toldailytopic: What should be done with Planned Parenthood? Defund or continued suppo

aCultureWarrior

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Read the OP and try again
"Defund or continued support?"

Should Planned Parenthood received public funds?

Murder shouldn't be allowed, let alone funded.

Comprende' mi amigo?

One is either a member of the Libertarian party or they are not. I am 0% Libertarian despite hearing "Libertarian doctrine" from your kinda/former pastor.

So you're not even "kinda" a Libertarian?

Gee, you really had me fooled in the "No Libertarian Option?" thread.

Let me guess, you were just playing the role of "the devil's advocate"?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil's_advocate
 

PureX

Well-known member
People will suffer and die if Planned Parenthood isn't given public funds? How so?
62% of what Planned Parenthood does involves cancer and AIDS screening, as well as testing for other sexually transmitted diseases. 35% involves providing safe contraception. And 3% of what they do involves abortion services. And except for abortion, most of these services are being provided to people who have no health insurance or other means of obtaining them. So in fact Planned Parenthood is one of the only preventative health care providers in existence that serves the uninsured. Without them, these people would have to wait until their illnesses were life-threatening, and then go to an ER to get any form of health care at all. So Planned Parenthood saves lives, and saves people from a lot of unnecessary suffering by offering early screening and preventative health care services.
 

WizardofOz

New member
Murder shouldn't be allowed, let alone funded.

Comprende' mi amigo?

So you agree with me. Is it "Libertarian doctrine" when you say it?

So you're not even "kinda" a Libertarian?

Gee, you really had me fooled in the "No Libertarian Option?" thread.

Let me guess, you were just playing the role of "the devil's advocate"?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil's_advocate

That you don't know the difference between libertarian and Libertarian isn't my problem.

Maybe you should ask Hutch to explain it to you.
 

WizardofOz

New member
62% of what Planned Parenthood does involves cancer and AIDS screening, as well as testing for other sexually transmitted diseases. 35% involves providing safe contraception. And 3% of what they do involves abortion services. And except for abortion, most of these services are being provided to people who have no health insurance or other means of obtaining them. So in fact Planned Parenthood is one of the only preventative health care providers in existence that serves the uninsured. Without them, these people would have to wait until their illnesses were life-threatening, and then go to an ER to get any form of health care at all. So Planned Parenthood saves lives, and saves people from a lot of unnecessary suffering by offering early screening and preventative health care services.
:idea:
They should stop offering abortion services. That way, people wouldn't have a moral objection to their public funding.
 
That people will suffer and die, isn't a good reason?
Originally Posted by Saved.One.by.Grace
Pure liberal/socialist hogwash. Everyone should know by now that you cannot trust everything in wikipedia. Source for below article previously cited in my earlier post.


Planned Parenthood profiting at taxpayers' expense

Jan 16, 2013

This month marks the 40th anniversary of the passage of Roe v. Wade — the abortion decision. Planned Parenthood and those who support the culture of death will celebrate while those who embrace the culture of life will mourn the loss of 55 million Americans destroyed in this holocaust.

The reason for PP’s celebration may be its recently released annual report showing a record number of 333,964 abortions performed in 2011 at the going rate of $451 for an early stage abortion. This figure does not take into account the lucrative income obtained for chemical or later surgical abortions — big business indeed.


While the number of abortions increased at the clinics, the number of other services was down. Since 2009, PP’s cancer screenings dropped 29 percent while contraceptive services dropped 12 percent. The number of mammograms performed has (surprise!) remained the same at 0 percent.

The slogan adopted by Planned Parenthood Federation of America is “Care. No matter what” and we, the taxpayers, should care since we foot the bill. The money given to them by Congress was $55 million more than given in the year 2010 for a total of $542 million in federal, state and local government funding.


Planned Parenthood continues to perform record numbers of abortions and receives a record amount of taxpayer revenue but, with 40 years of pro-life advocacy/education and modern technology (ultrasound), truth about the profit-driven abortion industry will prevail. May we look forward to the day when our nation no longer commemorates the passage of this ill-conceived, tragic bill of death.


Barbara Martin,
Fort Collins
 
Minnesota Citizens Concerned for Life

United States Abortion Statistics

54,559,615 abortions 1973–2011

Reported abortions in the United States, by year

view.image


The Alan Guttmacher Institute (a special affiliate to Planned Parenthood), which actively collects the abortion data directly from providers. All numbers reported are voluntary; there are no laws requiring abortionists to report to any national agency the numbers of abortions they perform. 2009-2011 are estimates of 1,212,400 annually.

http://www.mccl.org/us-abortion-stats.html
 
U.S. Abortion Statistics

Facts and figures relating to the frequency of abortion in the United States.

Primary abortion statistics in the U.S. are available from two sources, privately from The Guttmacher Institute (AGI) and publicly from the Centers for Disease Control (CDC). In 2009 (the most recent year for which CDC data is available), California, Delaware, Maryland, and New Hampshire did not provide abortion reports to the federal government. Since California has not complied with CDC requests for abortion data in many years, and since California accounts for more abortions than any other state in the U.S, CDC totals are routinely incomplete. AGI, on the other hand, is the research arm of Planned Parenthood, the world's largest abortion provider. While their data is helpful, they are a much less neutral source. The following information has been gleaned from both sources to provide an overview of the frequency and demography of abortion. Additional, secondary statistics have been taken from the National Abortion Federation's (NAF) 2009 teaching text on abortion, Management of Unintended and Abnormal Pregnancy: Comprehensive Abortion Care.

TO LEARN MORE ABOUT ABORTION, VISIT: Prenatal Development, Abortion Procedures or Abortion Pictures

IF YOU ARE PREGNANT AND NEED HELP, VISIT: OptionLine.org

ANNUAL ABORTION STATISTICS


  • In 2008, approximately 1.21 million abortions took place in the U.S., down from an estimated 1.29 million in 2002, 1.31 million in 2000 and 1.36 million in 1996. From 1973 through 2008, nearly 50 million legal abortions have occurred in the U.S. (AGI).
  • In 2009, the highest number of reported abortions occurred in New York (119,996), Florida (81,918) and Texas (77,630); the fewest occurred in Wyoming (≤20), South Dakota (769) and North Dakota (1,290) (CDC).
  • The 2009 abortion ratios by state ranged from a low of 57 abortions per 1,000 live births in Mississippi (Wyoming had too few abortions for reliable tabulation) to a high of 713 abortions per 1,000 live births in NYC (CDC).
  • The annual number of legal induced abortions in the United States doubled between 1973 and 1979, and peaked in 1990. There was a slow but steady decline through the 1990's. Overall, the number of annual abortions decreased by 6% between 2000 and 2009, with temporary spikes in 2002 and 2006 (CDC).
  • The US abortion rate is similar to those of Australia, New Zealand, and Sweden but higher than those of other Western European countries (NAF).
  • In 1998, the last year for which estimates were made, more than 23% of legal induced abortions were performed in California (CDC).
  • In 2005, the abortion rate in the United States was higher than recent rates reported for Canada and Western European countries and lower than rates reported for China, Cuba, the majority of Eastern European countries, and certain Newly Independent States of the former Soviet Union (CDC).
  • Nearly half of pregnancies among American women are unintended; about 4 in 10 of these are terminated by abortion. Twenty-two percent of all U.S. pregnancies end in abortion. (AGI).
WHO HAS ABORTIONS?


  • In 2009, 85% of all abortions were performed on unmarried women (CDC).
  • Women living with a partner to whom they are not married account for 25% of abortions but only about 10% of women in the population (NAF).
  • In 2009, 55.3% of abortions were performed on women who had not aborted in the past; 36.6% were performed on women with one or two prior abortions, and 8.1% were performed on women with three or more prior abortions (CDC).
  • Among women who obtained abortions in 2009, 40.2% had no prior live births; 46.3% had one or two prior live births, and 13.6% had three or more prior live births (CDC).
  • Women between the ages of 20-24 obtained 33% of all abortions in 2009; women between 25-29 obtained 24% (CDC).
  • In 2009, women aged 20-29 years had the highest abortion rates (27.4 abortions per 1,000 women aged 20-24 years and 20.4 abortions per 1,000 women aged 25-29 years) (CDC).
  • 50% of U.S. women obtaining abortions are younger than 25; women aged 20-24 obtain 33% of all U.S. abortions and teenagers obtain 17% (AGI).
  • In 2009, adolescents under 15 years obtained .05% of all abortions, but had the highest abortion ratio, 785 abortions for every 1,000 live births (CDC).
  • Black women are more than 4.8 times more likely than non-Hispanic white women to have an abortion, and Hispanic women are 2.7 times as likely (AGI).
  • The abortion rate of non-metropolitan women is about half that of women who live in metropolitan counties (NAF).
  • The abortion rate of women with Medicaid coverage is three times as high as that of other women (NAF).
  • 37% of women obtaining abortions identify themselves as Protestant, and 28% identify themselves as Catholic (AGI).
  • At current rates, nearly one-third of American women will have an abortion (AGI).
WHY ARE ABORTIONS PERFORMED?


  • On average, women give at least 3 reasons for choosing abortion: 3/4 say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or other responsibilities; about 3/4 say they cannot afford a child; and 1/2 say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner (AGI).
  • Only 12% of women included a physical problem with their health among reasons for having an abortion (NAF).
  • One per cent (of aborting women) reported that they were the survivors of rape (NAF).
WHEN DO ABORTIONS OCCUR?


  • 88-92% of all abortions happen during the first trimester, prior to the 13th week of gestation (AGI/CDC).
  • In 2009, 7% of all abortions were performed at 14-20 weeks' gestation; 1.3% were performed at ≥21 weeks' gestation (CDC).
  • Percentage of 2009 Reported Abortions by Weeks of Gestation* (CDC):
    ≤6 wks 7 wks 8 wks 9 wks 10 wks 11 wks 12 wks 13 wks 14-15 wks 16-17 wks 18-20 wks ≥21 wks 32.3% 17.8% 14.0% 9.3% 6.6% 5.1% 3.9% 2.8% 3.4% 1.9% 1.8% 1.3% *Gestational weeks are measured from the first day of the woman's last menstruation and not from the day of conception. Though it does not provide an accurate fetal age (which is roughly 2 weeks less than the gestational age), it is the simplest way for an OB/GYN to age a pregnancy since the day of conception is often not known. Hence, if an abortion occurs at 8 weeks gestation, it is actually aborting a 6 week embryo. The images on our Prenatal Development and Abortion Pictures pages are more precisely captioned with fetal ages in accordance with standard teaching texts on prenatal development.
HOW ARE ABORTIONS PERFORMED?


WHO IS PERFORMING ABORTIONS?


  • The number of abortion providers declined by 11% between 1996 and 2000 (from 2,042 to 1,819). It declined another 2% between 2000 and 2005 (from 1,819 to 1,787) It has remained stable between 2005 and 2008 (1,787 to 1,793). (AGI).
  • Forty-two percent of providers offer very early abortions (during the first four weeks’ gestation) and 95% offer abortion at eight weeks. Sixty-four percent of providers offer at least some second-trimester abortion services (13 weeks or later), and 20% offer abortion after 20 weeks. Eleven percent of all abortion providers offer abortions past 24 weeks (AGI).
  • Most abortions in the USA are provided in freestanding clinics; in 2005, only 5% occurred in hospitals, down from 22% in 1980, and only 2% took place in physician's offices (NAF).
ABORTION FATALITY


  • In 2008, 12 women died as a result of complications from known legal induced abortion (CDC).
  • The number of deaths attributable to legal induced abortion was highest before the 1980s (CDC).
  • In 1972 (the year before abortion was federally legalized), a total of 24 women died from causes known to be associated with legal abortions, and 39 died as a result of known illegal abortions (CDC).
THE COST OF ABORTION


MEDICAL ABORTION


  • In 2005, 57% of abortion providers, or 1,026 facilities, provided one or more types of medical abortions, a 70% increase from the first half of 2001. At least 10% of nonhospital abortion providers offer only medication abortion services (AGI).
  • In 2005, an estimated 161,100 early medication abortions were performed in nonhospital facilities (AGI).
  • Medication abortion accounted for 17% of all abortions in 2008 (AGI).
ABORTION AND CONTRACEPTION


  • Induced abortions usually result from unintended pregnancies, which often occur despite the use of contraception (CDC).
  • 54% of women having abortions used a contraceptive method during the month they became pregnant. Among those women, 76% of pill users and 49% of condom users reported using the methods inconsistently, while 13% of pill users and 14% of condom users reported correct use (AGI).
  • 8% of women having abortions have never used a method of birth control (AGI).
  • 9 in 10 women at risk of unintended pregnancy are using a contraceptive method (AGI).
  • Oral contraceptives, the most widely used reversible method of contraception, carry failure rates of 6 to 8% in actual practice (NAF).
  • Condom use confers protection against STIs, but it does not provide top-tier protection from pregnancy because of breakage, slippage, inconsistent use, and low continuation rates (NAF).
ABORTION AND MINORS


  • 40% of minors having an abortion report that neither of their parents knew about the abortion (AGI).
  • 35 states currently enforce parental consent or notification laws for minors seeking an abortion: AL, AR, AZ, CO, DE, FL, GA, IA, ID, IN, KS, KY, LA, MA, MD, MI , MN, MO, MS, NC, ND, NE, OH, OK, PA, RI, SC, SD, TN, TX, UT, VA, WI, WV, and WY. The Supreme Court ruled that minors must have the alternative of seeking a court order authorizing the procedure (AGI).
ABORTION AND PUBLIC FUNDS


  • The U.S. Congress has barred the use of federal Medicaid funds to pay for abortions, except when the woman's life would be endangered by a full-term pregnancy or in cases of rape or incest (AGI).
  • 17 states (AK, AZ, CA, CT, HI, IL, MA, MD, MN, MT, NJ, NM, NY, OR, VT, WA and WV) do use public funds to pay for abortions for some poor women. About 14% of all abortions in the United States are paid for with public funds (virtually all from the state) (AGI).


NEXT PAGE: Canadian Abortion Statistics
FOR FURTHER STUDY:

LET US KNOW WHAT YOU THINK:

 

aCultureWarrior

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So you agree with me. Is it "Libertarian doctrine" when you say it?

What I'm stilling trying to figure out is why you would want one sexual sin criminalized (abortion), but another one (homosexuality) not?

Let me guess: It's that Libertarian doctrine where "consent" wasn't given?

(I just opened the door for a rant on witchcraft and blasphemy laws, grab some green tea and sit back and enjoy).

That you don't know the difference between libertarian and Libertarian isn't my problem.

Maybe you should ask Hutch to explain it to you.

I'm thinking that your OBSESSION with a big black former football player turned preacher is a bit creepy Aaaaaron.
 

PureX

Well-known member
Pure liberal/socialist hogwash. Everyone should know by now that you cannot trust everything in wikipedia. Source for below article previously cited in my earlier post.
Just as I said, of course you will simply believe whatever you want to believe regardless of the facts.

Planned Parenthood is a non-profit organization that does not spend any of it's budget, regardless of where it comes from, on abortions. Only 3% of Planned Parenthood's services are abortion related. The other 97% of their services are related to early disease detection and providing quality birth control.
 
Just as I said, of course you will simply believe whatever you want to believe regardless of the facts.

Planned Parenthood is a non-profit organization that does not spend any of it's budget, regardless of where it comes from, on abortions. Only 3% of Planned Parenthood's services are abortion related. The other 97% of their services are related to early disease detection and providing quality birth control.
Planned Parenthood Exploits Martin Luther King for Donation Event

The Wisconsin affiliate of the Planned Parenthood abortion business is exploiting the name of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. for a donation event, despite the fact that his niece says he would have been pro-life on abortion.

Planned Parenthood Advocates of Wisconsin has launched what it calls MLK Community Donation Drives that is claims honor King’s legacy.

“In honor of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.’s legacy and our commitment to serving the community in 2013 and beyond, Planned Parenthood of Wisconsin is hosting community donation drives,” it says on its donation page.



“Please join us in our efforts to keep Wisconsin families safe, healthy and strong! Planned Parenthood locations around the state are collecting items of particular need for each local community,” it adds. “Below is the list of participating Planned Parenthood of Wisconsin locations, community/donation partners, and items being collected. Please join our efforts by dropping off your items at a participating location on or before February 1.”

The community donation drive is a fine event that assembled everything from canned goods for local shelters to personal items for women for domestic violence shelters. But Planned Parenthood slaps Martin Luther King Jr’s name on it and uses a photo of him to endorse the event, as if he would support the modern-day Planned Parenthood abortion business.

His niece Alveda King says her uncle would be pro-life and battle against abortion if he were alive today. As the daughter of Rev. A. D. King, a leader in the Civil Right’s movement, King sees the pro-life cause as a continuation of the Civil Rights movement in which her uncle was a prominent leader.
Alveda King called her uncle “a man of great compassion, and a man of non-violence.”

“He once said, ‘The Negro cannot win as long as he is willing to sacrifice the lives of his children for comfort and safety,’” she added.

King said her uncle would understand that to include the destruction of unborn children.

“I know in my heart that if Uncle Martin were alive today, he would join with me in the greatest civil rights struggle of this generation – the recognition of the unborn child’s basic right to life,” she told LifeNews.com previously.

“My uncle Martin would agree that we cannot end poverty, hunger, or suffering by killing those who might suffer,” she explained. “We cannot claim to guarantee equal rights if we deny the rights of the helpless. And we cannot feign ignorance of the fact that those who are torn apart, crushed, or left to die on an abortionist’s table are just as human as we are.”

“My uncle said that injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere,” Alveda continued.

Read more: http://www.lifenews.com/2013/01/18/...ploits-martin-luther-king-for-donation-event/
 

WizardofOz

New member
What I'm stilling trying to figure out is why you would want one sexual sin criminalized (abortion), but another one (homosexuality) not?

Abortion is not a sexual sin. It's unjustifiable homicide.

What I'm still trying to figure out is why you would want one sin criminalized (homosexuality) but another one (blasphemy) not.

Let me guess: It's that Libertarian doctrine where "consent" wasn't given?

I don't know anything about "Libertarian doctrine". Should I ask Hutch?

(I just opened the door for a rant on witchcraft and blasphemy laws, grab some green tea and sit back and enjoy).

You are as alaCarte as they come. You should expect to be called out on it, especially when you accuse others of the same.
 

aCultureWarrior

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Planned Parenthood Exploits Martin Luther King for Donation Event

You are aware (most Christians aren't) that Martin Luther the King was the first co-recipient of Planned Parenthood's "Margaret Sanger Award"?

Of course his niece has said "But but but, my uncle didn't know what he accepted!"

My response to that is:

But the baby butchers at Planned Parenthood knew EXACTLY who they were giving the award to.

I'm dedicating Monday to exposing this fraudulent moral degenerate in my thread, stay tuned.
 

aCultureWarrior

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Abortion is not a sexual sin. It's unjustifiable homicide.

My my, someone needs to go back to 9th grade biology class if he doesn't know that babies come from having sex.

Just to fill you in on a few things that are pretty much known by those that follow the abortion issue:

The VAST majority of abortions are done from out of wedlock sexual relations.

According the Bible I read (and I'm certain the Libertarian one says differently), out of wedlock sex is still a "sin".

I don't know anything about "Libertarian doctrine". Should I ask Hutch?

Your OBSESSION with a big black burly ex professional football player quite frankly Aaaaaron is creeping me out.

Keep your fantasies to yourself please.
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
My my, someone needs to go back to 9th grade biology class if he doesn't know that babies come from having sex.

That doesn't make abortion a sex crime.

Let me get my calculator out and add this one up Aaaaaron.

If a pregnancy can't result from anything but sex between a man and a woman.

+

And abortions are primarily done from out of wedlock sex.

Gee, what kind of crime would it be Aaaaaron, a shoplifting crime?
 

Alate_One

Well-known member
What was that you were saying? The military are murderers?
Sometimes. Not at a high rate, but then neither is planned parenthood. There's also plenty of accidental death plus the death and injury of the soldiers themselves. Life is precious to right wingers as long as it isn't born or wasn't born in the USA. (We could also talk about the treatment of undocumented immigrants.)

You're insane.
You can't have an honest conversation can you?

Go have a nice lie-down.
How about you cut the condescending lines right now? It's not like your tax dollars have ever funded a military run by hawkish civilian leaders that think military intervention is the solution to everything.

Murderers who wear army uniform get court marshalled and shot, don't they?
Not recently. There's also the problem of the USA offloading responsibility on civilian contractors, and they don't have to deal with things like court martial. They magically get sent home when they shoot up innocent people.

Try to respond to what I said. It is possible to teach children to reserve sex for marriage. What others might expect is irrelevant.
It is possible to teach them that, but children are smart. Aside from moral reasons why should they delay? There's also the issue of abstinence programs not actually preventing pregnancy, STDs or any of the other negative effects of early sexual activity.


After accounting for other factors, the national data show that the incidence of teenage pregnancies and births remain positively correlated with the degree of abstinence education across states: The more strongly abstinence is emphasized in state laws and policies, the higher the average teenage pregnancy and birth rate. States that taught comprehensive sex and/or HIV education and covered abstinence along with contraception and condom use (level 1 sex education; also referred to as “abstinence-plus” [26], tended to have the lowest teen pregnancy rates, while states with abstinence-only sex education laws that stress abstinence until marriage (level 3) were significantly less successful in preventing teen pregnancies.



Source

Murdering her family is not supporting it.
If she has to lose her job to take care of a new child when she already has three that may go hungry . . . maybe you should rethink your "analysis" for just a second.

Faked? Why would you make something up like that? No, I didn't say it was faked. I said it was dishonestly presented.
How about you specify exactly how this is dishonest?

Klanned Parenthood doesn't need funding. It needs dismantling.
You know what's interesting about this? You don't have any say in the matter. :chuckle:

Perhaps you should be worried about your own place of residence.



For every pregnancy leading to a Taiwanese woman giving birth, a remarkable three are estimated by a Taiwan pediatrician to have been aborted, a figure that others believe isn’t too far from reality.

When on July 17 the veteran National Taiwan University College of Medicine professor and pediatrician Lue Hung-chi told a forum that 300,000 to 500,000 abortions are carried out in Taiwan each year, he was seeking to send alarm bells ringing. If his estimate is true, it has to be one of the highest per-capita abortion rates in the world.

 

WizardofOz

New member
Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
My my, someone needs to go back to 9th grade biology class if he doesn't know that babies come from having sex.

Let me get my calculator out and add this one up Aaaaaron.

If a pregnancy can't result from anything but sex between a man and a woman.

+

And abortions are primarily done from out of wedlock sex.

Gee, what kind of crime would it be Aaaaaron, a shoplifting crime?

You're an idiot. Sex crimes

Where is abortion in the list? Perhaps you have another source?
 
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