musterion
Well-known member
Eph 2:12 must not be included in The Stoner Bible.
ECT The Mystery: What and Why
- Thread starter Danoh
- Start date
Eph 2:12 must not be included in The Stoner Bible.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Woah! Far out.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
God fearing Jews/Gentiles (called out during Acts): due a blessing per Gen 12:1-3 (KJV)
Cast out Jews/Alien Gentiles (called out post Acts): not due a blessing, but blessed ANYWAY, by grace
They join the same body. This is as simple as I can state it!
Cast out Jews/Alien Gentiles (called out post Acts): not due a blessing, but blessed ANYWAY, by grace
They join the same body. This is as simple as I can state it!
2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
See that; not just salvation in Christ Jesus, but this salvation which is in Him with ETERNAL glory.
There is an end intended as to salvation: A Glory.
1 Corinthians 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
The Cross had been prophesied, Isaiah 53; etc.
They had known that.
But they had not known Paul's Mystery aspect of the Cross.
How that by the Cross, God would also make it possible to reconcile back unto His governmental authority via A NEW Creature, those fallen Heavenly places A; not just the Earth.
Paul is lamenting his not being able to share the details of this Mystery with members of this NEW Creature: the Body of Christ, at Corinth.
They have failed to go beyond "Christ died for us" - even screwing that up (1 Cor. 15).
Due to their focus on self-importance.
1 Corinthians 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
Very similar to how some on here consistently only post disagreement with those they do not like; ignoring them completely where there is actual agreement on some point.
That kind of thing comes at a price to those who believe in such a fool practice - it not only blinds them to being able to grow deeper in distinctions, but at the same time it results in their growing less and less able to consider any conclusion but their own.
It's best to agree with others where they are sound on some point; not just disagree with them where they are not.
The Lord; the Apostle Paul share this practice in common.
Matthew 8:10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
Titus 1:12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies. 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
See that; not just salvation in Christ Jesus, but this salvation which is in Him with ETERNAL glory.
There is an end intended as to salvation: A Glory.
1 Corinthians 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
The Cross had been prophesied, Isaiah 53; etc.
They had known that.
But they had not known Paul's Mystery aspect of the Cross.
How that by the Cross, God would also make it possible to reconcile back unto His governmental authority via A NEW Creature, those fallen Heavenly places A; not just the Earth.
Paul is lamenting his not being able to share the details of this Mystery with members of this NEW Creature: the Body of Christ, at Corinth.
They have failed to go beyond "Christ died for us" - even screwing that up (1 Cor. 15).
Due to their focus on self-importance.
1 Corinthians 3:1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 3:2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
Very similar to how some on here consistently only post disagreement with those they do not like; ignoring them completely where there is actual agreement on some point.
That kind of thing comes at a price to those who believe in such a fool practice - it not only blinds them to being able to grow deeper in distinctions, but at the same time it results in their growing less and less able to consider any conclusion but their own.
It's best to agree with others where they are sound on some point; not just disagree with them where they are not.
The Lord; the Apostle Paul share this practice in common.
Matthew 8:10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
Titus 1:12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies. 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
musterion
Well-known member
The big problem people appear to have with all this is anything that denies them the old things of Israel. That's where they get riled.
They've been brainwashed into "persevere or else" and so hate the idea of unconditioned eternal security in Christ, no works for justification, etc. They seem to actually LIKE trying to earn salvation. They seem to ENJOY submitting (and making others submit) to legalistic rituals, including water rites. They seem to LOOK FORWARD to the horrors that are coming when God once again is dealing with Israel as Israel, and to proving themselves by enduring through it all. For the life of me I cannot wrap my mind around that kind of thinking. Couldn't fathom it, even before I was mid-Acts.
They've been brainwashed into "persevere or else" and so hate the idea of unconditioned eternal security in Christ, no works for justification, etc. They seem to actually LIKE trying to earn salvation. They seem to ENJOY submitting (and making others submit) to legalistic rituals, including water rites. They seem to LOOK FORWARD to the horrors that are coming when God once again is dealing with Israel as Israel, and to proving themselves by enduring through it all. For the life of me I cannot wrap my mind around that kind of thinking. Couldn't fathom it, even before I was mid-Acts.
Simply stating a thing proves nothing - even this statement I have just now simply stated is subject to the need for a thing to be properly examined.
I'll say it again - simply - yours is an obvious oversimplification of Eph. 2.
There is what a thing says.
And what it is actually talking about - in light of overall scope and context.
That is two things; not one.
And then there is oversimplification.
Or the isolating of a thing from within it's overall scope and context; ending up as a result, at an "it means what it says" that is "far off" from the overall scope and context (and their resulting principle) a thing actually based on, and a part of.
Eph. 2 is Romans 3. Both now concluded under sin; both now have direct access - regardless of national distinction.
Access by faith.
It is about a spiritual issue, NOT about a geographical one.
It has nothing to do with Gentiles off in China or wherever, not having been able to partake of the Abrahamic "them that bless you, I'll bless."
Romans 3 has THE WORLD in mind.
Just as 2 Corinthians 5 does...
2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Ephesians 2 is merely the continued expansion of this; also from 2 Corinthians 5:
5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
This was before Paul even wrote Romans, let alone; was in prison...
2 Corinthians 10:13 But we will not boast of things without our measure, but according to the measure of the rule which God hath distributed to us, a measure to reach even unto you. 10:14 For we stretch not ourselves beyond our measure, as though we reached not unto you: for we are come as far as to you also in preaching the gospel of Christ: 10:15 Not boasting of things without our measure, that is, of other men's labours; but having hope, when your faith is increased, that we shall be enlarged by you according to our rule abundantly, 10:16 To preach the gospel in the regions beyond you, and not to boast in another man's line of things made ready to our hand.
Thanks for the worthy challenge of reflecting on these things that your assertions often inspire in me, STP.
You are one of very few who is a worthy "sword" in this, bro.
Proverbs 27:17 Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.
Far too many, even within MAD, being the other...
Job 16:9 He teareth me in his wrath, who hateth me: he gnasheth upon me with his teeth; mine enemy sharpeneth his eyes upon me.
True words...
Then again, as is case with many MADS; you were headed for Mid-Acts before you were aware you were.
You just did not know it.
Obviously, you were applying the "things that differ" principle in response to and against the traditions of men, unaware this principle was what the Scripture was leading you to apply.
You/we now know what you/we know - that MAD is NOT the cart before the horse - the traditions of men IS.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Like I've said before.
There are worse things to be doing with your time than chasing your tail in MAD.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
There is no during or post Acts difference.
Won't matter how many times you try to jam it in there.:rip:
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Compare:
1 and 2 Cor
1 and 2 Thess
Galatians
Romans
with
1 and 2 Tim
Titus
Eph
Phil
Col
Philemon
Believe, and think.
1 and 2 Cor
1 and 2 Thess
Galatians
Romans
with
1 and 2 Tim
Titus
Eph
Phil
Col
Philemon
Believe, and think.
heir
TOL Subscriber
It's been proven over and over with scripture on this site and to you specifically, but you have decided to not see it for what it is (Ephesians 3:9 KJV).
You're doing it again (rambling).
No, it isn't. You want to make everything Paul said, reiteration when nothing could be further from the truth (Acts 26:16 KJV, 2 Corinthians 12:1 KJV).
The Jews still had the advantage in Romans 3 (Romans 3:1-4 KJV), but no longer by the close of Acts (28:17-28 KJV).
The Bible tells us that there was a time past when Gentiles like the Ephesians to whom Paul wrote the letter had no hope. No hope means no hope and the time past of it included the time of promise during Acts when salvation was sent, but unto these: Acts 13:16 KJV, Acts 13:26 KJV! It's not until Paul was given the dispensation of the grace of God that we know it included the likes of these Ephesians (Ephesians 2:11-12 KJV) and us! And it is not until Paul makes mention of the middle wall of partition being broken down that Gentiles such as the Ephesians to whom Paul wrote the letter (and us by extension) are shown by the scriptures to have access by the faith of Jesus Christ (Ephesians 2:13-15 KJV, Ephesians 3:12 KJV)! Why you fight this, is beyond me!
Who ever said their being "far off" was geographical?
It is not all inclusive as Paul had yet to be sent to all men (1 Timothy 2:4-6 KJV)!
2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV is the bridge Paul would later use to reveal that which he was holding out on at that present time(2 Corinthians 12:1-6 KJV)!
Who told you that? I lean toward Romans being written before 2 Corinthians!
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1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
I'm not unaware of yer antics.
Your every post proves that is exactly what you are doing :chuckle:
Another over simplification :chuckle:
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Far out.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Indeed.
Acts shows Israel's fall, diminishing, and casting away.
This affects Paul's ministry in many ways throughout the years. And it is reflected in his first six letters that I noted before.
Nope - the Believing remnant of Israel were sealed and the rest were concluded having continued on their father's same uncircumcision of the heart (Gentile, or heathen status) before Paul was saved.
The Believing Remnant and the "some..."
Romans 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
The rest, or "some..."
Acts 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers: 7:53 Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.
Paul basically repeats as early as...
1 Thessalonians 2:15 Who both killed the Lord Jesus, and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they please not God, and are contrary to all men: 2:16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
Here it is again - unbelieving Israel's status before God way before this supposed second sending of Paul's...
Why? For the same reason Stephen proclaimed just before they added him to their continued FILLING UP of their sins against the LORD and His Christ.
Romans 2:25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
The status of both..
Romans 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
It is also in Galatians - it is not some post Acts new thing.
You are isolating the passages you base your assertions on - you are isolating outside of their overall scope and context.
This is not simple. It is complex.
Complex = various components which together form a whole.
Overcomplictating = putting things together in a way that does not jibe with the principles for how things work together as one.
You are confusing the complex I am breaking apart; you are congusing it with the word "over complicating."
Just as you are confusing the word simplistic, with the word simple.
My apology to you STP, for having to point this out.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Not even close,Danoh.
I expose them to their error.
You on the other hand lie to them about MAD not equating to being a Doctrine of Man.
Lying does not equate to craftiness.