To teach that people are born in sin is to teach against what Jesus taught

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Samie

New member
Both Arminians and Calvinists teach that people are born in sin. And to be born in sin is to be born lost, being born NOT in Christ.

But Jesus taught otherwise as He explained in the parables of the lost sheep, lost coin and lost son (Luke 15:1-24).

Before the sheep got lost, it was with its shepherd in the sheepfold.
Before the coin was lost, it was with its owner.
Before the son went lost, he was at home with his father.

The sheep, coin and son did not start already lost. So with us. We started life NOT lost, and to be not lost is to be In Christ. But we all, like sheep, went astray (Isa 53:6). Hence, we are all enjoined to repent or perish (Luke 13:3, 5).

The command to repent is the same command God made in the old testament (Ezek 18:30); the same command He now wants all men everywhere to do (Acts 17:30); the same command that Jesus issued in the gospel that He preached (Mark 1:14, 15); the same gospel He wanted preached to the world before He comes again (Mat 24:14).

By teaching that people are born in sin, many preachers teach against what Jesus taught and preach a gospel different from what Jesus preached.

I don't think these preachers want to be accursed (Gal 1:6-9). Are you one of those preachers?
 
Ktoyou

Ktoyou

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Samie said:
So maybe you simply believe what those preachers teach.
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Some, I do, some I don't. No matter, I do not listen to 'get lost" clowns like you. You need to find a good minister, and stop thinking you have the answers. This much I know and can advise.
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Samie said:
Both Arminians and Calvinists teach that people are born in sin. And to be born in sin is to be born lost, being born NOT in Christ.

But Jesus taught otherwise as He explained in the parables of the lost sheep, lost coin and lost son (Luke 15:1-24).

Before the sheep got lost, it was with its shepherd in the sheepfold.
Before the coin was lost, it was with its owner.
Before the son went lost, he was at home with his father.

The sheep, coin and son did not start already lost. So with us. We started life NOT lost, and to be not lost is to be In Christ. But we all, like sheep, went astray (Isa 53:6). Hence, we are all enjoined to repent or perish (Luke 13:3, 5).

The command to repent is the same command God made in the old testament (Ezek 18:30); the same command He now wants all men everywhere to do (Acts 17:30); the same command that Jesus issued in the gospel that He preached (Mark 1:14, 15); the same gospel He wanted preached to the world before He comes again (Mat 24:14).

By teaching that people are born in sin, many preachers teach against what Jesus taught and preach a gospel different from what Jesus preached.

I don't think these preachers want to be accursed (Gal 1:6-9). Are you one of those preachers?
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There are plenty of people from both camps who do not claim we are born in sin. That's why such blanket statements are wrong. Unfortunately, the teaching that we are born with Adam's sin is too prevalent today, but not everyone has bought into that teaching.

Sin entered the world because of Adam's sin, and it lieth at the door, but we fail to refuse the evil, which is why all men sin in the end.

Gen. 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.​

Scripture tells us we were fearfully and wonderfully made. It then tells us how man begins to go astray from his youth. Some will claim they go astray from their mother's womb, but there are more verses that say they go astray from their youth. Clearly, we don't "speak lies" from our mother's womb. Youth in the Bible is an older child or young adult. We each reach a point when our conscience begins it's work, and we know to choose good over evil...that is when we become separated from God....when we choose wrongly.

Isaiah 7:16
16 For before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of both her kings.​
 
S

Samie

New member
Ktoyou said:
Some, I do, some I don't. No matter, I do not listen to 'get lost" clowns like you. You need to find a good minister, and stop thinking you have the answers. This much I know and can advise.
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That well explains why you have no scriptural basis in your objection to the OP.

Go to the Bible instead of finding a good minister. This much I can advise.
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Samie said:
Yeah, I didn't mean that.

If you don't believe that people are born in sin, do you believe that people are born in Christ?
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No, but I do believe that the innocent are His possession.

Being in Christ means we are created IN HIM as new creatures.
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Samie said:
When do you think are people created IN HIM as new creatures?
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When we believe, and are begotten by the Gospel.

Eph. 2:8-10 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.​
 
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Samie

New member
glorydaz said:
When we believe, and are begotten by the Gospel.

Eph. 2:8-10 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.​
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But how can you have the power to believe UNLESS you are first IN Christ, the ONLY Source of power, being the power of God?

KJV 1 Corinthians 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Samie said:
But how can you have the power to believe UNLESS you are first IN Christ, the ONLY Source of power, being the power of God?

KJV 1 Corinthians 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
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Christ's POWER is dispensed through the GOSPEL, which is the power of God unto salvation. It's Christ's power placed IN THE GOSPEL, itself. Clearly, the Gospel is the means the Lord uses for us to be saved and created IN HIM.

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.​

Notice earlier in the same chapter you quoted....It's the GOSPEL (the preaching of the cross) which is the POWER OF GOD. The GOSPEL IS how BOTH THE POWER AND THE WISDOM of Christ is dispensed to the one who believes.

1 Cor. 1:17-18 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.​
 
glorydaz

glorydaz

Well-known member
Samie said:
So what comes first, the empowering or the act of believing?
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That question doesn't really make any sense to me. :think:

We are not "empowered" to do anything. But the POWER in the Gospel is what persuaded us to believe.

Then we were sealed with the Holy Spirit.... after we heard and believed the Gospel.

Eph. 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,​


The Gospel is the power of God unto salvation. Which tells us that we believe, and are saved after we hear the Gospel. We are begotten (given life) when we believe the Gospel.

1 Corinthians 4:15 For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.​
 
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