What say you? Is the Bride the same as the body of Christ?
- Thread starter glorydaz
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glorydaz
Well-known member
Ah, well you're free to interpret the Bible however you want. Doesn't mean you're correct, however.
The warnings, admonitions, and exhortations have been highly successful so far.
Thanks be to God.
Was going to ask you this earlier...
If you asked your spouse to borrow their car, and then pull down the visor to find the keys, but instead find a note that says, "Remember, don't commit adultery," would you be pleased by that? Or would you feel saddened, perhaps horrified?
I would be puzzled.
I would wonder who left the message first, and then, why.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Really? Are you bragging again?
glorydaz
Well-known member
Flee also youthful lusts.
You may have missed the "Thanks be to God" portion of my post.
It's your husband's (correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression you're a lady) handwriting. A note he left for himself.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
I would have thought this passage would have been cited by now :
Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
Ephesians 2:11-16
Israel after the flesh may be called the bride, but God has always had in mind this one body that was originally identified with Israel. While that bride was unfaithful (and partially divorced by God), the body God had in mind is still this same single body. And now that body is seen to be all those "made nigh by the blood of Christ". The commonwealth of Israel was a representation to the nations of God's holiness and covenant faithfulness. That is now made real in Christ to every individual. There may (and I believe there is) some unique importance to being an Israelite, but in terms of being in Christ, none of that matters. The body and bride of Christ is the same things in terms of a body. Just as Israel after the flesh was called the bride in the Old Testament, so too now the church (which includes believing Israel) is what is called the body of Christ - and both are represented in the New Jerusalem (Rev 21:9). The nation of Israel represented by the tribes (Rev 21:12) as the gates and the blood bought church as the foundation (Rev 21:14). Without getting into detailed interpretation, both are there as part of the same body. But notice that no one enters the city without having their name in the Lamb's book of life (Rev 21:27). So all this is wrapped up in Christ and His church (Matt 16:18) and national Israel is a representation of those who are God's and were faithful to what had not yet been revealed. They have a special place in the New Jerusalem (just my spin - they are the gates because National Israel was God's people first; so others come to the Kingdom by the benefit of their experience - but without the blood of Christ none are a part of the Kingdom).
The best way I can think of how to perceive it is to recognize what Jesus said and apply it to this imagery :
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.
Luke 9:24
Israel after the flesh - by enlarge - was clinging to its natural identity and wouldn't give it up. By that, I mean they clung to what they could see and their own ideas of what God was looking for (i.e. they thought it was them - personally - as Israelites). But that's not what God was ever looking for. So those that didn't believe are not part of that body or bride. But for those that did give up their identity for Christ (in whom this identity is complete), they found what that real identity was. Not a national one, but a spiritual one in Christ.
I am a man, and as ladies have no right to usurp authority over men, I wouldn't try to teach anything online if I were.
That aside, If I found that note on my wife's visor, I would ask her why it was there, in hope that she would say..."I put bible verses up there all the time to keep my mind focused on God and on his will."
If it was something else, we would talk about it, like we usually do.
Then I would ask her why she leaves her keys in the car !
glorydaz
Well-known member
So, the body of Christ (neither Jew nor Greek) but made up of believing Jews and Gentiles, is also the Bride because of those faithful Jews who believed the Gospel of Grace? If that's what you're saying, I find it very interesting. I'd never thought of it like that before.
Rom 7:4..."Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God."
As both Jew and Gentile were freed from the Law by the body of Christ, both should be "married" to Him who was raised from the dead.
Such picturesque writing really gets the message through.
nikolai_42
Well-known member
I've never fully articulated it before now (part of the reason I was drawn to this thread), so I can't be 100% certain, but that sounds like a fair summary.
Apologies for the mistake.
Except it's not a verse. It's literally just "Remember, don't commit adultery."
Would you be pleased that she has a reminder of the law "do not commit adultery" in her visor?
Would you not think that she's struggling with remaining faithful to you?
(Please note, this is all hypothetical, and in no way am I suggesting you or your wife would cheat on each other.)
If you asked your wife what I asked you, "if you found a note in the visor of my car that said "remember, do not commit adultery," would you be happy or angry?" what would she say?
I can almost guarantee you that she would be furious and/or distraught, because the implication is that you're struggling to remain faithful to her, and apparently need a reminder to stay faithful.
(By the way, this goes to show the difference between men's and women's minds.)
Let me ask you a similar question as a follow up:
What if, instead of a note that says, "Reminder, don't commit adultery," it's a note that says, "Reminder, love your husband"? Compared to how you feel about the former note, would you feel happy or sad? Or perhaps, as I would, would you not even think twice about it?
Do you see the problem yet?
The law (be it the 10 Commandments or the note that says "Reminder, don't commit adultery") will only bring condemnation, it cannot bring about obedience. Not only does it give opportunity to sin,:
But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead.I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died.And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death.For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. - Romans 7:8-11 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans7:8-11&version=NKJV
it's also an indicator (but not necessarily a guarantee), especially if it's a Christian who is trying to keep it, that they are struggling with whatever sin that law is about.
You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?You who say, “Do not commit adultery,” do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law? - Romans 2:21-23 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans2:21-23&version=NKJV
Here's my point, and Paul's:
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.” - Romans 1:16-17 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans1:16-17&version=NKJV
They don't live by law. The note, "Reminder, do not commit adultery," is a law.
glorydaz
Well-known member
glorydaz
Well-known member
It certainly fits with this verse.
Rom 7:4..."Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God."
Especially considering who Paul is addressing here.
Romans 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
glorydaz
Well-known member
Usurping authority over men has NOTHING to do with posting on a theology forum. Egads
That reminds me of the "grafted in" of Rom. 11.