Justification of Eternal Punishment

IHaveGodInMe

IHaveGodInMe

New member
Timotheos said:
You are a lot of fun. Tell me what John 3:16 says in your own words. You said that you read it 4 times. Tell me what it says.

(And I'm still waiting for the verse that says "the punishment for sins is eternal torture at the hands of lower case lucifer.")

:sheep:
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You still do not understand, I cannot read the Bible in my own words there is only God's Words. I do not use my senses like you do.
 
T

Timotheos

New member
IHaveGodInMe said:
You still do not understand, I cannot read the Bible in my own words there is only God's Words. I do not use my senses like you do.
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I know that you do not use your senses. :rotfl:

I am asking you to tell me what John 3:16 says. Quote from your Bible, if you don't want to put the verse in your own words. I just want to check your understanding. As you said "God's Word needs no explanation".
 
IHaveGodInMe

IHaveGodInMe

New member
Timotheos said:
I know that you do not use your senses. :rotfl:

I am asking you to tell me what John 3:16 says. Quote from your Bible, if you don't want to put the verse in your own words. I just want to check your understanding. As you said "God's Word needs no explanation".
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I think you don't understand the Word to ask me this. Go to your closet and kneel down, son. Wait and pray until the Lord enters you and lose all senses. This is how you find His Word. Liberals want you to try and use logic to find 'loopholes' in the Bible. But trust me, in Hell there are no loopholes, except maybe nooses that kill you forever. :peach:
 
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Timotheos

New member
IHaveGodInMe said:
I think you don't understand the Word to ask me this. Go to your closet and kneel down, son. Wait and pray until the Lord enters you and lose all senses. This is how you find His Word. Liberals want you to try and use logic to find 'loopholes' in the Bible. But trust me, in Hell there are no loopholes, except maybe nooses that kill you forever. :peach:
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I'm just wondering why you don't believe what John 3:16, Romans 6:23, Matthew 10:28 and Psalm 37:20 clearly state.
 
T

Timotheos

New member
IHaveGodInMe said:
You are trying to use man's eyes and ears to find loopholes! Stop! You will be doomed to the eternal death.
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Sorry Dear, I had to go to work. I shant be doomed to the eternal death because Christ is my Savior. All my hope and faith is in Him (God's only Son) for eternal life. It is interesting that you say "eternal death", when that is MY belief. You claimed that the punishment for sins is eternal living torture at the hands of lower case lucifer.

I wonder why lower case lucy is preventing you from quoting John 3:16?
The Gospel of Jesus Christ is hardly a "loophole". It is good news that we do not have to pay the penalty for sin that we owe which is death, because Jesus Christ's death on the cross pays that debt of death for us. Isn't that wonderful?
 
Word based mystic

Word based mystic

New member
Timotheos said:
Sorry Dear, I had to go to work. I shant be doomed to the eternal death because Christ is my Savior. All my hope and faith is in Him (God's only Son) for eternal life. It is interesting that you say "eternal death", when that is MY belief. You claimed that the punishment for sins is eternal living torture at the hands of lower case lucifer.

I wonder why lower case lucy is preventing you from quoting John 3:16?
The Gospel of Jesus Christ is hardly a "loophole". It is good news that we do not have to pay the penalty for sin that we owe which is death, because Jesus Christ's death on the cross pays that debt of death for us. Isn't that wonderful?
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i came on this site to see relevant and new issues. this is an old one for me 25 years ago i started looking at this in detail instead of looking at what preachers taught.

it did not seem to be consistent with many scriptures, SO.

but this one subject always amazes me as to how many changes of definitions and meanings of words people change to justify ect.

changing death to mean life
changing perish to mean imperishable.
changing destruction to mean indestructible
giving the wicked eternal life, just in a different place.
changing the meaning of forever = aion (period or to the end of the age) to mean never ending.

it is baffling to me how few dig in and see the basics laid out.

by the way Ihavegodinme.
please look at what happens to lucifer.

in ezekiel 28:18 Therefore I have brought fire from the midst of you; It has consumed you, And I have turned you to ashes on the earth In the eyes of all who see you. 19"All who know you among the peoples Are appalled at you; You have become terrified And you will ((cease to be forever)).

maybe he won't be torturing people in hell
for a period of time he himself will be tormented in Fire.
probably be too busy i think....
 
Word based mystic

Word based mystic

New member
yet in the minutia of other issues they are precise and pointed on every detail or meaning and definition.

and yell and scream if you give liberty on exact meaning of words and themes..

but on this one issue they very much so change the meaning to imply the exact opposite.
 
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Timotheos

New member
Word based mystic said:
yet in the minutia of other issues they are precise and pointed on every detail or meaning and definition.

and yell and scream if you give liberty on exact meaning of words and themes..

but on this one issue they very much so change the meaning to imply the exact opposite.
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Yes, and then accuse us of twisting scripture because we believe it means what it says. The wages of sin is death, just as the Bible says.
The wicked will perish just as the Bible says, and those in Gehenna will be destroyed just as Jesus said.
 
Aimiel

Aimiel

Well-known member
Yes death. Yes all who sin must die. Yes, all who die will also be judged. Yes, their flesh will be destroyed by flames and worm will eat their bones, for eternity. This will happen to all whose names were not written in The Lamb's Book of Life. Ignoring that after death comes judgment and eternal conscious torment is not being faithful to The Holy Scriptures. Those whose names are recorded in The Lamb's Book of Life will receive eternal life. Eternal suffering is the only fate found in Scriptures for those who chose death over life.
 
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Timotheos

New member
Aimiel said:
Yes death. Yes all who sin must die. Yes, all who die will also be judged. Yes, their flesh will be destroyed by flames and worm will eat their bones, for eternity. This will happen to all whose names were not written in The Lamb's Book of Life. Ignoring that after death comes judgment and eternal conscious torment is not being faithful to The Holy Scriptures. Those whose names are recorded in The Lamb's Book of Life will receive eternal life. Eternal suffering is the only fate found in Scriptures for those who chose death over life.
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Aren't you assuming that death does not mean death if they are conscious? The Bible doesn't say that the result of the judgment is eternal conscious torment. The Holy Scriptures say that the result of the judgment is destruction. This is why God's Word also calls that day "The day of destruction of the ungodly". 2 Peter 3:7
 
Aimiel

Aimiel

Well-known member
I don't assume anything. I assume that smoke of torment ascending for ever and ever means just that. Where there's smoke there's torment.
 
Word based mystic

Word based mystic

New member
Aimiel said:
Yes death. Yes all who sin must die. Yes, all who die will also be judged. Yes, their flesh will be destroyed by flames and worm will eat their bones, for eternity. This will happen to all whose names were not written in The Lamb's Book of Life. Ignoring that after death comes judgment and eternal conscious torment is not being faithful to The Holy Scriptures. Those whose names are recorded in The Lamb's Book of Life will receive eternal life. Eternal suffering is the only fate found in Scriptures for those who chose death over life.
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you skipped or ignored a couple things

eternal punishment is the (((((2nd death)))))
Jesus describes it in matthew 10:28 body and soul

first physical death yup your right
then judgement
then the (2nd death)

and the (destruction) hmmm meaning to be destroy (perish)

eternal is same root as aion (forever)

Strong's Concordance
aión: a space of time, an age
Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: aión
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-ohn')
Short Definition: an age, a cycle of time
Definition: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age,

the wicked soul is not indestructible nor is it imperishable nor does it have eternal life of any kind.

thus the 2nd death Which is of the body and soul

ezekiel 28:18 (cease to be forever)

and a plethora of scripture that show the wicked shall vanish away or be killed by the breath of His mouth
or be ((consumed)) by fire.

torment lasts to the end of the age
don't change the meaning of forever and eternal to be never ending
only Gods kingdom and being in Christ allows for us to be in the never ending kingdom

all other shall pass away
even death shall be no more.
 
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