toldailytopic: Homeschooling vs. Public schooling.

[kmoney]

If you want to be sure of your child's upbringing, isn't it rational to do it yourself rather than have random strangers do it?

Schooling != upbringing

 

[kmoney]

OK. Using the example you gave, it with be neither more nor less rational to save the person who was related to you.

How are you defining "rational" here?

 

[MrRadish]

How are you defining "rational" here?

Logical. I suppose it is true that if you consider catering to self-interest to be rational then to protect those about whom you care more is indeed the rational course. I suppose I'm thinking more in moral terms.

 

[Stripe]

Insufficient unbiased exposure to alternative viewpoints certainly seems to stunt this capacity from what I've seen. It also tends to lead to crippling guilt problems relating to breaking away and making independent personal and moral choices, from what I've seen.

OK. I doubt that "what you've seen" is any justification for letting random strangers teach your child.

If you aren't open to the possibility that perspectives that differ from yours might be right, then you're making precisely the assumption of which I accused you.

Don't worry. Your straw man is dead. :chuckle:

 

[Stripe]

Schooling != upbringing

Schooling is a major part of a child's upbringing. Parents who send their kids to school are relying upon the efforts of random strangers to instill values, morals and discipline for over half of the child's time.

 

[Alate_One]

After hearing of the dreadful homeschooling of two children of relatives, I am even less in favor of homeschooling than before.

Is it fair to the child to allow them to be homeschooled by someone that can barely do math or read themselves?

 

[Stripe]

After hearing of the dreadful homeschooling of two children of relatives, I am even less in favor of homeschooling than before.

Appeal to anecdote.

Is it fair to the child to allow them to be homeschooled by someone that can barely do math or read themselves?

Maybe they're really good at shoe making. :idunno:

 

[Alate_One]

Appeal to anecdote.

I knew these kids. At least one of them was extraordinarily bright. Now she's at least one or two grade levels behind.

Anecdote or no, is it ethically right to tolerate such a situation when it is known to exist? A bad teacher in the public school can be fired. A bad teacher in a public school might be a factor for a year or a semester at most. Parents as teachers cannot be fired unless there are laws I am not aware of. There are remedies to bad public schools, there are none for bad homeschooling.

Maybe they're really good at shoe making. :idunno:

And that makes them qualified to prepare a child for the modern era how exactly? How many jobs are there for shoe making?

 

[Arthur Brain]

I knew these kids. At least one of them was extraordinarily bright. Now she's at least one or two grade levels behind.

Anecdote or no, is it ethically right to tolerate such a situation when it is known to exist? A bad teacher in the public school can be fired. A bad teacher in a public school might be a factor for a year or a semester at most. Parents as teachers cannot be fired unless there are laws I am not aware of. There are remedies to bad public schools, there are none for bad homeschooling.

And that makes them qualified to prepare a child for the modern era how exactly? How many jobs are there for shoe making?

Well there's cobblers....

Or then again that may just be what Stripe is talking...

lain:

 

[Lighthouse]

How many jobs are there for shoe making?

:sozo2:There won't be any if those elves don't stop coming into this country illegally and taking all the cobbling jobs!:madmad:

 

[Stripe]

I knew these kids. At least one of them was extraordinarily bright. Now she's at least one or two grade levels behind.

Nice anecdote.

Anecdote or no, is it ethically right to tolerate such a situation when it is known to exist?

What do suggest be done about it?

Oh, wait. Liberal, right? Here comes another raft of prohibitions replete with red tape and demand on tax dollars. lain:

A bad teacher in the public school can be fired.

Oh, no. That never happens. :nono:

Parents as teachers cannot be fired unless there are laws I am not aware of.

As it should be. :thumb:

There are remedies to bad public schools, there are none for bad homeschooling.

Sure, there are.

And that makes them qualified to prepare a child for the modern era how exactly? How many jobs are there for shoe making?

Someone needs to make our shoes. :idunno:

 

[Granite]

After hearing of the dreadful homeschooling of two children of relatives, I am even less in favor of homeschooling than before.

Is it fair to the child to allow them to be homeschooled by someone that can barely do math or read themselves?

No. That constitutes borderline child abuse, as far as I'm concerned.

This is the really annoying part about homeschool absolutists. On one hand, they denigrate the public school system and have nothing good to say about it. On the other hand, they expect the adult products of that same system to be qualified to teach their own children.

Not every parent can or should teach their kids, and in fact some parents shouldn't even try.

It doesn't. Work. For. Everyone.

 

[Alate_One]

What do suggest be done about it?

Oh, wait. Liberal, right? Here comes another raft of prohibitions replete with red tape and demand on tax dollars.

No, I'd make it really simple. anyone that wants to home school their children should pass the same exit exam as a teacher does. The Praxis for most states While not perfect, it would be a basic insurance policy against bad situations as I described earlier.

 

[Stripe]

No, I'd make it really simple. anyone that wants to home school their children should pass the same exit exam as a teacher does. The Praxis for most states While not perfect, it would be a basic insurance policy against bad situations as I described earlier.

Pass an exam, then you can be a parent.

 

[aCultureWarrior]

Obviously not your typical homeschooler; but then we already knew that didn't we class?

Parents who home-school children increasingly are white, wealthy and well-educated — and their numbers have nearly doubled in a decade, a new federal government report says.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/education/2009-05-28-homeschooling-report_N.htm

 

[Buzzword]

Pass an exam, then you can be a parent.

That actually doesn't sound too bad, in theory.

My wife and I could probably run a service helping the people we see carting around 5 kids at Wal-Mart at 3 AM study for the parenting exam.


We don't have kids, by the way.

 

[Stripe]

That actually doesn't sound too bad, in theory.My wife and I could probably run a service helping the people we see carting around 5 kids at Wal-Mart at 3 AM study for the parenting exam.We don't have kids, by the way.

Passing an exam is easy. Teaching people to pass exams does nothing to prepare or equip them for reality.

Facts are that that the location is irrelevant. The people involved are. And it will always come down to the simple truth - if you want your child raised in a way you deem acceptable, do it yourself.

 

[LadyGreenEyes]

As one that does home schooling, clearly I am in favor of the idea. That said, not everyone can manage. Instead of debating anything, I will simply offer the advantages that I see in it. My oldest wasn't home schooled, and the #2 attended public school for K-1, so I do know both sides. The first thing I like is that I have control over what the kids learn. I don't have to worry about them being taught things that disagree with Christian beliefs, or them being subjected to the rampant social engineering that is in so many schools these days. Along with that, the kids don't pick up bad habits from school mates. I also like that we control the schedule. Being somewhat of a night person (yeah, I really am posting that late at night), and having kids on later hours, this is a GREAT thing. We can start and finish later. We also get to decide on vacation and holiday schedules ourselves. Kids that are sick can still do some schooling. Each one can get far more attention that they could in public school. I haven't noticed any effect on social skills, either. With three younger ones fairly close together, I see three different ways of interacting with other kids when out in social situations. One shy, one totally NOT shy, and another on the "wild side". All able to deal with people as well as they would if in public school.

 

[bybee]

As one that does home schooling, clearly I am in favor of the idea. That said, not everyone can manage. Instead of debating anything, I will simply offer the advantages that I see in it. My oldest wasn't home schooled, and the #2 attended public school for K-1, so I do know both sides. The first thing I like is that I have control over what the kids learn. I don't have to worry about them being taught things that disagree with Christian beliefs, or them being subjected to the rampant social engineering that is in so many schools these days. Along with that, the kids don't pick up bad habits from school mates. I also like that we control the schedule. Being somewhat of a night person (yeah, I really am posting that late at night), and having kids on later hours, this is a GREAT thing. We can start and finish later. We also get to decide on vacation and holiday schedules ourselves. Kids that are sick can still do some schooling. Each one can get far more attention that they could in public school. I haven't noticed any effect on social skills, either. With three younger ones fairly close together, I see three different ways of interacting with other kids when out in social situations. One shy, one totally NOT shy, and another on the "wild side". All able to deal with people as well as they would if in public school.

If I were to do it over I would also home school.

 

[Tico]

We homeschool so we can properly socialize our kids.