The Trinity

[glorydaz]

You are ensnared to say such things to me.

Bull. We are told to curse such as you. Those who try to bring people under bondage by preaching against the Gospel of Grace. You are a deceitful worker and you preach a NO GOOD NEW message of having to earn salvation. You're just lucky you've been tolerated this long.

 

[glorydaz]

Has anyone seen either gt or popsthebuilder's answer to this question:

How much OBEYING / RIGHT did the thief on the cross presented to Jesus for Jesus to find him righteous and save him?

I have.....with lies and fabrications. Just the usual for those two.

 

[God's Truth]

Bull. We are told to curse such as you. Those who try to bring people under bondage by preaching against the Gospel of Grace. You are a deceitful worker and you preach a NO GOOD NEW message of having to earn salvation. You're just lucky you've been tolerated this long.

It is good and powerful and life and the Spirit to obey Jesus' beautiful words.

 

[Lon]

It isn't my doctrine at all. Only logic applied to yours it seems.

If three separate persons making one god then any of the three by themselves would be 1/3 of the whole.

'Your' logic. Your doctrine. :think: There is no scripture that says this.

How is there no third anything when you are speaking of a three part god?

Good question, try not to answer it yourself, such as the following (that got you into this mess in the first place).

Please answer the question instead of changing the subject.

And by the way.

If God is three persons with separate personalities or characteristics and each person is comprised of body soul and spirit then your god would indeed be a 9 or 12 part god.

Not 1/3....thought there were three separate distinct persons?

A few questions to answer your question:

John 1:1 How many mentioned? One? At least two?
John 10:30 How many? How many does the Lord Jesus Christ say there are?
Isaiah 45:5 How many?
Psalm 110:1,5 Matthew 22:44, Mark 12:36, Luke 20:42 Acts 2:34 How many?
Hebrews 1:8?

1) Are there more than one mentioned at times?
2) One what? Two or more what?
3) Are there any 1/3's mentioned?
4) How many 'gods' are there?

5) according to Hebrews 1:8, John 1:1, 5:8, 20:28 etc. Is Jesus God?

I realize those who wrestle with scriptures see Jesus ascending to His Father, God John 20:17 BUT John 1:1 equally conflates the Word 'with' God and "God" at the same time as well. Anything 'more' or 'less' than scripture gives, we believe, is presumptuous and heresy. "We" humans don't get to qualify God, He qualifies Himself and we but listen to what He says. Going beyond scripture is not only wrong, it is arrogance and sin. -Lon

 

[Lazy afternoon]

How many beings is God?

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Bull. We are told to curse such as you. Those who try to bring people under bondage by preaching against the Gospel of Grace. You are a deceitful worker and you preach a NO GOOD NEW message of having to earn salvation. You're just lucky you've been tolerated this long.

Your "gospel of grace" is that you can kill 600 men and it will not affect your salvation.

LA

 

[popsthebuilder]

'Your' logic. Your doctrine. :think: There is no scripture that says this.



Good question, try not to answer it yourself, such as the following (that got you into this mess in the first place).



A few questions to answer your question:

John 1:1 How many mentioned? One? At least two?
John 10:30 How many? How many does the Lord Jesus Christ say there are?
Isaiah 45:5 How many?
Psalm 110:1,5 Matthew 22:44, Mark 12:36, Luke 20:42 Acts 2:34 How many?
Hebrews 1:8?

1) Are there more than one mentioned at times?
2) One what? Two or more what?
3) Are there any 1/3's mentioned?
4) How many 'gods' are there?

5) according to Hebrews 1:8, John 1:1, 5:8, 20:28 etc. Is Jesus God?

I realize those who wrestle with scriptures see Jesus ascending to His Father, God John 20:17 BUT John 1:1 equally conflates the Word 'with' God and "God" at the same time as well. Anything 'more' or 'less' than scripture gives, we believe, is presumptuous and heresy. "We" humans don't get to qualify God, He qualifies Himself and we but listen to what He says. Going beyond scripture is not only wrong, it is arrogance and sin. -Lon

Who is going beyond scripture? And why are you acting like I am denying the trinity doctrine that isn't even in scripture?

So since you don't go beyond what scripture plainly states then perhaps you could show where it says GOD is three separate persons, or that GOD is three separate spirits.

By the way; it isn't my logic; just logic in general.

It isn't my doctrine that can't be verified by scripture.

The one in the mess would be the one claiming GOD is three anything all while claiming others heretical, and ignoring the vast majority of scripture in favor of the misinterpretation of a couple of verses they do not even grasp.


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[JudgeRightly]

I'm very glad that you agree that the three differences aren't persons, but perspectives when speaking of the perceivable nature of GOD(Creator) from the perspective of man(creation).

Then you misunderstood what I said.

I said from one perspective, there is only one dollar bill (or one God). From another perspective, there are three dollar bills (or three Persons.

I've stated such myself here numerous times only to be refuted. Regardless; i'm glad we seem to agree on a point.

You're sadly mistaken.

 

[JudgeRightly]

He wouldn't have needed to have been saved if he was righteous.

And how was he righteous? He committed a crime, that instantly disqualifies him from being named among the righteous.

Salvation is free, but that isn't the same as salvation being nothing. Faith is effectual and causal to good works pleasing to GOD. Not because man saves himself, but because man both hears and believes.

You preach hearing.

Believing is doing.

Believing is a work only under the law. Christians are not under the law, therefore if they believe, it is not a work, but faith.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Then you misunderstood what I said.

I said from one perspective, there is only one dollar bill (or one God). From another perspective, there are three dollar bills (or three Persons.



You're sadly mistaken.

How am I mistaken when we agree that there is One GOD but three perspectives to perceive that GOD?



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[popsthebuilder]

And how was he righteous? He committed a crime, that instantly disqualifies him from being named among the righteous.



Believing is a work only under the law. Christians are not under the law, therefore if they believe, it is not a work, but faith.

I clearly said he wasn't righteous.

When are you going to stop drawing an imaginary dividing line between jew and gentile?



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[JudgeRightly]

How am I mistaken when we agree that there is One GOD but three perspectives to perceive that GOD?

Where in the world did I mention a third perspective? I said that from one perspective, or angle God is one God, but from a second perspective, God is three Persons. How do you get a third perspective when I only discussed two?

Edit: And even then, when I say "perspective," I'm not talking about God, I'm talking about a person's point of view.

 

[Right Divider]

Where in the world did I mention a third perspective? I said that from one perspective, or angle God is one God, but from a second perspective, God is three Persons. How do you get a third perspective when I only discussed two?

Probably the same place that he got 3 one third "gods".

 

[JudgeRightly]

I clearly said he wasn't righteous.

1) You weren't clear at all, because you said "if he was righteous he wouldn't need to be saved." That's a conditional statement, not a clear statement of fact.
2) How was he saved if he was not righteous?

When are you going to stop drawing an imaginary dividing line between jew and gentile?

Once again, you have no idea what my position is. I don't draw a line between Jew and Gentile except to say that there is a difference between Jews (ie, Israel, Israelites, God's people, etc) and the rest of the world (Gentiles).

Within the Body of Christ, there is no distinction, clearly. However, there is a distinction between the Body of Christ and Israel. That is the distinction I make, the "imaginary line" you hate so much, and that the Bible makes explicitly clear.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Where in the world did I mention a third perspective? I said that from one perspective, or angle God is one God, but from a second perspective, God is three Persons. How do you get a third perspective when I only discussed two?

Edit: And even then, when I say "perspective," I'm not talking about God, I'm talking about a person's point of view.

And that is called unscriptural, polytheistic idol worship to the monotheistic Christian.

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[popsthebuilder]

1) You weren't clear at all, because you said "if he was righteous he wouldn't need to be saved." That's a conditional statement, not a clear statement of fact.
2) How was he saved if he was not righteous?



Once again, you have no idea what my position is. I don't draw a line between Jew and Gentile except to say that there is a difference between Jews (ie, Israel, Israelites, God's people, etc) and the rest of the world (Gentiles).

Within the Body of Christ, there is no distinction, clearly. However, there is a distinction between the Body of Christ and Israel. That is the distinction I make, the "imaginary line" you hate so much, and that the Bible makes explicitly clear.

Soooo.....no two gospels?

Could you show the distinction between spiritual Israel and the body of Christ at or near end times with scripture please?

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[popsthebuilder]

How am I mistaken when we agree that there is One GOD but three perspectives to perceive that GOD?



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Oh...I see now; each are separately 100% GOD? That is what you meant by three separate whole dollars right?
So three separate gods....but if those separately make up one god each then the combination would be 300%.


Yeah....that can't be right.

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[glorydaz]

Your "gospel of grace" is that you can kill 600 men and it will not affect your salvation.

LA

Yeah, I always wished I was a sniper in the Army with that kind of record. Ah well, I'm simply not that good of a shot. :sigh:

 

[Right Divider]

Yeah, I always wished I was a sniper in the Army with that kind of record. Ah well, I'm simply not that good of a shot. :sigh:

It's pretty easy to spot an unbeliever that thinks that the gospel of the grace of God makes us want to become mass murderers. :think:

 

[glorydaz]

It's pretty easy to spot an unbeliever that thinks that gospel of the grace of God makes us want to become mass murderers. :think:

Yeah, they imagine all kinds of horrible things about what we must be up to. Just shows what temptations must be running through their own minds....what they would do if the law wasn't constraining them.