Death is separation of body and spirit. The body decomposes and the spirit returns to the Father who gave it.
Why Some Are Hell Bound
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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Death is separation of body and spirit. The body decomposes and the spirit returns to the Father who gave it.
We are. I'm using died as a contradistinction to life. You seem to be using death as another form of life.
I maintain eternal life is a gift, you're maintaining it is inherent.
If eternal life is inherent then why would the Word become human and manifest a pseudo-death.
Paul taught there is a natural body and there is a spiritual body.
Keypurr maintains the Son had a natural body that died and a spiritual body that didn't. You and he are on the same page.
Someone said, "You shall not surely die" as opposed to someone else who said, "For in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."
This was in reference to spiritual death, which you deny.
A spirit without a body is a no body.
Soul sleep is to help men that are not that smart
Do you mean such as Paul?
That's a nice thought, but it doesn't work that way.
Body and Spirit go into the ground and come out together in the resurrection, 1 Corinthians 15:35-58.
Then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it. (Ecclesiastes 12:7)
To preach telepathically requires that each spirit must have a mind to process the communication.
To preach audibly each spirit must not only have a mind but also a mouth with lips, teeth, tongue, as well as vocal cords and lungs.
We know that spirits can communicate telepathically because God knows our thoughts and once we have his spirit we can know his thoughts if we listen.
It's a Jewish concept back in Jesus time.
An Extract Out of Josephus’ Discourse to the Greeks Concerning Hades
- The Works of Flavius Josephus.
2. In this region there is a certain place set apart, as a lake of unquenchable fire, whereinto we suppose no one hath hitherto been cast; but it is prepared for a day afore-determined by God, in which one righteous sentence shall deservedly be passed upon all men; when the unjust, and those that have been disobedient to God, and have given honor to such idols as have been the vain operations of the hands of men as to God himself, shall be adjudged to this everlasting punishment, as having been the causes of defilement; while the just shall obtain an incorruptible and never-fading kingdom. These are now indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place wherein the unjust are confined.
Yeah, it makes me wonder if Jacob's people were ever in Egypt.
Maybe just on a visit to see the pyramids and such.
That's not important while you won't have any evidence that it's originated from Egypt. The point is, "throwing to the Lake of Fire" is from Jesus who extended the concept to make it legitimate.
There is a marker to the sun god in the front yard of the Vatican that gives it away.
The marker was dressed up with a cross to make it appear Christian.
jsanford108
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What? You didn't know about the cross on top?
Yeah, it's there, that's what makes it Christian.
Stick a cross on Halloween and its Christian.
Stick a cross on Christmas and its Christian.
Stick a cross on Easter and its Christian.
Stick a cross on the sun day and its Christian.
What more do you want?
jsanford108
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Simple placement of an object doesn't make it Christian.
Likewise, calling something "pagan" doesn't make it so. I can call a church building "pagan." I can call a pagan a "pagan." One is an accurate attribute. However, simple calling the pagan a "pagan" did not make it truth. It is the acts and faith of the pagan that makes the label true.
What makes anything Christian is the faith and attributes that are placed up one it. A cross is just a piece of wood. But placement of Christ upon a cross once, made the cross an eternal symbol. A statue of a Cherubim is just a statue. But when God commanded the Hebrews to place them on opposing sides of the Ark, they became an image of power and majesty.
I could go on all day about symbolism, allegories, sacraments, metaphors, etc.
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Are you saying a steeple doesn't mark a place where sun day observers assemble?
jsanford108
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Not at all. It is where those who celebrate and worship God assemble. It can be any day. Most observe Sunday as the weekly requirement, which is rooted in Catholic tradition, practice, and observance.
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Paul doesn't need to be smart if God breathed his words in him. Smart doesn't count
So smart doesn't count with regard to soul sleep, right?
Paul said, "We'll not all sleep...
Bard_the_Bowman
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Hey Jamie,
Actually I think we are somewhat close in what we are saying. But not exactly the same.
For example:
That is exactly what I said in post #79.
Or, in Jesus' case, He preaches to the spirits in prison.
I think maybe, and I could be wrong, but I think maybe that you believe that the when the spirit of a human being returns to the Father it is unaware of that, unconscious, "dead".
I believe it is conscious, aware, alive. Just disconnected from the body. I think the book of Revelation and Hebrews supports this.
It depends on how we use the term "eternal life".
If we mean the reward of Heaven, then I agree, it is a gift.
If we mean simply existing after the separation of the spirit and body, then it is inherent.
Some people inherit eternal life(heaven) while others are cast into everlasting punishment, according to Jesus:
"And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” (Matthew 25:46).
But both groups have an existence after the separation of their spirits from their bodies.
The separation of Jesus' Spirit from His body was death. Not a pseudo-death and we already agreed that that is what a death is.
He became human because His death opened up the gates of Heaven and gives humans the opportunity to obtain the reward of Heaven.
Yeah, it sounds like we are. Human beings have a natural body that dies and a spirit (but not a "body" attached to it) that doesn't...until the Second Coming of Christ and the Resurrection. Paul is referring to our reuniting of our bodies to our spirits at that time.
First of all, prior to that occurrence, Adam and Eve lived in perfect harmony with God, each other, and creation. If they wouldn't have sinned, they would never have died. They could've just kept going like they were.
But since they did that, sin entered the world and they could die.
They didn't physically die that day. And they didn't spiritually die that day, either in a literal sense or they would have just been zombies, I guess from that day forward. Bodies walking around with no spirits.
They broke the relationship they had with God. The wages of sin is death, so even though they didn't die that very day....they were going to die, physically, at some point.
Cute saying but it isn't true.
God the Father is pure Spirit. He has an intellect and a will. He is a person. He isn't "nobody".
God the Son was pure Spirit. He created every single thing in creation in that state before He humbled Himself to take on flesh and sacrifice His life for love of us. He is a person.
God the Holy Spirit is pure Spirit. He has an intellect and a will. He is a person.
The angels are pure spirit beings with no physical bodies. They have intellects and wills. They are persons.
Human beings are unique creatures because we are sortof the boundary between animals and angels. We are a composite of spiritual beings wrapped in animal flesh. We are both. By nature. That's the way God made us.
Death disconnects us from our bodies but doesn't annihilate us from existence.
We will be reunited with our bodies, like Jesus was, at His Second Coming.
Peace.
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