10 Vaccines That Saved The World

[User Name]

The second article is really pathetic because supposed Torah scholars claim vaccines are kosher because you are injecting instead of ingesting unclean things. :doh: Lot's of crazy in that article. Hey, if you want to trust the opinion of people who can't discern the Messiah in the pages of the book you think they are interpreting properly this time, that's your call.

"The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat: all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do..." (Matthew 23:1-3)

Not all Jews agree with them; it's still a controversy.

Not all; however, 95% of Israeli children get their recommended vaccinations.

 

[User Name]

 

[elohiym]

A pretty graph doesn't make it true. All you have is pop-pseudo-science, smoke and mirrors. You can find informative graphs that show the morbidity and mortality of those diseases was decreasing prior to vaccination. Use Google.

 

[User Name]

We're not discussing high-tech science. There is nothing that Jenner did with smallpox that couldn't have been done in Moses' day, yet God did not command primitive vaccination. He commanded field sanitation, sterilization, quarantine and gave laws that would have precluded vaccination.

There's a lot of things we do today that "God did not command," such as using penicillin as an antibiotic, or pasteurization, for example:

Pasteur demonstrated that bacteria caused the souring of wine and beer, and later on showed that a similar process occurred in milk. He also explained that by boiling and then cooling a liquid, such as milk, the bacteria could be removed. The process we know as pasteurization comes from his surname.​

-- http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/medicine/modern-medicine.php

 

[elohiym]

"The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat: all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do..." (Matthew 23:1-3)

You don't do that. Are you wanting me to be a hypocrite like you?

Not all; however, 95% of Israeli children get their recommended vaccinations.

In violation of God's law, based on pseudo-science, they inject their children with vaccines, and some for infections that aren't even contagious. Their rebellion continues to this day and you applaud them. Sad.

 

[User Name]

You don't do that. Are you wanting me to be a hypocrite like you?

I'm simply pointing out that Jesus said that.

 

[elohiym]

There's a lot of things we do today that "God did not command," such as using penicillin as an antibiotic, or pasteurization, for example:

Pasteur demonstrated that bacteria caused the souring of wine and beer, and later on showed that a similar process occurred in milk. He also explained that by boiling and then cooling a liquid, such as milk, the bacteria could be removed. The process we know as pasteurization comes from his surname.​

-- http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/medicine/modern-medicine.php

God commanded sterilization by fire for contaminated items. Did you miss that part of the Bible? Raw milk doesn't need to be pasteurized when it's obtained in sanitary conditions so it would have been pointless for God to command pasteurization even though he could have.

My point was that primitive vaccination like Jenner allegedly accomplished was something that Moses could have done easily just as Jenner had, yet God did not command primitive vaccination. You can't compare primitive vaccination to antibiotics.

 

[CabinetMaker]

God commanded sterilization by fire for contaminated items. Did you miss that part of the Bible? Raw milk doesn't need to be pasteurized when it's obtained in sanitary conditions so it would have been pointless for God to command pasteurization even though he could have.

My point was that primitive vaccination like Jenner allegedly accomplished was something that Moses could have done easily just as Jenner had, yet God did not command primitive vaccination. You can't compare primitive vaccination to antibiotics.

Nor can you reasonably conclude that God forbade vaccination.

 

[elohiym]

Nor can you reasonably conclude that God forbade vaccination.

Exodus 15:26 And He said, "If you will give earnest heed to the voice of the LORD your God, and do what is right in His sight, and give ear to His commandments, and keep all His statutes, I will put none of the diseases on you which I have put on the Egyptians; for I, the LORD, am your healer."

Exodus 23:24,25 "You shall not worship their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their deeds; but you shall utterly overthrow them and break their sacred pillars in pieces. But you shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water; and I will remove sickness from your midst.

Leviticus 13-15 contains commands that vaccination clearly violates. When Jenner took the discharged pus from an unclean person, cut the skin of the boy and applied the pus to the wounds, it was a blatant violation of God's law.

 

[User Name]

You can't compare primitive vaccination to antibiotics.

Why can't you compare primitive vaccination to antibiotics?

The ancient Egyptians, the Chinese, and Indians of central America all used molds to treat infected wounds. However, they did not understand the connection of the antibacterial properties of mold and the treatment of diseases.​

-- http://inventors.about.com/od/pstartinventions/a/Penicillin_2.htm

 

[elohiym]

I'm simply pointing out that Jesus said that.

You were apparently doing more than that else your comment is pointless.

 

[User Name]

You were apparently doing more than that else your comment is pointless.

My point is that there is a lot in the Bible (especially the Old Testament) that you don't obey, Matthew 23:1-3 being but one example. And you have that right.

 

[elohiym]

Why can't you compare primitive vaccination to antibiotics?

The ancient Egyptians, the Chinese, and Indians of central America all used molds to treat infected wounds. However, they did not understand the connection of the antibacterial properties of mold and the treatment of diseases.​

-- http://inventors.about.com/od/pstartinventions/a/Penicillin_2.htm

You want to copy the Egyptians, after reading the Bible? :doh:

Antibiotics kills the good bacteria that inhabits the body, bacteria that is integral to your health and immune system. God created us to live symbiotically with those organisms. God would not command the use of a drug that weaken the immune system as antibiotics do. He uses the immune system to heal.

The argument against primitive antibiotics is the same as the arguments against primitive vaccination.

 

[User Name]

You want to copy the Egyptians, after reading the Bible? :doh:

Antibiotics kills the good bacteria that inhabits the body, bacteria that is integral to your health and immune system. God created us to live symbiotically with those organisms. God would not command the use of a drug that weaken the immune system as antibiotics do. He uses the immune system to heal.

The argument against primitive antibiotics is the same as the arguments against primitive vaccination.

If you have a wound that is infected with bad bacteria, you want antibiotics.

 

[elohiym]

My point is that there is a lot in the Bible (especially the Old Testament) that you don't obey, Matthew 23:1-3 being but one example. And you have that right.

You are basically arguing that because we don't sacrifice animals for sin any more, following God's health laws would no longer keep us healthy. Now you can leave your feces lying on the ground unburied, right? Now you can touch lepers, right? Now it's a good idea to take pus from sick people and smear it in your open wounds, right? No, you can't do any of that without the bad consequences God promised. Common sense.

 

[CabinetMaker]

Exodus 15:26 And He said, "If you will give earnest heed to the voice of the LORD your God, and do what is right in His sight, and give ear to His commandments, and keep all His statutes, I will put none of the diseases on you which I have put on the Egyptians; for I, the LORD, am your healer."

Exodus 23:24,25 "You shall not worship their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their deeds; but you shall utterly overthrow them and break their sacred pillars in pieces. But you shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water; and I will remove sickness from your midst.

Leviticus 13-15 contains commands that vaccination clearly violates. When Jenner took the discharged pus from an unclean person, cut the skin of the boy and applied the pus to the wounds, it was a blatant violation of God's law.

Sorry, but none of these versus can reasonably be used to justify your position. I agree that faith in God can protect us from much. I also know that none of us has faith the size of a mustard seed.

Also, I am a Christiaan, I am not subject to judgement under the Law of Moses.

 

[elohiym]

If you have a wound that is infected with bad bacteria, you want antibiotics.

Nonsense. The body is capable of fighting infection. God created the immune system. The bacteria in your gut is essential to your immune system but killed by antibiotics.

 

[User Name]

Nonsense. The body is capable of fighting infection. God created the immune system. The bacteria in your gut is essential to your immune system but killed by antibiotics.

So you are opposed to the use of antibiotics to treat infected wounds. Well you certainly have the right to opt out, although you should allow others their right to opt in if they wish.

Tell me, what other forms of modern medicine are you opposed to? All of it? You want no medical treatment and no surgery of any kind other than what is explicitly described in the Bible?

 

[1PeaceMaker]

So you are opposed to the use of antibiotics to treat infected wounds.

Babies, especially preemies, can actually die from antibiotics - or rather, their small intestine can die or develop a bleed as a result of gut colony die off. The situation isn't much better for adults.

Meanwhile antibiotics are actually causing the proliferation of much more virulent and deadly forms of bacteria, so much so that it has caused a scandal in the hospitals of America concerning accountability over superbugs like MRSA.

Because of the ills of antibiotics a certain loved one of mine might never see their grandchildren again, since they pose a constant threat of infection from systemic antibiotic resistant strains until they can eliminate it from their body completely, a hard thing for a diabetic to do. That was the result of just one surgical cancer treatment option being chosen in a dirty (but supposedly modern) hospital.

Well you certainly have the right to opt out, although you should allow others their right to opt in if they wish.

Why should you be allowed to opt-in to such a dangerous public health threat when there are other safer, scientifically proven methods for disease control?

 

[Omniskeptical]

I can't help but notice how curing snakebites [are] related to vaccination. I tend to think vaccination is snake medicine. :think: