ECT Those who believe will labor to enter the "Rest" of God"

musterion

Well-known member
of the Ephesians means they were Ephesians in Ephesis--

How would twelve Ephesians gentiles get the baptism of John? Luke noted that these guys were disciples for a reason.

You are taking away from scripture.
No I'm not.

The Ephesian assembly lived and met in Ephesis.
You think?

Paul went there and began the church there
LA
You just said the twelve disciples of John were the beginning of the church there. You are confused.
 

vfirestormv

Member
Which church are you talking about? Moses' church, the Lord's "My church" or the church which is His Body, the body of Christ?

If possible all three. When did Moses Church start and end? When did the Lord's church start and end or if this is the suspended church when was it suspended relative to the book of Acts? And when did the body of Christ, that church start relative to the book of Acts? And of course it will end at the rapture?
And in what church does everybody that was before Moses fall into?
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
And when did the body of Christ, that church start relative to the book of Acts?
The body of Christ began in Acts 9 by the saving of Paul (then Saul 1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV )
And of course it will end at the rapture?
The Body of Christ will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air, yes. And when it does, there will be no more added to it.
 

vfirestormv

Member
If Paul has a different gospel than that preached by Peter in Acts 2, then why did Paul preach repentance?

Act 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
 

vfirestormv

Member
The body of Christ began in Acts 9 by the saving of Paul (then Saul 1 Timothy 1:13-16 KJV )The Body of Christ will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air, yes. And when it does, there will be no more added to it.



Does not Eph. 3:1-6 which you quoted earlier explain exactly what the mystery given to Paul was?

Eph 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
Eph 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
Eph 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Eph 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
Eph 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
Eph 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


Was not the mystery that the Gentiles would be fellowheirs of the same body? And not that of a different gospel, which Paul warned about someone preaching?
I think so...
 

vfirestormv

Member
The Body of Christ will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air, yes. And when it does, there will be no more added to it.

I know this is the third post, but many questions linger in my mind.
Why did Paul preach so much about the Kingdom of God, just as Jesus did and just as Peter did in Acts?
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Does not Eph. 3:1-6 which you quoted earlier explain exactly what the mystery given to Paul was?
There were several mysteries, not just one (1 Corinthians 4:1 KJV)

Eph 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
Eph 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
Eph 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
Eph 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
Eph 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
Eph 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


Was not the mystery that the Gentiles would be fellowheirs of the same body? And not that of a different gospel, which Paul warned about someone preaching?
I think so...
The mystery of Ephesians 3 is the mystery of the gospel Ephesians 3:6 KJV

Specifically, these "you Gentiles" are fellowheirs and of the same body and partakers of God's promise in Christ by the gospel with the "we" "who first trusted in Christ"

Ephesians 1:12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

beginning with the the apostle Paul

1 Timothy 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

and including the Romans, Corinthians, Galatians and Thessalonians

These were those to whom Paul was first sent. Here is Paul recalling what the risen ascended Lord Jesus Christ told him in Acts 9. Look at what it says at the end of verse 17 taking note of "unto whom NOW I send thee.

Acts 26:16-17 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee; 17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,

Here they are:

Acts 13:26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.


Here they are again~"to the Jew first and also to the Greek":

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

But unto them which are called, "both Jews and Greeks" (this is the first group)

1 Corinthians 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

They had a hope. They were in the commonwealth of Israel. They were in the promise.

Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

All Greeks were Gentiles, but not all Gentiles were Greeks.



The Ephesians were not "Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise". These Gentiles were OUTSIDE of the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise (such as we). These Gentiles in time past had no hope and were without God in the world!

Ephesians 2:11-12 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

These Ephesians , the Gentiles to whom Paul wrote the letter are of the "ye" whom "also trusted"

Ephesians 1:13-14 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

These are Gentiles that Paul became a prisoner for when he revealed the vision:

Please take note of "for I will send thee" far hence unto the Gentiles.

Acts 22:21-22 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles. 22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.

Ephesians 3:1-6 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, 2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: 3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, 4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) 5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; 6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


Together (the twain) make up the one new man

"But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ... For he is our peace, who hath made both one... for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"

Ephesians 2:13-15 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
How would twelve Ephesians gentiles get the baptism of John? Luke noted that these guys were disciples for a reason.


They were disciples of John.

No I'm not.

You think?

You just said the twelve disciples of John were the beginning of the church there. You are confused.

Only when Paul baptized them into Christ and they received the Holy Spirit with the laying on of Pauls hands were they the beginning of the NT church there.

LA
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Was not the mystery that the Gentiles would be fellowheirs of the same body? And not that of a different gospel, which Paul warned about someone preaching?
I think so...
You must not confuse Israel and the Body. Although the first group of the twain made one new man were in the commonwealth of Israel, they were stablished into the Body (Romans 16:25-27 KJV). We can see Paul gathering them in during the time of promise during the book of Acts as he gathered the remnant according to the election of grace at that present time which God foreknew Romans 11:1-6 KJV. The Gentiles to whom Paul wrote the letter were aliens from the commonwealth. Together they make up the one Body, the one new man.

Hope this helps.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
The Ephesians were not "Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise".

They became so--

Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

LA
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
I know this is the third post, but many questions linger in my mind.
Why did Paul preach so much about the Kingdom of God, just as Jesus did and just as Peter did in Acts?
The kingdom of God is not necessarily the same as the gospel of the kingdom nor is it the kingdom of heaven.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
They became so--

Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

LA
You have no idea what you even speak of. Galatians 3:29 KJV is not the same as Ephesians 2:11-12 KJV

You bought a lifetime membership when you should have bought a clue.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
You have no idea what you even speak of. Galatians 3:29 KJV is not the same as Ephesians 2:11-12 KJV

You bought a lifetime membership when you should have bought a clue.

Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Eph 2:11 Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh—who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands—
Eph 2:12 that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation,
Eph 2:15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,
Eph 2:16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.
Eph 2:17 And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near.
Eph 2:18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Eph 2:20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone,

Looks the same to me.

LA
 

vfirestormv

Member
The kingdom of God is not necessarily the same as the gospel of the kingdom nor is it the kingdom of heaven.

What do you mean by necessarily?
Kingdom of God is preached some 53 times by Jesus and Peter and some 14 times by Paul. Seems to be the same place they are talking about.
 

vfirestormv

Member
If Paul has a different gospel than that preached by Peter in Acts 2, then why did Paul preach repentance?

Act 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.

You may have missed this among all my other posts, But could someone please answer this?
 

vfirestormv

Member
Which part?

If Paul has a different gospel than that preached by Peter in Acts 2, then why did Paul preach repentance?

Act 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
What do you mean by necessarily?
Kingdom of God is preached some 53 times by Jesus and Peter and some 14 times by Paul. Seems to be the same place they are talking about.
The kingdom of God preached by Jesus Christ in M, M, L, and John is the kingdom of heaven. We know that Paul could not have been preaching that same aspect of the kingdom of God as Paul could not have been forgiven under the kingdom program (for lack of a better term), neither in that world, neither in the world to come (Matthew 12:31-32 KJV). We are not seeking the kingdom of heaven. It's not our inheritance (there's more than one of those in the Bible too). It's your job to study where it is you fit in.
 

musterion

Well-known member
If Paul has a different gospel than that preached by Peter in Acts 2, then why did Paul preach repentance?

Act 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.

Because believing the Gospel requires a change of mind about several things. That was and is true for Gentile as well as Jew. It isn't possible to believe the Gospel without rejecting what one used to believe; that's repentance.
 

vfirestormv

Member
Because believing the Gospel requires a change of mind about several things. That was and is true for Gentile as well as Jew. It isn't possible to believe the Gospel without rejecting what one used to believe; that's repentance.

Exactly and it was no different in Acts 2. Same gospel, same Holy Spirit, just further realized in Paul. He had the ministry of the gospel to the Gentiles. Peter and the others had the ministry of that same gospel to the Jews. Though Peter did preach to gentiles too as well Paul did preach to Jews as well.
 
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