Where Does It Say In The Bible That You Go Directly To Heaven When You Die?

genuineoriginal

New member
Paul would NOT have suggested evil as good.
Go think about it someone.

Never mind don’t think about it more. Obey first and humble yourself.
You are coming unglued.
Calm down.


Give a scripture that I referenced and or quoted that has to do with demons. Do it now or repent.
You have mentioned several times about the Pharisees believing in spirits.
Here are the verses:

Acts 23:8-9
8 For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, neither angel, nor spirit: but the Pharisees confess both.
9 And there arose a great cry: and the scribes that were of the Pharisees' part arose, and strove, saying, We find no evil in this man: but if a spirit or an angel hath spoken to him, let us not fight against God.​

 

Derf

Well-known member
There is a detailed analysis in this article of whether the comma can go in front of "today" in the verse. I am posting only the final paragraph because it is so long:

The Significance of a Comma: An Analysis of Luke 23:43
On the other hand, if we read “today” with the preceding verb, Jesus’ statement may indeed sound somewhat pleonastic in modern, Western languages, but this pleonasm becomes fully acceptable if understood as an idiomatic way to emphasize the significance of the announcement: “Truly, I tell you today . . .” Finally, there is also enough evidence that this way of understanding the passage is neither new nor illegitimate, as this shows exactly how important segments of the church understood it, even in a time when the belief on the immortality of the soul had already become predominant in Christianity. What the thief asked Jesus was to be remembered in His kingdom (Luke 23:42), and this is exactly what Jesus promised him, thus the dying man received peace and comfort. This is the great promise of the gospel—to be with Jesus forever (John 14:1–3; 1 Thess. 4:16, 17; Rev. 21:1–4).​

I appreciate the reference. I'll look at it when I get time.
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
A person who has died receives a new body in a well known Biblical event called the Resurrection.
I am sure you have heard of it and can find your own scriptures.

What kind of bodies will the saints who will have previously died physically be in just prior to when the following happens?:

"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air" (1 Thess.4:16-17).​
 

genuineoriginal

New member
What kind of bodies will the saints who will have previously died physically be in just prior to when the following happens?:

"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air" (1 Thess.4:16-17).​
Job gives the answer.

Job 19:26
26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:​

 

God's Truth

New member
Nothing in the verse states that Jesus preached the gospel.

1 Peter 3:19-20
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.​

Here are some options for who the spirits in prison are and what was preached to them:

(1 Pet. 3:19-20) Where did Jesus go during the three days in the grave?
WHOM did he preach to?
OPTION #1: Jesus preached to the humans in Noah’s day. Under this view, when Peter refers to “spirits” now in prison, Peter could have been referring to those disobedient people from Noah’s day, who are in hell. If Jesus was preaching through Noah (2 Pet. 2:5), then he could have been preaching repentance to these people. However, the Greek word for “spirits” (pneuma) almost always refers to “malevolent supernatural beings.” Typically, the word used for dead humans is the Greek word psychē, which Peter does not use here.
OPTION #2: Jesus preached to the evil spirits of Noah’s day. Peter is referring to the evil spirits, who produced the nephilim (Gen. 6:4; c.f. 2 Pet. 2:4). However, other interpreters ask why Jesus would only preach to these spirits from Noah’s generation and not others.
WHAT did he preach?
OPTION #1: Jesus preached a message of forgiveness. If Jesus was preaching through Noah to the people of his day, then this could refer to a message of forgiveness and repentance.
OPTION #2: Jesus preached a message of judgment or victory over Satan. If Jesus was preaching after his resurrection to demons, then this would be a message of victory over Satan—not forgiveness—because the Bible doesn’t teach demon-salvation (Heb. 2:16). Advocates of this view note that Jesus merely “went and made proclamation” (v.19). Peter uses the Greek word kēryssō here for “proclamation,” rather than the typical term euangelizō—used for gospel preaching (as in 4:6). Since this doesn’t explicitly say what type of proclamation was made, it’s equally possible that this was a proclamation of judgment over the demonic realm (Col. 2:15).
Conclusion
Because this is such an unclear passage, we shouldn’t build any serious doctrines on it. It is a hermeneutical rule that we should interpret the unclear in light of the clear.​

Can you rely on the written word and the Holy Spirit?

Do we have to debate according to the false teachers you picked who tickled your ears?
 

God's Truth

New member
GO,

I will get to what the teacher's options that you have chosen.

This is sad and more proof of a dead conversation with you.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
Can you rely on the written word and the Holy Spirit?

Do we have to debate according to the false teachers you picked who tickled your ears?

That is what I do.

We are debating according to the doctrines of men that you are believing in despite the words of the Bible.

You are showing how worldly you are. Do you really have to react in such a way?

Romans 2:1
1 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.​

 

God's Truth

New member

Romans 2:1
1 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.​


You are the one doing that.

For goodness sake, read more carefully what I am saying and more importantly---read for yourself what the scriptures say.

I speak of spirits concerning the Spirit of Jesus and of angels and of men; and you come on and say it is of demons.

Think for yourself and stop linking to your false teachers. You copy and paste what idiots say.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
read for yourself what the scriptures say.
Think for yourself and stop linking to your false teachers.
You copy and paste what idiots say.
I do read for myself what scriptures say.
I provide links to articles where other people have independently come to similar understandings of the scripture as I have.
I do not get my teaching from the links I post, I get them from what the Bible states first, then find the articles of others afterwards.

For goodness sake, read more carefully what I am saying
Where did you get your belief that the human spirit lives on without a body after death?
You did not get it from the Bible, you got it from your culture and are reading the Bible with that belief firmly in place, and your beliefs are coloring your understanding of the Bible.

Where did I get my belief that the human spirit has no consciousness?
From reading the Bible with the understanding that the beliefs of my culture can be wrong and identifying what the Bible actually states and what it does not actually state despite the beliefs of my culture.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
There are other scriptures that prove our spirits live on in consciousness.
Do you want me to help you find them?
You are going against it so how can you find what you say doesn't exist?
You do not seem to be able to find the scriptures you claim will prove that our spirits live on in consciousness.
I have studied both sides of the argument and am aware of some verses that are used for your side of it that you seem to be unaware of.
Here are the greatest two passages of the Bible that can be used to support your belief that the spirit lives on in consciousness:

1 Samuel 28:3,8,11-15
3 Now Samuel was dead, and all Israel had lamented him, and buried him in Ramah, even in his own city. And Saul had put away those that had familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of the land.

8 And Saul disguised himself, and put on other raiment, and he went, and two men with him, and they came to the woman by night: and he said, I pray thee, divine unto me by the familiar spirit, and bring me him up, whom I shall name unto thee.

11 Then said the woman, Whom shall I bring up unto thee? And he said, Bring me up Samuel.
12 And when the woman saw Samuel, she cried with a loud voice: and the woman spake to Saul, saying, Why hast thou deceived me? for thou art Saul.
13 And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.
14 And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself.
15 And Samuel said to Saul, Why hast thou disquieted me, to bring me up? And Saul answered, I am sore distressed; for the Philistines make war against me, and God is departed from me, and answereth me no more, neither by prophets, nor by dreams: therefore I have called thee, that thou mayest make known unto me what I shall do.​


Luke 16:19-31
19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.​

 

God's Truth

New member
Nothing in the verse states that Jesus preached the gospel.

1 Peter 3:19-20
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

You left out the scripture that says he preached the gospel.


Here are some options for who the spirits in prison are and what was preached to them:

(1 Pet. 3:19-20) Where did Jesus go during the three days in the grave?

See right there is a hidden link that you are hiding the fact that you merely copy and pasted someone else’s work.

WHOM did he preach to?
OPTION #1: Jesus preached to the humans in Noah’s day.

That scripture does not say that.

Under this view, when Peter refers to “spirits” now in prison, Peter could have been referring to those disobedient people from Noah’s day, who are in hell. If Jesus was preaching through Noah (2 Pet. 2:5),
Nowhere anywhere does it say Jesus preached through Noah in that scripture.

then he could have been preaching repentance to these people. However, the Greek word for “spirits” (pneuma) almost always refers to “malevolent supernatural beings.” Typically, the word used for dead humans is the Greek word psychē, which Peter does not use here.

So why did you even post this then?

You are just copying and pasting another false teachers beliefs.

OPTION #2: Jesus preached to the evil spirits of Noah’s day. Peter is referring to the evil spirits, who produced the nephilim (Gen. 6:4; c.f. 2 Pet. 2:4). However, other interpreters ask why Jesus would only preach to these spirits from Noah’s generation and not others.

That is stupid.

Jesus isn’t going to preach the gospel that saves to evil spirits.
 

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Job gives the answer.

Job 19:26
26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:​


That didn't answer my question. I asked you what kind of body the saints will have on at the time when they are raised from the dead:

What kind of bodies will the saints who will have previously died physically be in just prior to when the following happens?:

"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air" (1 Thess.4:16-17).​

What kind of body will the saints be in prior to the time when they are raised first?
 
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