Christians worship Christ; JW's do not!

[JudgeRightly]

Why are you stuck on three separate God's?

Yet another strawman from someone who seemingly cannot understand my position.

Please quote me where I have ever stated that there are three Gods.

You cannot. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID there is ONLY ONE GOD.

Which one is GOD almighty to you?

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GOD ALONE, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. Beside Him there is no other.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Yet another strawman from someone who seemingly cannot understand my position.

Please quote me where I have ever stated that there are three Gods.

You cannot. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID there is ONLY ONE GOD.



GOD ALONE, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. Beside Him there is no other.

So separately none of them are GOD almighty.

Hopefully you see a problem.

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[marhig]

And there are other verses that say that Jesus is God and even more that say that the Holy Spirit is God...

Again, basing one's theology on just a single verse or set of verses is not a good idea. You have to look at the entirety of scripture, and base your theology on that.



Marhig, once again, you fail to see the point I am making.

You, among others, are basing your entire theology on a single set of verses and think that extrapolating what those verses say to the rest of Scripture means that the rest of scripture says what you are extrapolating. Here's the thing though, IT DOESN'T!

ALL OF SCRIPTURE says that God is triune. Not just a single verse, not just a few verses here and there. All of it.

There are three books God wrote, The Bible, DNA, and Nature. All of nature screams that God is three. From the DNA in our cells to number of particles that make up matter, from Abraham thinking for three days that he would sacrifice Isaac, to Jonah's three days in the belly of the fish, to Christ's three days in the grave, from the three thousand people who were killed the day the law was given, to the three thousand who were saved when the Spirit was given, from the three sections of the Hebrew Scriptures (the Law, the Prophets, and the Writings) to the three archangels, from the three most noteworthy women (Eve, Sarah, and Mary) to the three gifts brought by the Magi (gold, frankincense, and myrrh). Space exists in three dimensions, and so does time (past, present, future). Electromagnetic forces are positive, negative, and neutral. The three basic states of matter are solid, liquid, and gas. In light, three colors, red, green, and blue, make up all the colors, whereas in pigment, the three colors are red, yellow, and blue. We are on the third planet from the Sun, atoms are made up of three particles, protons, neutrons, and electrons, and electrons are one of three flavors of "leptons." Protons and neutrons are made of exactly three quarks of one of the three quark groupings, each of one of three "colors" and of multiples of one-third electrical charge.

There are so many things that declare that God is three that it's mind boggling!

Remember what Scripture says?

"The heavens declare the glory of God, and the firmament declares his handiwork..."

Glory of God? Where have we heard something similar?

And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was. - John 17:5

:think::think::think:

Yes I keep getting told that I shouldn't believe what Jesus and the apostles say, even though what I believe is clearly written in the Bible. But rather I'm told that i should believe the things that you have said above and things I have been told like, because believe is written in 2 verses 3 times that I should believe in the trinity etc. Or because Jesus says the words, I am the son of God then he's God. I am Mary, but that doesn't make me God! But I'm not to believe Jesus himself when he actually says that the father is the only true God and that he is his God?

So your trying to say that everything that makes up three in the Bible refers to God being triune? That's just not true! And I'm not going on just a couple of verses I'm going on many verses, some spoken by Jesus himself!

For instance, you quoted this,

"The heavens declare the glory of God, and the firmament declares his handiwork..."

And then you quoted this, to say why you believe that Jesus is God

And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was. - John 17:5

But if you look a bit further into that chapter there is this

John 17:22

AND THE GLORY WHICH THOU GAVEST ME I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

The father gave Jesus the glory, thus the father is God. And then Jesus gives God's glory to those who belong to him, so that we are at one with the father and Christ. And that doesn't make us God, does it?

Jesus came to glorify the father, by living by his will, and preaching the gospel and baring witness to the truth and showing us the express image of the living God who was in Christ reconciling the world into himself through Jesus, bringing us a new and living way. And we glorify God and Christ once we are born of God, walk in the Spirit and live by God's will, baring witness to the truth through Christ, by the power of the Spirit. Bringing the love of God and life of Christ to others, with the hope that Christ through us can save them.

Anyway, can I ask you a question? Do you believe that the father is the God of Christ Jesus? Thanks.

 

[JudgeRightly]

So separately none of them are GOD almighty.

Hopefully you see a problem.

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Again, NOT WHAT I SAID! How is this so difficult for you to understand.
[MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] has explained this multiple times, and at least twice in this very thread.

https://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?p=5228423

 

[JudgeRightly]

Yes I keep getting told that I shouldn't believe what Jesus and the apostles say, even though what I believe is clearly written in the Bible. But rather I'm told that i should believe the things that you have said above and things I have been told like, because believe is written in 2 verses 3 times that I should believe in the trinity etc. Or because Jesus says the words, I am the son of God then he's God. I am Mary, but that doesn't make me God! But I'm not to believe Jesus himself when he actually says that the father is the only true God and that he is his God?

So your trying to say that everything that makes up three in the Bible refers to God being triune? That's just not true! And I'm not going on just a couple of verses I'm going on many verses, some spoken by Jesus himself!

For instance, you quoted this,

"The heavens declare the glory of God, and the firmament declares his handiwork..."

And then you quoted this, to say why you believe that Jesus is God

And now, O Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was. - John 17:5

But if you look a bit further into that chapter there is this

John 17:22

AND THE GLORY WHICH THOU GAVEST ME I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

The father gave Jesus the glory, thus the father is God. And then Jesus gives God's glory to those who belong to him, so that we are at one with the father and Christ. And that doesn't make us God, does it?

Jesus came to glorify the father, by living by his will, and preaching the gospel and baring witness to the truth and showing us the express image of the living God who was in Christ reconciling the world into himself through Jesus, bringing us a new and living way. And we glorify God and Christ once we are born of God, walk in the Spirit and live by God's will, baring witness to the truth through Christ, by the power of the Spirit. Bringing the love of God and life of Christ to others, with the hope that Christ through us can save them.

Anyway, can I ask you a question? Do you believe that the father is the God of Christ Jesus? Thanks.

And yet you somehow think that the verses you quoted negate the scriptures that say Jesus is God, or they negate the scriptures that say the Holy Spirit is God.

Do you not see what you're doing? YOU'RE SETTING SCRIPTURE AGAINST SCRIPTURE, AND CLAIMING THAT ONE VERSE OR SET OF VERSES HAS PRECEDENCE OVER THE OTHER(S)!

You keep asserting that "this verse says that the Father is the only God," and I always tell you that IT DOES NOT EXCLUDE THE OTHER SCRIPTURES THAT SAY THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT ARE THE ONLY TRUE GOD. THE THREE PERSONS ARE CO-EQUALLY ONE GOD, YET HE (GOD) IS THREE PERSONS.

THAT IS MY POINT, Marhig. You keep using an argument that EXCLUDES OTHER SCRIPTURE, instead of making an argument that INCLUDES ALL SCRIPTURE. You CANNOT understand the Bible with an argument from exclusion. You can only understand the Bible when you INCLUDE ALL THE VERSES. It's called "GETTING THE BIG PICTURE!"

 

[popsthebuilder]

Again, NOT WHAT I SAID! How is this so difficult for you to understand.
[MENTION=7209]Ask Mr. Religion[/MENTION] has explained this multiple times, and at least twice in this very thread.

https://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?p=5228423

No you said the three combined equal GOD almighty.

So separately none are according to such.



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[JudgeRightly]

No you said the three combined equal GOD almighty.

So separately none are according to such.

I DID NOT, YOU LIAR!

Yet another strawman from someone who seemingly cannot understand my position.

Please quote me where I have ever stated that there are three Gods.

You cannot. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID there is ONLY ONE GOD.

GOD ALONE, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. Beside Him there is no other.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

No you said the three combined equal GOD almighty.

So separately none are according to such.



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Perhaps you misunderstood/misconstrued what he said?

 

[marhig]

And yet you somehow think that the verses you quoted negate the scriptures that say Jesus is God, or they negate the scriptures that say the Holy Spirit is God.

Do you not see what you're doing? YOU'RE SETTING SCRIPTURE AGAINST SCRIPTURE, AND CLAIMING THAT ONE VERSE OR SET OF VERSES HAS PRECEDENCE OVER THE OTHER(S)!

You keep asserting that "this verse says that the Father is the only God," and I always tell you that IT DOES NOT EXCLUDE THE OTHER SCRIPTURES THAT SAY THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT ARE THE ONLY TRUE GOD. THE THREE PERSONS ARE CO-EQUALLY ONE GOD, YET HE (GOD) IS THREE PERSONS.

THAT IS MY POINT, Marhig. You keep using an argument that EXCLUDES OTHER SCRIPTURE, instead of making an argument that INCLUDES ALL SCRIPTURE. You CANNOT understand the Bible with an argument from exclusion. You can only understand the Bible when you INCLUDE ALL THE VERSES. It's called "GETTING THE BIG PICTURE!"

Ok, can you just tell me this please, do you believe that the father is the God of Christ Jesus?

 

[popsthebuilder]

I DID NOT, YOU LIAR!

That's odd; I thought you said the following;

"GOD ALONE, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. Beside Him there is no other."

So if father, son, holy spirit combined aloneake up GOD almighty then to you none separate from the other is GOD almighty.

I'm not lying; it is the logical conclusion of your own doctrine.

There is either logic or not. What you espouse is at best illogic and at worst idol worship and polytheism.

I'm not lying just because you can't think.

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[popsthebuilder]

Perhaps you misunderstood/misconstrued what he said?

I wish

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[Apple7]

Wow, well that's a new one, so Jesus is God because the word believes is repeated 3 times in a couple of verses?

Scripture declares the Triune God all the way through scripture.

Even the authors of the Koran understood this much when they copied the Holy Bible into their opus.

Any serious student of scripture always considers context, and, of course, the original languages of scripture before arriving at a conclusion.

Those verses clearly tell us that God sent Jesus!

Zzzzzzz......and?

That old polemic does not diminish Jesus' deity.

Got any NEW material to peddle...?

The verses also say that Those believing into the NAME of The Son are the ones saved....as such, makes The Son, God.

But...you ignore context...

And I'm the wrong one because I believe Jesus's own words when he clearly says that the father is the only true God and that he is his God also? And because I believe the apostles when they say that God is the God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ and that the head of Christ is God. But I'm the wrong one?

Scripture declares that Jesus is The True God.

We have already been through this...but...repetition does help.

Further...even in the OT, God has a God!

You seem to have stopped studying scripture long ago....and now you are stuck in a hard-loop of repeating the same half-truths.

Keep clicking those heels together...Dorothy...

There's no word trinity in the Bible, No word triune, there's no God the son.

The word 'Trinity' is juxtaposed to the word 'Monad'...

There is in the Bible however, Jesus and his apostles saying that he's the son of God, and that the father is the only true God, and that he's the God and father of Christ Jesus, and that Christ, the son is under subjection to him, and that God has exalted him, given him authority and made him Lord given him a name above every name, and that the head of Christ is God and that Jesus was sent by him and came to do his will.

Now, why shouldn't I believe all that? It's in the Bible!

None, of which, thwart Jesus' deity, nor the truth of The Trinity.

Go ahead and pick your top polemic scripture, exegetically defend it, and prove to us that you can do more than just repeat yourself with the same, exact material, year after year, after year...

 

[JudgeRightly]

Perhaps you misunderstood/misconstrued what he said?

GM hit the nail on the head.

You, Pops, CANNOT understand what I'm saying because your paradigm of beliefs prevents it. It's what [MENTION=2589]Clete[/MENTION] was saying in his conversation with Turbosixx. My paradigm allows me to understand yours and what errors you make that result in false doctrine. Your paradigm only tries to make sense of what you see, even if it seems to contradict. Mine resolves those conflicts, and gives me a clear picture of what Scripture says. Yours CANNOT, it's just not possible for yours to. And I don't mean that as an insult, I truly don't, but it makes it extremely difficult to teach truth to someone whose paradigm cannot get the big picture.

That's odd; I thought you said the following;

"GOD ALONE, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. Beside Him there is no other."

That is exactly what I said, but your way of thinking, your paradigm, prevents you from understanding how I make that statement, and the meaning I impart to it.

So if father, son, holy spirit

Please capitalize names, especially when they're the name of God.

combined

THIS IS NOT WHAT I SAID.

I said that God alone, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, is God Almighty. THE THREE ARE ONE GOD. Yet each one is fully God.

alone make up GOD almighty then to you none separate from the other is GOD almighty.

I'm not lying; it is the logical conclusion of your own doctrine.

No, it's the logical (though erroneous) conclusion of your interpretation of what I said.

There is either logic or not. What you espouse is at best illogic and at worst idol worship and polytheism.

Or your paradigm of beliefs prevents you from understanding what I'm saying. Is that a possibility, Pops?

I'm not lying just because you can't think.

No, You're not thinking, which causes you to say that I'm being illogical, or at best, lying.

I wish

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I wish that there was some way for me to give you my way of thinking. But there isn't.

 

[marhig]

Scripture declares the Triune God all the way through scripture.

Even the authors of the Koran understood this much when they copied the Holy Bible into their opus.

Any serious student of scripture always considers context, and, of course, the original languages of scripture before arriving at a conclusion.







Zzzzzzz......and?

That old polemic does not diminish Jesus' deity.

Got any NEW material to peddle...?

The verses also say that Those believing into the NAME of The Son are the ones saved....as such, makes The Son, God.

But...you ignore context...






Scripture declares that Jesus is The True God.

We have already been through this...but...repetition does help.

Further...even in the OT, God has a God!

You seem to have stopped studying scripture long ago....and now you are stuck in a hard-loop of repeating the same half-truths.

Keep clicking those heels together...Dorothy...







The word 'Trinity' is juxtaposed to the word 'Monad'...







None, of which, thwart Jesus' deity, nor the truth of The Trinity.

Go ahead and pick your top polemic scripture, exegetically defend it, and prove to us that you can do more than just repeat yourself with the same, exact material, year after year, after year...

Do you believe that the father is the God of Jesus?

 

[Apple7]

You say this to me why?

John 8:49 "I am not possessed by a demon," said Jesus, "but I honor my Father and you dishonor me.

What is the name of your demon...?

 

[Apple7]

Do you believe that the father is the God of Jesus?

Just as The Son is The God of The Father.

 

[musterion]

Yet another strawman from someone who seemingly cannot understand my position.

As with leftists, whenever dealing with cultists do not rule out deliberate time-wasting duplicity...aka playing dumb. JWs are among the masters of it.

 

[marhig]

Just as The Son is The God of The Father.

Where does it say in the Bible that the son is the God of the father?

 

[musterion]

Where does it say in the Bible that the son is the God of the father?

You're all talk and nothing else.

 

[Apple7]

As with leftists, whenever dealing with cultists do not rule out deliberate time-wasting duplicity...aka playing dumb. JWs are among the masters of it.

It is rather ironic that liberals (both government and religious) have taken the moniker of 'leftists' which are the ones, in scripture, that have no Salvation...