toldailytopic: Once a person is saved can they reject that salvation should they chan

[godrulz]

Of course that's your opinion. Whenever you read about loss of a former belief in the Bible, you think it means a falling away from the Christian faith, but the Jews believed in God and you seem to forget that. I don't give a hoot about muslims and what they believe. I'm talking about the Bible and how you assume certain verses refer to a loss of salvation....such as you do when you cite Hebrews.

Jews had a legit faith that was supplanted by the fuller revelation post-cross of Christianity/Christ (reality vs shadow/type).

A devout Jew is not an apostate in the OT. A Jew who never converts is not a Christian. They are not apostasizing from/falling away from truth/Christianity in the NT. They are in the same boat as all other non-Christians and need to embrace the NT gospel.

If a NT Jewish or Gentile convert/Christian forsakes Christ/Christianity post-conversion, then they fall away or are an apostate. The stern warnings of apostasy are to believers, not to those in false religions who were never believers.

 

[godrulz]

That is a common Protestant mistake, and is the basis for OSAS.

I do not believe in OSAS, but not because of conversion/salvation confusion.

Words have a semantical range of meaning. Conversion could be related to justification alone, while salvation may encompass initial justification, sanctification, and ultimate glorification. One can be converted, but not saved in the very end if they reject Christ against great light after having known Him.

What is your distinction with these terms?

 

[Lighthouse]

Shipwreck faith...I Tim. 1:19 (cf. Heb. 6:4-6)

You shipwrecked your brain.

Nick knows he said it.

Not good enough if you want to throw an accusation around.

You were arguing that adultery is still a crime today and you said:

There is it! You said that grace is not for crime (adultery).

You blathering idiot!

I never said a crime could not also be a sin; in fact, by definition, anything that should be a crime in our society is also a sin.

Do you understand what I mean by that?

Here, let me spell it out for you, as you are clearly too blasted stupid to get it without being spoken to as though you're a child.

Adultery is a sin, and a crime.

Christ died for the sin of adultery.*

Christ did not die for the crime of adultery.

This means that while sinners can receive forgiveness for their sins through Christ, any who have committed a sin that is also a crime should still pay the earthly penalty for the crime, regardless of their status of forgiveness regarding the sin.

And those who have been forgiven of sin, and yet pay the penalty for crime still go to Heaven when they die, even if that penalty was death.

*I don't think God, in any form, actually thought about all the sins for which Christ died; He died for sin in general, as a whole [all encompassing].

So, not only are you a Christ hating swine because you stand with the scribes and pharisees in condemning people, but you are a COWARDLY swine because you do not have the guts to admit it. Christ condemned the self righteous you dummy.

This means Christ condemns YOU and Nick M. You are a perverter of God's grace! Keep your nose out of the sin of others you moron!

How stupid do you feel right now?

And what sin are you hiding for which you fear judgment?

Wile dishes it out against LH/Nick like they do against me...:chuckle::box:

Except that Wile E. is throwing around false accusations and misunderstandings.

I could not disagree with you more. Paul said, "Just as you received Christ so also walk in Him."

One's political views play a role in our walking in Christ no more than they played a role in our receiving Christ.

The gospel is about believing in Jesus. To make one's political views a "powerful evidence" that one was never saved is to take away from the simplicity of the gospel, and it is to make oneself the judge of the salvation of others.

So voting for a man who not only promotes abortion on demand, but also believes Kermit Gosnell should have legally been allowed to do the things for which he has stood trial, some for which he has been found guilty, has nothing to do with walking in Christ?

While Christ didn't get very political according to the gospels we know how He felt about child murder, etc.

 

[godrulz]

Are you a Catholic, or what?

Are you Exchanged Life or what?

Most Protestant Arminians/Open Theists (i.e., non-Calvinistic/Reformed) Evangelicals are not OSAS. It is not a Catholic issue, but rejected by hundreds of millions of Evangelical Christians who are free will theists vs determinists.

Catholics are also not wrong about everything (Christology, etc.).

 

[StanJ53]

Are you convinced that you'll spend eternity with God, or do you believe, that you must, stay the course, in order to gain eternal life?

Both.
Now how about answering me?

 

[StanJ53]

I'd be more than happy to take each one of the verses on one at a time, if you really want to know what they are saying. But the statement in yellow is a perfect example. We don't produce fruit. The fruit is the Spirit's and He produces it in us. We are His Workmanship...not our own. If you try to manufacture meekness and gentleness you'll end up sounding like Jason...it's fake. To be real, it can't come from ourselves.

I'd rather we keep it all together in one Glory so as to NOT deflect.
Let's not confuse the fruit of the Spirit with the fruit of our lives.

1. Matthew 13:23
   As for the one who was sown on good soil, this is the one who hears the message and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces, some a hundredfold, some sixty, and some thirty.”
2. Matthew 21:43 Therefore I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people who will produce its fruit.”

 

[StanJ53]

That's why it's so important to rightly divide the word and pay close attention to the context in which something is being spoken, and to who it pertains to!

Amen!

Please remember these words GM.

 

[StanJ53]

It boils down to this; most on this thread believe in a "works based religion" on the other hand, a very few (perhaps only two) believe that Christs shed blood and resurrection took away ALL their sins, and they have been placed into the body of Christ, by the work of the Holy Spirit, and cannot lose their standing before God!
Why you may ask? Because, Christ is in us and we are in Christ!!

and are you ever going to answer me as to WHO said we can LOSE our salvation?

 

[Nick M]

That's why it's so important to rightly divide the word and pay close attention to the context in which something is being spoken, and to who it pertains to!

You're MAD.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Jews had a legit faith that was supplanted by the fuller revelation post-cross of Christianity/Christ (reality vs shadow/type).

A devout Jew is not an apostate in the OT. A Jew who never converts is not a Christian. They are not apostasizing from/falling away from truth/Christianity in the NT. They are in the same boat as all other non-Christians and need to embrace the NT gospel.

If a NT Jewish or Gentile convert/Christian forsakes Christ/Christianity post-conversion, then they fall away or are an apostate. The stern warnings of apostasy are to believers, not to those in false religions who were never believers.

Your, out of your mind opinions are somewhat
annoying, and yet, disturbing as well! Your, level of ignorance
is off the chart! I congratulate you for that anyway!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

and are you ever going to answer me as to WHO said we can LOSE our salvation?

You, really must learn to focus a bit!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Amen!

Please remember these words GM.

I see only, one word to remember; "Amen!" That, shouldn't
be to difficult to remember!

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Are you Exchanged Life or what?

Most Protestant Arminians/Open Theists (i.e., non-Calvinistic/Reformed) Evangelicals are not OSAS. It is not a Catholic issue, but rejected by hundreds of millions of Evangelical Christians who are free will theists vs determinists.

Catholics are also not wrong about everything (Christology, etc.).

Thanks for avoiding my question! Very slippery of you, I might add!

 

[Angel4Truth]

toldailytopic: Once a person is saved can they reject that salvation should they change their mind about wanting to be with God in heaven?

Not if they were actually saved. Because it is impossible to sacrifice Christ again, He finished it all on the cross, and the believer is sealed by the Spirit and not one will be snatched from His hand, including "our own" attempts to snatch ourselves back.

It is impossible to become unborn.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Are you a Catholic, or what?

Acts 24:14-15 14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets: 15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.​

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Acts 24:14-15 14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets: 15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.​

Learn, not to just leave Scripture but, a point to why you choose
that particular Scripture?? Otherwise, no one knows what you're
getting at?

 

[genuineoriginal]

I do not believe in OSAS, but not because of conversion/salvation confusion.

Words have a semantical range of meaning. Conversion could be related to justification alone, while salvation may encompass initial justification, sanctification, and ultimate glorification. One can be converted, but not saved in the very end if they reject Christ against great light after having known Him.

What is your distinction with these terms?

Conversion is turning from unbelief to belief.
Salvation is being saved from wrath.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Learn, not to just leave Scripture but, a point to why you choose
that particular Scripture?? Otherwise, no one knows what you're
getting at?

I am sorry that you are suffering from a profound lack of information.
That is a condition known as ignorance.
It can be cured.

There are more branches to Christianity than the Roman Catholic sect and the Protestant sects that were formed from it.

I hold to the teachings of the Apostles from before the time of the Augustinian heresies.

That is why that scripture is all that is needed to answer a question on whether I am Catholic or Protestant.

 

[Angel4Truth]

I am sorry that you are suffering from a profound lack of information.
That is a condition known as ignorance.
It can be cured.

There are more branches to Christianity than the Roman Catholic sect and the Protestant sects that were formed from it.

I hold to the teachings of the Apostles from before the time of the Augustinian heresies.

That is why that scripture is all that is needed to answer a question on whether I am Catholic or Protestant.

Eastern Orthodox?

 

[IMJerusha]

No, I would say it's definitely before that.