Mostly, it's the proverbial, blind leading the blind syndrome!
toldailytopic: Once a person is saved can they reject that salvation should they chan
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
- Start date
Mostly, it's the proverbial, blind leading the blind syndrome!
It is a Calvinistic myth that Arminian faith is a work or that perseverance/continuing in the faith is a work.
This just shows how little you understand the academic debate.
Unbelief is a unique sin that is not forgiven before or after conversion. If someone persists in Christ rejecting, godless unbelief/rebellion, they do not have assurance of eternal life if they die in that state (otherwise you are saying someone can be saved apart from Christ). If someone can rebel before conversion, why cannot they use the same mind/will to rebel/reject after conversion? Sure, believers are secure, but one may not remain a believer unto death. A change in status has consequences.
Conversion/salvation are usually interchangeable.
Not telling the difference between justification, sanctification, perseverance, glorification is a problem.
That's why it's so important to rightly divide the word and pay close attention to the context in which something is being spoken, and to who it pertains to!
A Jew who never became a Christian is not an apostate. In Islam, an apostate is someone who leaves Islam for something else. By definition, a Christian apostate is someone who leaves Christianity for x, y, z, not someone (Jew, atheist, Muslim, JW, Hindu, etc.) who never was a Christian. You don't fall away from truth if you never had it.
A false convert, a non-convert, etc. is not an apostate, but a generic non-Christian unbeliever. Hebrews is talking about Jewish Christians who reverted back to Judaism and no longer trusted Christ and His finished work. It is not just talking about Jews who never converted (that is another problem). Fakes who never were converted, but call themselves Christians (Mormons, nominal, liberal religionists, etc.), are not apostates, but non-Christians.
Will you listen to these supposed scholars? Not I, says GM! Besides myself, there's only one other on this thread (at this time) who knows what they're talking about! The others, don't have a clue!
And she, knows who she is!
I am a he.
I keep forgetting what your background and beliefs are. I assume you affirm the trinity?
You are probably non-church going (unbiblical) or independent sect.
Do you have any atypical beliefs, besides OSAS?
glorydaz
Well-known member
Of course that's your opinion. Whenever you read about loss of a former belief in the Bible, you think it means a falling away from the Christian faith, but the Jews believed in God and you seem to forget that. I don't give a hoot about muslims and what they believe. I'm talking about the Bible and how you assume certain verses refer to a loss of salvation....such as you do when you cite Hebrews.
genuineoriginal
New member
Gods forgiveness, mercy and eternal life is given to those who place their faith in Christ as Lord and Savior! One must first hear the word,
from the word of God, they must be convinced they're a sinner and confess such to God! Once true faith has been established, the Holy
Spirit cleanses the sins of the new believer, seals them, indwells them
and places them into the Body of Christ! They're now, in Christ and Christ is in them! They are positioned into Christ and therefore, that positioning makes them sinless before God. However, they still have a physical (fleshly) body that is capable of disobedience towards God, and God reserves the right to discipline His children, and does!
There is no condemnation/judgment that awaits the true believer, only the gain or loss of rewards in eternity! The flesh still is susceptible to sin but, the spirit of the believer is positioned so, they do not and cannot sin!
glorydaz
Well-known member
Exactly, and you can't do that if you're so taken up with other books which give their opinions that you end up confusing those books with THE BOOK.
Are you a Catholic, or what?
glorydaz
Well-known member
Now there's the simple Truth without a bunch of tomfoolery. :thumb:
True
glorydaz
Well-known member
There's no mistake there.... :chuckle:
glorydaz
Well-known member
I'd be more than happy to take each one of the verses on one at a time, if you really want to know what they are saying. But the statement in yellow is a perfect example. We don't produce fruit. The fruit is the Spirit's and He produces it in us. We are His Workmanship...not our own. If you try to manufacture meekness and gentleness you'll end up sounding like Jason...it's fake. To be real, it can't come from ourselves.
Great truth
GM has to go for now!