10 Vaccines That Saved The World

[elohiym]

This is a much better film, but it destroys the credibility of those pop-pseudo-science videos you've unfortunately been posting:

Vaccine Nation

Did you watch it, User Name?

 

[aikido7]

Religion and ethics play a part, too. My religious beliefs preclude me from being intentionally infected with a live virus, even if the virus is attenuated.

It's my common sense that precludes me from accepting an infected injection.

Perhaps some, but certainly not all.

The words "all," "never," "everyone," "nobody" and other similar words are big enough to drive the logic truck right through. They are seldom accurate descriptions.

Virgin birth, also known as parthenogenesis, is natural occurrence that scientists have documented. Even though it is not considered to occur in mammals, parthenogenesis can begin if the egg is accidentally or experimentally activated as if it had been fertilized. The mammal will begin to develop but then terminate because of another phenomenon called imprinting. To claim a human virgin birth never occurred in history would be to claim the barrier of imprinting was never overcome by chance once or that God could not overcome a simple biological barrier that scientists are finding ways to manipulate in recent years.

I have not seen any scientific documentation of a virgin birth in human beings. Although both the chroniclers of Jesus and Augustus Caesar declared both men to be born of virgins, the normal father who finds out his daughter is pregnant is not going to accept any excuse like that.

Jesus said to ask and we would receive. That is what I do and my Father in heaven has been more generous to me and my children than any earthly father.

It sounds like you are leading a blessed life and I rejoice with you in that.

I used to pray to God to allow me to fly off the back porch. My brother prayed as well. Never happened.

Like it or not, God has to work within the framework of the world. A conscious Christian life has helped me see most things as gifts from God--even the trials and the everyday problems.

We can also receive God in very unexpected places, as Jesus taught. Even in the corrupt and the unclean.

You should discuss vaccines on this thread.

I guess I see a similarity between medical miracles and divine ones.
And I was not the only one who discussed this.

 

[elohiym]

It's my common sense that precludes me from accepting an infected injection.

Common sense and scientific evidence support my religious belief. My point to the other poster was that my religious beliefs should not be discounted, especially since they are not based on superstition like vaccine mythology.

I have not seen any scientific documentation of a virgin birth in human beings.

Still, I've shared some facts with you about parthenogenesis. Do what you want with that information. I have no good reason to doubt the claimed virgin birth of Jesus.

I used to pray to God to allow me to fly off the back porch. My brother prayed as well. Never happened.

That isn't evidence against prayer.

Like it or not, God has to work within the framework of the world.

I think it's a mistake to believe that, friend.

A conscious Christian life has helped me see most things as gifts from God--even the trials and the everyday problems.

Good words.

I guess I see a similarity between medical miracles and divine ones.
And I was not the only one who discussed this.

Okay. What is the similarity you see? You seemed to be distinguishing them, implying divine miracles are fantasy and so-called medical miracles are real.

 

[aikido7]

Common sense and scientific evidence support my religious belief. My point to the other poster was that my religious beliefs should not be discounted, especially since they are not based on superstition like vaccine mythology.

Common sense and scientific evidence are not discounted or ignored in my faith life. I live as a Christian in 2015 in a global community which is interconnected like no other point in human history.
It is and exciting time for me to be on my faith journey.

Still, I've shared some facts with you about parthenogenesis. Do what you want with that information. I have no good reason to doubt the claimed virgin birth of Jesus.

And I read your information about
parthenogenesis.

Jesus's virgin birth speaks to his importance and his divinity. It has nothing to do with the biology of Mary. Like I said, many religious myths have their heroic figures being born in an otherworldly way. Caesar, too, was born of a virgin, divine and was actually declared Savior of the World. Everyone back then was different. It was an ancient time period and most people took for granted that people could be born of virgins--if they were godly or exalted enough.

That isn't evidence against prayer.

I have nothing against prayer. I would like you to know that the God of Jesus treats all the same. Our freewill he gave us is the key. Jesus said the "Father makes his sun to shine on both the good and the evil and sendeth his rain to fall on the just and the unjust alike."

I think it's a mistake to believe that, friend.

My life has been awesomely blessed by God for years. Any mistake I make I am made all-too-aware of it and can forgive myself, the other person and start anew.

Jesus didn't just resurrect once. He comes back to me every single day!

Good words.

But don't you think that words limit us and prevent our lives from being more godly?

The words "born of a virgin" don't do anything for me. I don't see the Christian life as being able to give my assent to a list of first-century dogmatic language.

The truth of those prosaic words to me is that Jesus is unique, unlike the usual human being.

I refuse to twist my intellect into scientific ideas that I can "force" onto the biblical truths to make them meaningful.

Okay. What is the similarity you see? You seemed to be distinguishing them, implying divine miracles are fantasy and so-called medical miracles are real.

I see a difference between the literal and the metaphoric. But we do ALL live in myths. We all impose a narrative or a meaning on everything we encounter and pause to take in.

My wife tells me "I went to the dentist." I concoct a narrative of her driving to the facility, sitting down in the waiting room and getting a cleaning from Nicole. But alas, Nicole has quit her job, my wife called her friend Chris to meet her at the office and she ended up getting seen by another assistant.

THAT was closer to being factually correct, but I chose to go with my own narrative and regard it as factually correct.

When an Indian Medicine Man sat in a circle telling the tribe stories, they would often say "What I am telling you is true. And some of it really happened."

A miracle is a miracle. It is something that happens in human experience that is defined and interpreted as, well, as "miraculous."

The miraculous always happens because our God-given life is a miracle.

Many medical miracles happen every day. The idea of a "placebo effect" is one of the most astounding ideas I have ever encountered.

Most believers accept that an unexpected change to the positive in human sickness is because of their prayers and is attributed solely to God.
Other people are just thankful for the change and don't attribute it to God or Jesus.

I attribute the entire universe to God, and I see Jesus as God on earth.

Prayer helps us gather strength but I do not believe it literally "moves mountains" or even molehills. The universe has always worked the same way yesterday, today, and will tomorrow.

Jesus had faith in God, but in the first-century religious world the word means "trust." God is above humanity and we can only trust the divine. We cannot interrupt or change its flow.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

It's understandable if you see me as blasphemous or working with the Devil. My insistence on finding the authentic voice-print of Jesus sometimes provokes fear, defensiveness and scorn. And I am sorry about that. I am not going to blame or condemn anyone for "not getting" what I am saying. I try to be responsible for my own behavior instead and try to work on other ways to communicate my beliefs so they will be better understood.

 

[User Name]

Did you watch it, User Name?

Of course not, I can't be bothered with that nonsense. Gary Null is a quack.

I (and everyone I know of) have had the full schedule of immunizations. We don't have any ill effects from having gotten them, so I know from personal experience that your claim that vaccines are somehow dangerous is false. You are incapable of stating exactly how vaccines are harmful, so clearly you have no case against it other than your own religious superstitions.

 

[Zeke]

Patrick Jordan of vaccinefraud.com shows the average citizen is so duped and dumb down they think injecting a foreign substance into you're body is a good thing because some official said it was safe, when it is about money and control, Which Aldous Huxley predicted this very thing where people would embrace their destroyer.

 

[User Name]

Patrick Jordan of vaccinefraud.com shows the average citizen is so duped and dumb down they think injecting a foreign substance into you're body is a good thing because some official said it was safe, when it is about money and control, Which Aldous Huxley predicted this very thing where people would embrace their destroyer.

Exactly what do vaccines do to people that is harmful?

 

[elohiym]

Exactly what do vaccines do to people that is harmful?

The answer depends on what vaccine you are asking about and what is considered harmful. Death from side effects is an example of how some vaccines are harmful.

 

[elohiym]

Of course not, I can't be bothered with that nonsense. Gary Null is a quack.

You have no proof Gary Null is a quack; he's not a medical doctor and doesn't pretend to be. The medical doctors and other experts interviewed in the film are not quacks, unless you have evidence to the contrary. Ironically, the person you are praising with your pop-culture videos, Jenner, was a quack; but you've just ignored the evidence presented against him in this discussion.

I (and everyone I know of) have had the full schedule of immunizations. We don't have any ill effects from having gotten them, so I know from personal experience that your claim that vaccines are somehow dangerous is false.

Anecdotal fallacy.

You are incapable of stating exactly how vaccines are harmful...

Not true. I'm just not going to make blanket statements about all vaccines because they are not all the same.

... so clearly you have no case against it other than your own religious superstitions.

What religious superstition? You haven't proved anything I believe is based on superstition. Meanwhile, the true history of the smallpox vaccine proves you are the superstitious person believing myths.

 

[elohiym]

This is from the paper, Adversomics: The Emerging Field of Vaccine Adverse Event Immunogenetics, that appeared in the Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal:

Immune, inflammatory, idiosyncratic, and other responses to a vaccine are determined by a host of known and unknown factors, including individual characteristics (age, gender, race, medical condition, etc.), the quality and quantity of vaccine antigen(s), the number of doses administered, route of immunization, and host genetics. Although tremendous work has gone into understanding genetic susceptibility to infectious diseases,2 attention now needs to turn toward understanding genetic susceptibility to vaccine-related AEs. Indeed in the case of live vaccines, one might simplistically envision administration of such vaccines as an “infection” and conceptually study the susceptibility to such reactions in the same manner.​

Barbaric! They didn't have to enclose the word infection in quotations because a live vaccine works by giving the recipient an infection with an attenuated virus; they are indeed administering an infection.

 

[User Name]

Veterans, both male and female, are less healthy than the general population. See here and here.

According to your links, veterans and active duty personnel "were more likely to report smoking and heavy alcohol consumption than civilians," i.e., "poorer...health behaviors". The reports concluded that "increased prevention efforts are needed" in order to combat "unhealthy lifestyles".

In other words, nothing to do with vaccinations.

Furthermore, the VA tells veterans with Gulf War Syndrome that the vaccinations may have caused their health problems. See http://www.publichealth.va.gov/exposures/gulfwar/sources/vaccinations.asp

Your link states:

The Institute of Medicine (IOM) of the National Academy of Sciences concluded in its report Gulf War and Health: Depleted Uranium, Sarin, Pyridostigmine Bromide, and Vaccines (2000) that there is inadequate or insufficient evidence to determine whether an association does or does not exist between multiple vaccinations and long-term adverse health problems.​

How does this support your case?

 

[elohiym]

Vaccinomics: Scientists Are Devising Your Personal Vaccine

 

[elohiym]

In other words, nothing to do with vaccinations.

I was only addressing you false claim that people in the military are healthier, but your conclusion is not necessarily true.

Your link states:

The Institute of Medicine (IOM) of the National Academy of Sciences concluded in its report Gulf War and Health: Depleted Uranium, Sarin, Pyridostigmine Bromide, and Vaccines (2000) that there is inadequate or insufficient evidence to determine whether an association does or does not exist between multiple vaccinations and long-term adverse health problems.​

How is this supposed to support your case?

They have not ruled out the vaccinations as causing the syndrome.

 

[User Name]

I was only addressing you false claim that people in the military are healthier

Point taken.

but your conclusion is not necessarily true.

You have no evidence that it isn't true. On the other hand, I do have evidence that "poorer health behaviors" and "unhealthy lifestyles" do lead to poorer health.

They have not ruled out the vaccinations as causing the syndrome.

They haven't ruled it in, either. And why would vaccinations be the cause of Gulf War Syndrome when other veterans who didn't serve in the Gulf War got the same vaccinations but didn't get the syndrome?

 

[User Name]

The answer depends on what vaccine you are asking about and what is considered harmful.

Pick a vaccine--any vaccine--and tell me exactly what harm comes from it.

 

[elohiym]

You have no evidence that it isn't true. On the other hand, I do have evidence that "poorer health behaviors" and "unhealthy lifestyles" do lead to poorer health.

Those lifestyles and behaviors are caused by something, right? Mitrocondrial dysfunction can cause intellectual dysfunction or psychological disturbances. Aluminum toxicity causes mitrocondrial dysfunction. The adjuvant in some vaccines is aluminum.

They haven't ruled it in, either.

They can't rule it in without undermining their lucrative vaccination program; they can't rule it out because there is evidence that prevents them from ruling it out. Veterans with Gulf War Syndrome suffer from mitocondrial dysfunction, and that can be caused by the aluminum adjuvant in vaccines besides other toxins. Research has shown motor neuron death is linked to aluminum adjuvant in vaccine dosages given to Gulf War soldiers prior to deployment.

And why would vaccinations be the cause of Gulf War Syndrome when other veterans who didn't serve in the Gulf War got the same vaccinations but didn't get the syndrome?

You can read the paper and article I linked to on adversonomics and vaccinomics and find the answers to your question.

 

[elohiym]

Pick a vaccine--any vaccine--and tell me exactly what harm comes from it.

Measles vaccine infects people with measles virus.

 

[User Name]

Measles vaccine infects people with measles virus.

I got that vaccine. How come I didn't get measles?

 

[elohiym]

I got that vaccine. How come I didn't get measles?

You did "get the measles." That was a live, attenuated measles virus they injected into you. Because you are gullible and superstitious you were tricked into believing you've never had the measles and the vaccine prevented infection.

This is supported by what I posted earlier from the journal paper, Adversonomics:

Indeed in the case of live vaccines, one might simplistically envision administration of such vaccines as an “infection” and conceptually study the susceptibility to such reactions in the same manner.​

 

[User Name]

Those lifestyles and behaviors are caused by something, right? Mitrocondrial dysfunction can cause intellectual dysfunction or psychological disturbances. Aluminum toxicity causes mitrocondrial dysfunction. The adjuvant in some vaccines is aluminum.

You mean that vaccines cause people to become stupider and therefore more likely to use tobacco products and drink alcoholic beverages?