In the twinkling of an eye

[God's Truth]

About WHOM?

Jesus came to ISRAEL during His earthly ministry. He made that clear, Paul makes that clear... it's completely CLEAR.

Mat 15:24 KJV But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.​

The lost sheep of Israel are NOT ALL the Jews.

There were Jews who were CUT OFF and BOUND to the place of the GENTILES.

Jesus said that when he is crucified, then all the rest can come to him to be saved.

Saved the one and only way that Jesus taught and died for, the New Covenant, the good news.

 

[God's Truth]

And WHERE did you find this information?..... PAUL.... Jesus did NOT preach this during HIS earthly ministry to ISRAEL.

Even the Samaritan woman at the well knew it.

John the baptizer proclaimed it.

 

[clefty]

So if the bride is Israel, wheres that leave the gentiles?

MATTHEW [24] But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Ya see what Jesus said

JOHN 10 [14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. [15] As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. [16] And OTHER SHEEP I HAVE, WHICH ARE NOT OF THIS FOLD: THEM ALSO I MUST BRING, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and ONE SHEPHERD.

I MUST BRING! Jesus said there were “others” not of the fold of the house of Israel. These “others” are the gentiles that hear His voice. Them also He will bring.... Bring where? Bring to heaven as the raptuist claim? Nope. At the time when Jesus does bring us we will have but ONE SHEPHERD.

EZEKIEL 37 [21] And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will GATHER THEM on every side, and BRING THEM INTO THEIR OWN LAND: [22]And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: [23] Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God. [24] And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have ONE SHEPHERD: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. [25] And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. [26] Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. [27] My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

Jesus gathers His people {in the twinkling of an eye} and BRINGS them to Israel, to the kingdom. We will have but ONE SHEPHERD

ZECHARIAH 8 [7] Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Behold, I will save my people from the east country, and from the west country; [8] And I will BRING THEM, and they shall dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD {Zeke37v27}, in truth and in righteousness

The kingdom rest will be in the midst of Jerusalem

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also THE SONS OF THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. [8] The Lord God which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS TO HIM, beside those that are gathered unto him.

Jesus brings them to His Holy Mountain. The kingdom rest. Yes, the “others” {John 10v16} {Isaiah 56v8} are the gentiles. So when the LAST TRUMPET {1Cor.15} sounds we meet the Lord in the air and Jesus “brings” us to His holy mountain in Jerusalem for the kingdom rest. Not off to heaven as the Rapturist claim.

Ummm...Israel is married to us?...the body of Christ of which He only has the head apparently...I mean they aren’t married to the head or?

 

[God's Truth]

You apparently don't know what a rhetorical question is...

RD answered the question already.

Dansing, please point out in Jesus' entire ministry where he is recorded uttering the word "grace."

We'll wait.

Jesus is full of grace and come with grace.

John 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

Even Stephen the Jew whose killing was approved by Paul was full of that grace he received from Jesus.

Acts 6:8
[ Stephen Seized ] Now Stephen, a man full of God’s grace and power, performed great wonders and signs among the people.


John 1:17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

Jesus came with grace and taught the gospel of grace...believes on him, Jesus...to have faith in Jesus.

Jesus taught the gospel of grace.

He did NOT preach to sacrifice animals to him, as the Law of Moses commands.



I gave you scripture that says Jesus came with grace.


Luke 2:40 And the child grew and became strong; he was filled with wisdom, and the grace of God was on him.

Revelation 1:4 [ Greetings and Doxology ] John, To the seven churches in the province of Asia: Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits before his throne,

Revelation 22:21 The grace of the Lord Jesus be with God’s people. Amen.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Throughout your post, you mix things that apply to Israel alone to things that apply to the Body of Christ alone. Why? Because your paradigm of beliefs says you must.

So if the bride is Israel, wheres that leave the gentiles?

MATTHEW [24] But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

And?

Try reading the Bible in context and in order.

Ya see what Jesus said

JOHN 10 [14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. [15] As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. [16] And OTHER SHEEP I HAVE, WHICH ARE NOT OF THIS FOLD: THEM ALSO I MUST BRING, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and ONE SHEPHERD.

Again, taking things out of context only brings confusion.

I MUST BRING! Jesus said there were “others” not of the fold of the house of Israel. These “others” are the gentiles that hear His voice.

Agreed.

But they're not the Body of Christ, which didn't exist yet.

Them also He will bring.... Bring where? Bring to heaven as the raptuist claim? Nope.

You need to stop making straw man arguments.

None of the verses you have brought forth for your position have anything to do with the rapture, because the rapture only applies to a group that, in the context of all the verses you've brought forth, still does not exist (though it exists today, of course).

At the time when Jesus does bring us we will have but ONE SHEPHERD.

Nope. The people in the Body of Christ are not sheep.

We are members of a body, Christ's.

EZEKIEL 37 [21] And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will GATHER THEM on every side, and BRING THEM INTO THEIR OWN LAND: [22]And I will make them one nation

in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: [23] Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God. [24] And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have ONE SHEPHERD: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. [25] And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. [26] Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. [27] My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.[/QUOTE]

That ENTIRE PASSAGE is speaking about ISRAEL.

See the highlighted portions.

Jesus gathers His people {in the twinkling of an eye} and BRINGS them to Israel, to the kingdom. We will have but ONE SHEPHERD

Nope. You're forcing together concepts that have nothing to do with one another.

How?

By taking things out of their rightful context.

Ezekiel is talking about Israel and Judah, the two nations in the above passage.

God planned to make them again into ONE NATION, and to bring them back into the land that He had promised them.

The Body of Christ (aka Christians) are still a mystery at this point in the Bible. Or, in other words, not mentioned at all, no one knew that the gentiles would be part of God's plans.

ZECHARIAH 8 [7] Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Behold, I will save my people from the east country, and from the west country; [8] And I will BRING THEM, and they shall dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD {Zeke37v27}, in truth and in righteousness

The kingdom rest will be in the midst of Jerusalem

The kingdom is the entire nation of Israel, no longer divided into Israel and Judah.

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also THE SONS OF THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. [8] The Lord God which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS TO HIM, beside those that are gathered unto him.

See above.

Jesus brings them to His Holy Mountain. The kingdom rest. Yes, the “others” {John 10v16} {Isaiah 56v8} are the gentiles. So when the LAST TRUMPET {1Cor.15} sounds we meet the Lord in the air and Jesus “brings” us to His holy mountain in Jerusalem for the kingdom rest. Not off to heaven as the Rapturist claim.

Once again, taking things out of context to form a straw man against what the Bible says.

I'm not a rapturist, whatever that is....

I am a Christian, who says that the rapture of the Body of Christ (in which there is neither Jew nor Gentile (whereas in the "NATION OF ISRAEL" there are ONLY Jews and proselytes (Gentiles who have become Jews))) will occur before the Great Tribulation (Hint: also called the "Time of Jacob's Trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7; Jacobs other name is "Israel")), so that the Body of Christ will be spared, but that the Bride of Christ will pass through judgment, a trial by fire.

That's what the Bible says. That's what I believe.

 

[God's Truth]

Why did God separate Israel from other people?

Lev 20:24 KJV But I have said unto you, Ye shall inherit their land, and I will give it unto you to possess it, a land that floweth with milk and honey: I am the LORD your God, which have separated you from other people.​

​

Lev 20:26 KJV And ye shall be holy unto me: for I the LORD am holy, and have severed you from other people, that ye should be mine.​

Jesus' blood and body make JEW and GENTILE one man; and THAT is what Jesus intended to do when he came to earth and preached the one and only gospel that saves.


John 12:32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."

Ephesians 2:15 by abolishing in His flesh the law of commandments and decrees. He did this to create in Himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace

Ephesians 2:17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near.

Colossians 1:20 and through Him to reconcile to Himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through the blood of His cross.

Ephesians 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near by the blood of Christ.

Ephesians 2:14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility,

Ephesians 2:15 by abolishing in His flesh the law of commandments and decrees. He did this to create in Himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace

Ephesians 2:17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near.

Colossians 1:20 and through Him to reconcile to Himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through the blood of His cross.

Colossians 3:11 Here there is no Greek or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, or free, but Christ is all and is in all.

 

[DansingWall]

So do you believe mountain in Jerusalem literally?

Not really sure Meshak

 

[meshak]

Not really sure Meshak

when you quote the verses, use : instead of v. then it becomes blue.

 

[DansingWall]

What about Job?

1COR.15 [51] Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but WE SHALL ALL BE CHANGED,[52] In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.[53] for this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

Will Job be amoung the dead in Christ who will be “changed” at the 1Cor.15 event?

1 CORINTHIANS 10[1] Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all OUR FATHERS were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; [2] And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; [3] And did all eat the same spiritual meat; [4] And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they DRANK OF THAT SPIRITUAL ROCK that followed them: and THAT ROCK WAS CHRIST.

Yes, according to scripture. The dead in Christ rise 1st.

JOB 14 [10] But man dieth, and wasteth away: yea, man giveth up the ghost, and where is he?[11] As the waters fail from the sea, and the flood decayeth and drieth up:[12] So MAN LIETH DOWN, AND RISETH NOT: TILL THE HEAVENS BE NO MORE, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.[13] O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me! [14] IF A MAN DIE, SHALL HE LIVE AGAIN? all the days of my appointed time will I WAIT, TILL MY CHANGE COME.

Job says after the heavens be no more, then shall his "change" come

2PET.3 [10] But THE DAY OF THE LORD WILL COME as a thief in the night; in the which THE HEAVENS SHALL PASS AWAY with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up

Job says his "change" will come when the heavens be no more. Above scripture tells us the heavens be no more at the coming of the Day of the Lord. Which occurs {according to scripture} after the great tribulation

ISAIAH 34 [2] For the indignation of the LORD is upon all nations, and his fury upon all their armies: he hath utterly destroyed them, he hath delivered them to the slaughter.[3] Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood.[4] And all the host of HEAVEN SHALL BE DISSOLVED, and the heavens shall be rolled together AS A SCROLL: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree. [8] For it is THE DAY OF THE LORD'S VENGEANCE, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.


So scripture proves Job will be changed {in the twinkling of an eye} after the tribulation period on the Day of the Lord. So why wasnt he invited to the to darbys pre-trib rapture

 

[DansingWall]

when you quote the verses, use : instead of v. then it becomes blue.

Thanks

John 3:16 {just practicing}

hmmm didnt work

 

[God's Truth]

Throughout your post, you mix things that apply to Israel alone to things that apply to the Body of Christ alone. Why? Because your paradigm of beliefs says you must.



And?

Try reading the Bible in context and in order.



Again, taking things out of context only brings confusion.



Agreed.

But they're not the Body of Christ, which didn't exist yet.



You need to stop making straw man arguments.

None of the verses you have brought forth for your position have anything to do with the rapture, because the rapture only applies to a group that, in the context of all the verses you've brought forth, still does not exist (though it exists today, of course).



Nope. The people in the Body of Christ are not sheep.

We are members of a body, Christ's.

in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: [23] Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God. [24] And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have ONE SHEPHERD: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. [25] And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. [26] Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. [27] My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

That ENTIRE PASSAGE is speaking about ISRAEL.

See the highlighted portions.



Nope. You're forcing together concepts that have nothing to do with one another.

How?

By taking things out of their rightful context.

Ezekiel is talking about Israel and Judah, the two nations in the above passage.

God planned to make them again into ONE NATION, and to bring them back into the land that He had promised them.

The Body of Christ (aka Christians) are still a mystery at this point in the Bible. Or, in other words, not mentioned at all, no one knew that the gentiles would be part of God's plans.



The kingdom is the entire nation of Israel, no longer divided into Israel and Judah.



See above.



Once again, taking things out of context to form a straw man against what the Bible says.

I'm not a rapturist, whatever that is....

I am a Christian, who says that the rapture of the Body of Christ (in which there is neither Jew nor Gentile (whereas in the "NATION OF ISRAEL" there are ONLY Jews and proselytes (Gentiles who have become Jews))) will occur before the Great Tribulation (Hint: also called the "Time of Jacob's Trouble" (Jeremiah 30:7; Jacobs other name is "Israel")), so that the Body of Christ will be spared, but that the Bride of Christ will pass through judgment, a trial by fire.

That's what the Bible says. That's what I believe.

All are in the Body of Christ or they are hell bound.

 

[God's Truth]

The marriage is when everyone to be saved is saved and in the body of Christ.

That is the bride and the body and the wedding is at that time.

There is no separate 'bride' and a separate 'body of Christ'.

 

[DansingWall]

Nope. The people in the Body of Christ are not sheep.

John 10:24-27 (KJV)
24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.
25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Hmmm

 

[DansingWall]

The marriage is when everyone to be saved is saved and in the body of Christ.

That is the bride and the body and the wedding is at that time.

There is no separate 'bride' and a separate 'body of Christ'.

JEREMIAH 3 [11] And the LORD said unto me, THE BACKSLIDING ISRAEL hath justified herself more than treacherous Judah.[12] Go and proclaim these words toward the north, and say, Return, thou backsliding Israel, saith the LORD; and I will not cause mine anger to fall upon you: for I am merciful, saith the LORD, and I will not keep anger for ever.[13] Only acknowledge thine iniquity, that thou hast transgressed against the LORD thy God, and hast scattered thy ways to the strangers under every green tree, and ye have not obeyed my voice, saith the LORD.[14] TURN, O BACKSLIDING CHILDREN, SAITH THE LORD; FOR I AM MARRIED UNTO YOU: AND I WILL TAKE YOU ONE OF A CITY, AND TWO OF A FAMILY, AND I WILL BRING YOU TO ZION:

Israel is the Bride {and a few gentiles}. And their headin for Zion. Not heaven

 

[God's Truth]

JEREMIAH 3 [11] And the LORD said unto me, THE BACKSLIDING ISRAEL hath justified herself more than treacherous Judah.[12] Go and proclaim these words toward the north, and say, Return, thou backsliding Israel, saith the LORD; and I will not cause mine anger to fall upon you: for I am merciful, saith the LORD, and I will not keep anger for ever.[13] Only acknowledge thine iniquity, that thou hast transgressed against the LORD thy God, and hast scattered thy ways to the strangers under every green tree, and ye have not obeyed my voice, saith the LORD.[14] TURN, O BACKSLIDING CHILDREN, SAITH THE LORD; FOR I AM MARRIED UNTO YOU: AND I WILL TAKE YOU ONE OF A CITY, AND TWO OF A FAMILY, AND I WILL BRING YOU TO ZION:

Israel is the Bride {and a few gentiles}. And their headin for Zion. Not heaven

Please explain yourself better. What do you think you have disproved and proved. Thanks.

As for Israel being a few Gentiles, that is silly. They are heading for Zion and not heaven, that is silly too.

When we come to God through Jesus to be saved, we come to heaven, to Zion.

The only Jerusalem that matters IS the NEW Jerusalem that is in heaven.
It is in heaven now and we who are being saved are being built up in that heavenly Jerusalem.

 

[clefty]

when you quote the verses, use : instead of v. then it becomes blue.

LOL...jots and tittles matter...

We need to be specific to details just to post...but when it comes to life here after it’s “whatever that was abolished” or “no works needed” or “rules it ain’t for me” LOL

 

[meshak]

Israel is the Bride {and a few gentiles}. And their headin for Zion. Not heaven

Not all Israel, only Jesus' true followers and the gentile followers of Christ. And the Zion is paradise earth. And the body of Christ and Bride are synonymous, IMO.


blessings.

 

[meshak]

LOL...jots and tittles matter...

We need to be specific to details just to post...but when it comes to life here after it’s “whatever that was abolished” or “no works needed” or “rules it ain’t for me” LOL

Hey, speak an English, friend.

 

[God's Truth]

Not all Israel, only Jesus' true followers and the gentile followers of Christ. And the Zion is paradise earth. And the body of Christ and Bride are synonymous, IMO.


blessings.

Right on. Amen. That is it.

 

[steko]

this is so entertaining.

You're right about that, this is indeed entertaining!