the foot of Horeb and water them. The day was hot and Moses was tired. He found a place to sit down while the flocks drank and slumbered thinking about the fate of his People in Egypt. That's when he had a vision of the angel of the Lord from the burning bush. That was expected to happen because Moses had somehow been cut out to be the greatest of the Prophets in Israel and, the Lord said, "When a prophet of the Lord arises among you, I'll make Myself known to him in a vision; I'll speak with him in a dream." (Numbers 12:6) That's what happened between Moses and the burning bush. The first dream/vision of Moses as a Prophet.

The term 'dream' is not even a lexical possibility.

This is a fabrication of yours designed as a crutch to use when scripture gets too tough for you...

 

[daqq]

Exo 15.3 is very clear.

Not only is Yahweh a Man...but He is a Man of war.

Simple.

What is very clear is that you see all things through the eyes of man because you savor only the things that be of man. Exodus 15:3 employs not adam, not enosh, but 'iysh, and as for war Paul clearly tells you that we wrestle not against flesh and blood. Your idea of a man of war comes from yourself who sees all things according to the mind and eyes of the carnal physical minded old man nature. Yes, "simple", as you say; but since it is so simple why can you not see it?

 

[Apple7]

What is very clear is that you see all things through the eyes of man because you savor only the things that be of man. Exodus 15:3 employs not adam, not enosh, but 'iysh,

The Hebrew 'ish' literally means 'man'.

Moreover, 'ish' is directly applied to Yahweh.

Pretty clear, and irrefutable.

and as for war Paul clearly tells you that we wrestle not against flesh and blood.

That NT passage is in relation to Satan being bound at The Cross, and henceforth ours is a spiritual battle with demons.

Again...pretty straight forward for any student of scripture...

Your idea of a man of war comes from yourself who sees all things according to the mind and eyes of the carnal physical minded old man nature. Yes, "simple", as you say; but since it is so simple why can you not see it?

Exo 15.3 is a clear one-liner.

It cannot be refuted.

Its in line with Yahweh constantly being referring to as Yahweh of Hosts ('Hosts' literally means armies waging war).

Thus...Yahweh is a God of War.

Get used to it...

 

[daqq]

The Hebrew 'ish' literally means 'man'.

Moreover, 'ish' is directly applied to Yahweh.

Pretty clear, and irrefutable.








That NT passage is in relation to Satan being bound at The Cross, and henceforth ours is a spiritual battle with demons.

Again...pretty straight forward for any student of scripture...





Exo 15.3 is a clear one-liner.

It cannot be refuted.

Its in line with Yahweh constantly being referring to as Yahweh of Hosts ('Hosts' literally means armies waging war).

Thus...Yahweh is a God of War.

Get used to it...

Get used to it? Lol, I will never be going back to the profane imagination of the carnal man.
Besides, if I rebuild what has already been torn down I make myself a transgressor.

 

[Ps82]

So by default you are simply proclaiming the oneness doctrine because in KJE, "LORD", in all caps is the Father YHWH. By default then your "key to understanding" simply replaces the Father with the Son. Yeehaw, (no thanks) . . . :yawn: :chuckle:

Daqq ... You see, I have it figured out.

Simply put ... The one invisible spiritual God created an image for revealing himself tp created beings before the world was. HE then appeared on earth and in heaven with that image (a super-natural sort of image) as the Father LORD.

Yet, HE was also able to manifest the same image again ... but not of some sort of a supernatural essence of LIGHT ... but in the form of flesh and blood. This is why John told us that Jesus was "THAT LIGHT" which is described in the OT by the prophets. Jesus was that same image ... just in flesh this time.

The Christ told people that they rightly called him Lord, but lectured them for calling him Lord but not doing what he told them.

He could rightly be called our Lord Jesus because the Christ bore the same image as the Father. The ONE God gave his ONE image a name ... LORD. Check Genesis for yourself about how God created mankind after the likeness of His Own ONE image (singular form).

So when you read this phrase: The LORD God ... It means the invisible God has appeared within his creation. Jesus was able to claim the things he did about himself because he was God and Lord.

Isaiah 43:11 says (my nouns inside of ()):
"I (the ONE God), even I AM, the LORD; besides Me as (the ONE God with ONE image named LORD) there is no savior.

Jesus the Christ was God appearing as a fleshly LORD. This is why Jesus could say:
John 12:45 He that SEETH ME seeth the ONE who sent me.
John 14:9 He that hath SEEN ME hath SEEN THE FATHER.
John 10:30 - The Father and I are ONE.

Who is the Father? ... He was God seen appearing with His ONE supernatural image, which HE named LORD.
Who is the Son? ... He was God appearing with his image named Lord - but as natural human flesh named Lord as the only Savior of the world.
Who is the Holy Spirit? ... He is the ONE invisible God from whom comes everything created.

They are the ONE God ... the ONE God reveals himself as three personages of the God Head.


Christ, the living WORD of God, who was God and was with God during the creation process, ultimately is the flesh and blood Christ from whom nothing of God's essence was held back!
This was written about Jesus:

John 3:34-36 For he (the Christ) who God hath sent speaketh the WORDS of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto HIM (who is our LORD seen in Flesh)The Father loveth the Son, and hath given ALL THINGS into his hand.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life ...

When it comes to mankind and then the next level of believers ... and our being given the Spirit of God ... Well, we only receive from God the measure of His Spirit that he is willing to give us. We will never be equal to the Christ in our oneness with God ... even though he can join us in oneness by imparting his measure of eternal life unto us so we can dwell with the Father and the Son in the Kingdom that God promises.

1. LORD God the Father
2. LORD God the Son our Savior
3. The invisible Spirit of the ONE God imparted into HIS children by measure.

 

[daqq]

Daqq ... You see, I have it figured out.

Simply put ... The one invisible spiritual God created an image for revealing himself tp created beings before the world was. HE then appeared on earth and in heaven with that image (a super-natural sort of image) as the Father LORD.

Yet, HE was also able to manifest the same image again ... but not of some sort of a supernatural essence of LIGHT ... but in the form of flesh and blood. This is why John told us that Jesus was "THAT LIGHT" which is described in the OT by the prophets. Jesus was that same image ... just in flesh this time.

The Christ told people that they rightly called him Lord, but lectured them for calling him Lord but not doing what he told them.

He could rightly be called our Lord Jesus because the Christ bore the same image as the Father. The ONE God gave his ONE image a name ... LORD. Check Genesis for yourself about how God created mankind after the likeness of His Own ONE image (singular form).

So when you read this phrase: The LORD God ... It means the invisible God has appeared within his creation. Jesus was able to claim the things he did about himself because he was God and Lord.

Isaiah 43:11 says (my nouns inside of ()):
"I (the ONE God), even I AM, the LORD; besides Me as (the ONE God with ONE image named LORD) there is no savior.

Jesus the Christ was God appearing as a fleshly LORD. This is why Jesus could say:
John 12:45 He that SEETH ME seeth the ONE who sent me.
John 14:9 He that hath SEEN ME hath SEEN THE FATHER.
John 10:30 - The Father and I are ONE.

Who is the Father? ... He was God seen appearing with His ONE supernatural image, which HE named LORD.
Who is the Son? ... He was God appearing with his image named Lord - but as natural human flesh named Lord as the only Savior of the world.
Who is the Holy Spirit? ... He is the ONE invisible God from whom comes everything created.





Christ, the living WORD of God, who was God and was with God, is the flesh and blood Christ from whom nothing of God's essence was held back!
This was written about Jesus:

John 3:34-36 For he (the Christ) who God hath sent speaketh the WORDS of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto HIM (who is our LORD seen in Flesh)The Father loveth the Son, and hath given ALL THINGS into his hand.
He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life ...

When it comes to mankind and then the next level of believers ... and our being given the Spirit of God ... Well, we only receive from God the measure of His Spirit that he is willing to give us. We will never be equal to the Christ in our oneness with God ... even though he can join us in oneness by imparting his measure of eternal life unto us so we can dwell with the Father and the Son in the Kingdom that God promises.

1. LORD God the Father
2. LORD God the Son our Savior
3. The invisible Spirit of the ONE God imparted into HIS children by measure.

You say you have it figured out but you must ignore critical statements to believe what you do:

John 1:18
18 No one has ὁράω-seen Elohim at any time: the only begotten Elohim, which is in the bosom of the Father, that one has declared Him.

1 John 4:11
12 No one has θεάομαι-beheld Elohim at any time: if we love one another, Elohim abides in us, and His love is perfected in us:

No one has seen or beheld Elohim at any time.
Neither the Father nor His Son.

 

[Apple7]

You say you have it figured out but you must ignore critical statements to believe what you do:

John 1:18
18 No one has seen Elohim at any time: the only begotten Elohim, which is in the bosom of the Father, that one has declared Him.

A more correct rendering...


θεον ουδεις εωρακεν πωποτε μονογενης θεος ο ων εις τον κολπον του πατρος εκεινος εξηγησατο

Theon oudeis heōraken pōpote monogenēs Theos ho ōn eis ton kolpon tou Patros ekeinos exēgēsato

No one has seen God at any time; but the unique One, Himself God, who is in the bosom of the Father, that One declares Him.

 

[daqq]

A more correct rendering...


θεον ουδεις εωρακεν πωποτε μονογενης θεος ο ων εις τον κολπον του πατρος εκεινος εξηγησατο

Theon oudeis heōraken pōpote monogenēs Theos ho ōn eis ton kolpon tou Patros ekeinos exēgēsato

No one has seen God at any time; but the unique One, Himself God, who is in the bosom of the Father, that One declares Him.

Where do you see "but" and "himself" in the text?
You are adding your own paradigm into the text, (again).

 

[Apple7]

Where do you see "but" and "himself" in the text?
You are adding your own paradigm into the text, (again).

θεον ουδεις εωρακεν πωποτε μονογενης θεος ο ων εις τον κολπον του πατρος εκεινος εξηγησατο

 

[Ps82]

Thanks, daqq, for having this conversation with me.

However, your conclusions of the verses you shared are based upon improper understanding.

Here is what I see to be the truth when interpreting them.


First ... John, the writer of the Book of John, is talking about what John the Baptist taught about who Jesus was.

Second ... I have diagrammed the KJE verse 18 sentence. I can't draw the diagram for you but I think I can explain it. Just watch this grammatical explanation reveal the truth that supports other scripture.
Remember that the writer John is telling us what he knows about Jesus and what John the Baptist had taught.

John 1:18 KJE No man at any time hath seen God, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared HIM.

EXPLANATION:
Subject (No man);
Adverbial prepositional phrase (at any time); explaining when, where, or how about the verb.
Verb (hath seen);
Direct object (GOD)
Appositive: (the only begotten Son) and appositive renames the noun object for clarification purposes
(The Son) (which is in the bosom of the Father, he (John the Baptist) hath declared HIM (our Lord Jesus).

It is so difficult without showing you the diagram ...
Here is how I would interpret the whole sentence:

No man at any time hath (ever) seen God, (as) the begotten Sonwhich is (now as I John write) in the bosom of the Father; (yet) he (John the Baptist) hath declared HIM (unto us.)

This is all true ... Before Jesus arrived no man had ever seen the God manifested as the Son of flesh ... yet John the Baptist told people that he was the Messiah ... the Christ. And at the time John the author wrote his book ... Jesus had gone to be with the Father.

Now for First John 4:12

No man at any time hath seen God (who is the one invisible spiritual Elohiym). If we love one another, God (the invisible Spirit) dwelleth IN US and his love is perfected IN US.

Of course no man has ever seen God the Spirit ... not even when he indwells us.

1.) But men in ancient times did see the ONE God appearing as God the Father in his supernatural state ...

2.) And men finally did see the ONE God appearing as God the Son in a fleshly state in His day.

3.) Leaving the third personage identified as the ONE God to remain invisible.

God is the ONE God who revealed himself as three ... a God Head.
HE is they ... and They are HE... ONE with each other.

 

[daqq]

θεον ουδεις εωρακεν πωποτε μονογενης θεος ο ων εις τον κολπον του πατρος εκεινος εξηγησατο

What you have highlighted in blue does not say anything like what you concocted from your imagination in the previous post which contained your idea of an English rendering; but no doubt you already know that and do not care.

 

[daqq]

Thanks, daqq, for having this conversation with me.

However, your conclusions of the verses you shared are based upon improper understanding.

Here is what I see to be the truth when interpreting them.


First ... John, the writer of the Book of John, is talking about what John the Baptist taught about who Jesus was.

Second ... I have diagrammed the KJE verse 18 sentence. I can't draw the diagram for you but I think I can explain it. Just watch this grammatical explanation reveal the truth that supports other scripture.
Remember that the writer John is telling us what he knows about Jesus and what John the Baptist had taught.

John 1:18 KJE No man at any time hath seen God, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared HIM.

EXPLANATION:
Subject (No man);
Adverbial prepositional phrase (at any time); explaining when, where, or how about the verb.
Verb (hath seen);
Direct object (GOD)
Appositive: (the only begotten Son) and appositive renames the noun object for clarification purposes
(The Son) (which is in the bosom of the Father, he (John the Baptist) hath declared HIM (our Lord Jesus).

:doh: :chuckle: And by the way it is not "no man" but "no one", "none", "nothing", (ουδεις).

 

[Apple7]

What you have highlighted in blue does not say anything like what you concocted from your imagination in the previous post which contained your idea of an English rendering; but no doubt you already know that and do not care.

If you had a Greek rebuttal, you would have already used it by now.

Be careful what you ask for...

Exposed yourself.