Don't take my word for it, do the calculations yourself.
Is America great?
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
- Start date
Don't take my word for it, do the calculations yourself.
The main standard for "peacefulness" is lack of homicides.
Countries where homosexual unions are recognized have a higher homicide rate.
noguru
Well-known member
What calculations? You are making the claim. I have my reasoning, but yours seems to be very different. Yet you refuse to divulge any real specifics about your reasoning, which eliminates the possibility of any algorithm for statistical analysis. So what we have is purely anecdotal evidence from you so far. And even worse anecdotal evidence that is neither based on reality or any experience you have had.
noguru
Well-known member
Where do you get support for this claim?
And you do not agree that gay unions are least likely to have an abortion?
noguru
Well-known member
So you think as long as their is no killing, there is no violence?
Buzzword
New member
And, I'm sure to Sancho's consternation in his delusion that more religion = less violence, all of the least violent nations have the least connections between religion and government.
noguru
Well-known member
Sancocho, like many of his ilk, has sacrificed accuracy for the illusion of certainty. The world is much more complex and nuanced than many would like to accept. So they opt out of recognizing intricacies and fixate on an overly simplistic conceptualization of the world.
I already stated abortion is homicide, what is the problem?
Not true. Any calculation of the homicide rate will dispel your theory.
You don't get to redefine science at will. Abortion is homicide.
noguru
Well-known member
I am not redefining science. I gave you a study that was performed by researchers and you rejected it because it did not factor in abortion. You are the one redefining science, based on your theological convictions. You seem to have no clue about the history of infanticide in humans and other animals. And I bet you do not want to know. The concept that killing an infant, never mind a fetus, is a form of homicide is relatively new in the history of mankind.
Granted I do agree that abortion is wrong. Because I respect all life. But you seem unwilling to put our heads together and figure out how we can adjust things for this factor. Do you want to disqualify from the list of peaceful ones all countries that practice abortion?
Also, you have not addressed this:
Do you think that a homosexual union is less likely than a heterosexual union to have an abortion?
You are confused apparently. You say you are not redefining science yet science has established a unique human being is created at the moment of conception with unique DNA, which has become a backbone of criminal investigation. the definition of homicde is taking a human life. These facts are not up for debate, sorry. This has nothing to do with theology.
However, if we want to discuss theology I will refer you to the fact that Jesus Christ was recognize at the point of His conception by the Holy Spirit.
As far as "me having no clue of infanticide" the reality is that would be you because you apparently reject that abortion is infanticide. Also, what does animals killing animals have to do with humans???
Hmmm.... that would be hard to measure, but people who have done this from papers and court records, find this:
http://2378nh2nfow32gm3mb25krmuyy.w...oads/2011/05/Violence-Stylized-2-1024x702.png
So homicides are much reduced from 1800, and abortions are now declining. These seem like good things to me, and a sign we are doing better, not worse.
noguru
Well-known member
:chuckle:
I don't care what you "stated". You need to give sound reasoning for your claims.
Science says a human being is created at conception.
The definition of a homicide is the taking of a human life.
The US has 380 homicides per 100,000 persons on average.
Any Catholic country with a Concordat has less.
The fact that the majority of homicide statistics do not take homicide into account have nothing to do with what science says. Adding up the legal an illegal homicide rates will prove my point, as I demonstrated with Chile.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
Not exactly. Abortion is homicide, albeit legal. Taking this into account the US homicide rate is over 380 per 100,000. Whether it drops a point or two is irrelevant, it is at the level of a full scale war.
noguru
Well-known member
If science has established that then the study can be adjusted to factor that in. You seem to want to throw the study out because abortion is legal in those countries. I say we should throw out the countries in which abortion is not legal, because in those countries they are less likely to be reported.
Not with you. You have already demonstrated that you are unreasonable with science. So theology would leave way too much wiggle room for you.
No, you are wrong again. As usual, people like you compound your errors in trying to cover your previous errors.
I never said the study you referenced wasn't valid. I said you need to add abortion homicides per the scientific and lexical definition. Try to comprehend that. No amount of hee hawing will change science. Abortion is homicide.
Apples to oranges. The historical rates are criminal homicides. I see your point about abortion, but the declining abortion rates say that we're getting better, rather than worse.
How does that compare to European nations like France, if you include abortions?
noguru
Well-known member
Science says that because a fetus is exactly that. The beginning of a human life within, and biologically (not just physically) dependent on, another human being. This does nothing to resolve the problem of communication you seem to be having.
You still have not offered any statistical support for your claim. Nor have you provided a list of these countries you believe fulfill the requirements you have set down.