It's not helpful to lie (Ga 5:9, Heb 13:9). :burnlib:
Why would God need a hell?
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It's not helpful to lie (Ga 5:9, Heb 13:9). :burnlib:
You don't tremble at his word (Is. 66:2, 5). You're not going to heaven (Rom. 2:8, 9). :burnlib:
When you begin to appreciate the exceeding sinfulness of sin, you'll have a shot (Ps 51:17, Re 3:17, 21:27).
Mickiel
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What does it mean that God is all and in all? What does Col. 3:11 mean when it states that even Christ is All and in All? Well it means that all humans are in the image of God, meaning they have conscious life. It does not mean all humans have the Holy Spirit of God living inside of them. It means we are conscious living beings, and Christ is the head of that conscious life , we live because of that. But HOW we live, is also an expression of what is inside of our consciousness; when we live continually consciously sinning as a way of thinking and living, we do not have the Holy Spirit of God , living inside of us. But Jesus is STILL our conscious life; still our Lord; still the reason we are alive. The life IN us IS Christ, how we think and live is the only true gauge as to how much Jesus has to do with our daily living.
Mickiel
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Well its a good thing you do not hold my ticket, or any humans ticket, because we would be doomed. That condemning spirit is a terror tactic which is a favorite trick of satan devil.
But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate [Rev. 2:14–15].
"The two items for condemnation were the doctrine of Balaam and the doctrine of the Nicolaitans. “The doctrine of Balaam” is different from the error of Balaam (see Jude 11), which revealed that Balaam thought that God would curse Israel because they were sinners. It is also different from the way of Balaam (see 2 Pet. 2:15), which was covetousness. But here in the verse before us, it is the doctrine or teaching of Balaam. He taught Balac the way to corrupt Israel by intermarriage with the Moabite women. This introduced into the nation of Israel both idolatry and fornication. And during the historical period which the church at Pergamum represents, the unconverted world came into the church.
“The doctrine of the Nicolaitans.” We have seen that the church in Ephesus hated it, but here in Pergamum there were some who were holding that doctrine. Although we do not know exactly what the doctrine was, it probably was a gnostic cult developed by Nicolaus which advocated license in matters of Christians’ conduct and apparently a return to religious rituals by clergy, ignoring the priesthood of all believers. Christ says that He hates it! You see, Christ hates as well as loves. We had better be careful that we are not indulging in the things that He hates." McGee, J. V. (1991). Thru the Bible Commentary: The Prophecy (Revelation 1-5) (electronic ed., Vol. 58, pp. 82–83). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
Mickiel
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You just have to wonder, if Jesus abolished death, how could he then allow humans to die forever? 2 Tim. 1:10, Jesus has abolished death, and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. How can he have abolished death, if millions of humans will be put to death forever in the Great White Throne judgment?
:yawn: God determines what is just (Deut. 32:4). Don't hate us because we're beautiful (Mt 25:41). :straight:
This life is not a game (Pr 16:18).
"Is 57:16. For—referring to the promise in Is 57:14, 15, of restoring Israel when “contrite” (Ge 6:3; 8:21; Ps 78:38, 39; 85:5; Mic 7:18). God “will not contend for ever” with His people, for their human spirit would thereby be utterly crushed, whereas God’s object is to chasten, not to destroy them (La 3:33, 34; La 3:33, 34, Mic 7:8, 9). With the ungodly He is “angry every day” (Ps 7:11; Rev 14:11)." Jamieson, R., Fausset, A. R., & Brown, D. (1997). Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible (Vol. 1, p. 495). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.
Mt 7:20
"“...Christ is all things and in all things. Christ has dispossessed and obliterated all distinctions of religious prerogative and intellectual preeminence and social caste; Christ has substituted Himself for all these; Christ occupies the whole sphere of human life and permeates all its developments.”
Translation. Stop lying to one another, having stripped off and away from yourselves and for your own advantage, the old man with his wicked doings, and having clothed yourselves with the new man who is constantly being renewed, with a resulting full and perfect knowledge which is according to the image of the One who created him; in which state there cannot be Greek or Jew, circumcision or uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, slave, or free man, but Christ is all things and in all things." [Lightfoot] Wuest, K. S. (1997). Wuest’s word studies from the Greek New Testament: for the English reader (Col 3:9). Grand Rapids: Eerdmans.
The wicked will experience a second death (Re 21:8).
But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel [2 Tim. 1:10].
"Now this is a verse that deserves great emphasis.
“Who hath abolished death” is literally since He has made of none effect death. Death means something altogether different to the child of God—Christ made it of no effect. Now, God did not eliminate death. Remember that Paul is writing this letter from prison where the sentence of death is upon him. But Paul is not talking about physical death. He means spiritual death, eternal death, which is separation from God. Christ has indeed abolished spiritual death so that no sinner need go to a place where he’ll be eternally separated from God. Christ is our Mediator, the one Mediator between God and man. God is satisfied with what Christ has done for us. The question is: Are you satisfied? Or are you trying to save yourself by your own good works? Let me repeat what I have said before: Man cannot be saved by perfect obedience, because he is incapable of rendering it. He cannot be saved by imperfect obedience, because God will not accept it. There is only one solution to the dilemma, and that is the One who said, “… I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me” (John 14:6)." McGee, J. V. (1991). Thru the Bible commentary: The Epistles (1 and 2 Timothy/Titus/Philemon) (electronic ed., Vol. 50, pp. 98–99). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
:yawn: Rev. 22:18, 19, 2 Cor. 4:2
:noway: You're projecting again (Eph 4:14).
Of course you haven't seen him destroy both soul and body. That hasn't happened yet, it will happen on the Day of Judgment and Destruction of the Ungodly. 2 Peter 3:7
Lon
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Well, I "made a fair point" already, so I'm not sure that the direction to 'think' is necessary.Now, I used the above scenario deliberately this time around and taking into account your belief so please think before answering.
First, God cares for all human beings. We have to eliminate some of your scenario if such is true. Does this mean 'no hell!' I don't think it does. I try not to 'emote' when thinking of such things. Do we 'need' to emote? I think we do, but it should be set aside when we go to looking at what are facts and what we cannot change. Dealing effectively with information at that point, is more important than 'how I feel about it.' You and I will agree that if it is all true, as given, we are in a desperate need. The cure is given as faith and trust in Jesus Christ and what He has done for us. Those are the larger things on the 'reality table.' I'm hoping that I'm not side-stepping your scenario so much as taking your greater concerns by the horns as it were and addressing that which is. There is a LOT of emoting in this thread. My concern, as I've repeatedly stated is not 'what we'd like to have happen' but rather 'what is.' We all necessarily have to live with what is actually.
The point was that "I" can't make hell subjectively go away. You? It seems that "if I can argue logically against it, it must not exist" is more than a little 'subjective.' I personally know I have no control whatsoever over the existence of hell.
way 2 go
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karma
murder a person -1 ,fornicate have a child +1 = even
God standard for being with him in heaven is absolute righteousness
murder a person - infinity ,fornicate -∞, bastard child -∞ =hell
Heb 10:29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy of punishment, the one who has trampled the Son of God, and who has counted the blood of the covenant with which he was sanctified an unholy thing, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?
Prizebeatz1
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Good one.
That is one, here's another, eternity without God.
Mickiel
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That verse says absolutely nothing about a human consciousness being destroyed. Now, you have your whole bible with you, show me anywhere in it that a human consciousness is destroyed forever. Now if its what you believe, you should have at least 3 to 10 verses bearing witness to it; lets have them.
Mickiel
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As the parade of Christians who would subtract God from the future of unbelievers increases, I bear witness that Christians cannot reduce salvation, no matter how hard they try. 2 Pet. 3:15, " The Longsuffering of our Lord IS Salvation."
God is right now suffering himself with you, he is going through this period FOR your salvation.
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