JustAChristian
New member
Bible Link to help your study.
Bible Link to help your study.
http://www.netbiblestudy.net/
JustAChristian
Bible Link to help your study.
http://www.netbiblestudy.net/
JustAChristian
The Heretics Message to the World:Be Baptized to be Saved! (HOF thread)
- Thread starter Freak
- Start date
JustAChristian
New member
Fulfilling Prophesy!
Fulfilling Prophesy!
The Church of Christ with its beginning in the 1st century is the answer to prophesy. Let us see how that is true.
America is a great nation of religious people. There are many diverse manners of worshiping. We can not call ourselves a Christian nation exclusively, because all variation of worship and praise is seen among us. Even the eastern religions have their impact on the hearts of people in the United States today. This is greatly because of the influx of immigration over the last one hundred and fifty years. I feel I could safely say, that there is not a single world religion that is not seen today in America.
We see in the lives of worshipers of Jehovah, the creator of all things, a great division. Churches have sprung up in America with the purpose of worshiping God through Jesus Christ, but with the inventions of men as a great part of their worship. When Jesus said He would build His church ( Mt 16:18), I believe He had specifics in mind on how it was to function. He placed leaders in the various offices ( Eph 4:11). They were to direct it's works, giving them the authority to bind and loose those things that were allowed from the throne of grace. These leaders were not to use the church as an instrument of human philosophy, or as a place to satisfy the whelms of man. It was to be a place to worship God, and in the manner in which God requires (Jn 4:24). Any deviation from the pattern of worship is forbidden. In the church we see at large, we must admit there is departure from the original pattern. I will attempt to show how the church has been altered.
Jesus built one institution and called it the church. It began on the first day of Pentecost after our Lord rose from the dead. It was not intended as a substitute for the kingdom, as some teach, but was the spiritual kingdom of Christ . It was prophesied in Isaiah, Daniel. The time of beginning was specifically given. Hear the Bible on this point:
"And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand forever" (Dan 2:44)
"And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob, and He will teach us of His ways, and we will walk in His paths, for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isa 2:2).
Each of these verses tells of the establishment of the church, the eternal kingdom of Christ. It was to begin in the days of these kings, the Roman Empire the fourth kingdom mentioned to Nebuchadnezzar by Daniel. It was to happen in the last days, and the law and the word of God was to go forth from Jerusalem (Isa. 2:2) The Hebrew writer declared saying that God "Hath in these Last Days spoken unto us by His Son (Heb 1:2). This was when the Roman Empire was at it's greatest. So these prophesies point to the time of the establishment of Christ's church. The apostles set the pattern of worship according to the dictates of Christ (Mt 28:18-20; Acts 2:42-47). If the institution in which you have elected to worship God is not as old as the first century church of Christ, it is a church with an altered pattern. It is a church that will not be accepted by Christ at the judgment (Mt 25:46).
The true church of Christ is the everlasting kingdom of God. The Lord’s kingdom is a spiritual kingdom, and no nation can destroy or occupy it. Come to know the Lord's kingdom and church from the Bible and let it be a part of your life. It is important for your eternal salvation. Jesus has promised to save His church (Eph 5:23).
JustAChristian
Fulfilling Prophesy!
The Church of Christ with its beginning in the 1st century is the answer to prophesy. Let us see how that is true.
America is a great nation of religious people. There are many diverse manners of worshiping. We can not call ourselves a Christian nation exclusively, because all variation of worship and praise is seen among us. Even the eastern religions have their impact on the hearts of people in the United States today. This is greatly because of the influx of immigration over the last one hundred and fifty years. I feel I could safely say, that there is not a single world religion that is not seen today in America.
We see in the lives of worshipers of Jehovah, the creator of all things, a great division. Churches have sprung up in America with the purpose of worshiping God through Jesus Christ, but with the inventions of men as a great part of their worship. When Jesus said He would build His church ( Mt 16:18), I believe He had specifics in mind on how it was to function. He placed leaders in the various offices ( Eph 4:11). They were to direct it's works, giving them the authority to bind and loose those things that were allowed from the throne of grace. These leaders were not to use the church as an instrument of human philosophy, or as a place to satisfy the whelms of man. It was to be a place to worship God, and in the manner in which God requires (Jn 4:24). Any deviation from the pattern of worship is forbidden. In the church we see at large, we must admit there is departure from the original pattern. I will attempt to show how the church has been altered.
Jesus built one institution and called it the church. It began on the first day of Pentecost after our Lord rose from the dead. It was not intended as a substitute for the kingdom, as some teach, but was the spiritual kingdom of Christ . It was prophesied in Isaiah, Daniel. The time of beginning was specifically given. Hear the Bible on this point:
"And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand forever" (Dan 2:44)
"And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob, and He will teach us of His ways, and we will walk in His paths, for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isa 2:2).
Each of these verses tells of the establishment of the church, the eternal kingdom of Christ. It was to begin in the days of these kings, the Roman Empire the fourth kingdom mentioned to Nebuchadnezzar by Daniel. It was to happen in the last days, and the law and the word of God was to go forth from Jerusalem (Isa. 2:2) The Hebrew writer declared saying that God "Hath in these Last Days spoken unto us by His Son (Heb 1:2). This was when the Roman Empire was at it's greatest. So these prophesies point to the time of the establishment of Christ's church. The apostles set the pattern of worship according to the dictates of Christ (Mt 28:18-20; Acts 2:42-47). If the institution in which you have elected to worship God is not as old as the first century church of Christ, it is a church with an altered pattern. It is a church that will not be accepted by Christ at the judgment (Mt 25:46).
The true church of Christ is the everlasting kingdom of God. The Lord’s kingdom is a spiritual kingdom, and no nation can destroy or occupy it. Come to know the Lord's kingdom and church from the Bible and let it be a part of your life. It is important for your eternal salvation. Jesus has promised to save His church (Eph 5:23).
JustAChristian
c.moore
New member
Quote by melody
ONE name, ONE God.
Quote by c.moore
Your sure right about that, M't:1:23: Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
Is it ok to take this name Melody, because at least Jehovah God is here also in Emmanuel. Praise God!
Quote Melody
You claim that doctrine is built on two or three witnesses. Where are your two or three scriptures supporting or demonstrating baptism in the {name of the father, son, and Holy Ghost}.
Quote by c.moore
M't:28:19: Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
1Jo:5:6: This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1Jo:5:7: For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jo:5:8: And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
If these three be one God and Jesus is the WORD then we can use His name on earth sence I said before in my last post that it please the Father God that all the fullness is in jesus, and His name is above all names, but we that personal know Jesus , know that Jesus is the Father ,the Son, and the Holy Spirit= to all one.
Quote by melody
The apostles never preached it or practiced it in the scripture.
Quote by c.moore
Who has the final Word Apostles or Jesus?????
Quote by Melody
Father, son and Holy Ghost are not proper names they are titles of relationships.
Jesus is the only name given under heaven whereby we MUST be saved
Quote by c.moore
You said ; given under heaven whereby we MUST be saved
How about in heaven, and in the spiritual world who is Jesus????
The bible says , and I will repeat; 1Jo:5:7: For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
Most born again christian know that Jesus is God and when you use Jesus name we know it means , the Father , SON, and Holy GHOST, and Jesus is all in one, and that why everything must bow before the name of Jesus because of all the fullness that is in the name of Jesus all = to one God like you said and name.
M'r:12:29: And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
1Co:8:4: As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
Eph:4:6: One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
I wish and pray that you really can understand this scripture below so you will know why in the Name of Jesus is used for us.
1Tm:2:5: For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Is it true that you don`t believe in healings, and that it died out???
Also you don`t believe in the trinity????
Also you don`t believe a person can be saved by Belief and trust Jesus as their savior only?????
Also you don`t believe in tithes according to Mal:3:8: Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.
Mal:3:9: Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.
Let God bless you
peace
ONE name, ONE God.
Quote by c.moore
Your sure right about that, M't:1:23: Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
Is it ok to take this name Melody, because at least Jehovah God is here also in Emmanuel. Praise God!
Quote Melody
You claim that doctrine is built on two or three witnesses. Where are your two or three scriptures supporting or demonstrating baptism in the {name of the father, son, and Holy Ghost}.
Quote by c.moore
M't:28:19: Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
1Jo:5:6: This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
1Jo:5:7: For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
1Jo:5:8: And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
If these three be one God and Jesus is the WORD then we can use His name on earth sence I said before in my last post that it please the Father God that all the fullness is in jesus, and His name is above all names, but we that personal know Jesus , know that Jesus is the Father ,the Son, and the Holy Spirit= to all one.
Quote by melody
The apostles never preached it or practiced it in the scripture.
Quote by c.moore
Who has the final Word Apostles or Jesus?????
Quote by Melody
Father, son and Holy Ghost are not proper names they are titles of relationships.
Jesus is the only name given under heaven whereby we MUST be saved
Quote by c.moore
You said ; given under heaven whereby we MUST be saved
How about in heaven, and in the spiritual world who is Jesus????
The bible says , and I will repeat; 1Jo:5:7: For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
Most born again christian know that Jesus is God and when you use Jesus name we know it means , the Father , SON, and Holy GHOST, and Jesus is all in one, and that why everything must bow before the name of Jesus because of all the fullness that is in the name of Jesus all = to one God like you said and name.
M'r:12:29: And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
1Co:8:4: As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.
Eph:4:6: One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
I wish and pray that you really can understand this scripture below so you will know why in the Name of Jesus is used for us.
1Tm:2:5: For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Is it true that you don`t believe in healings, and that it died out???
Also you don`t believe in the trinity????
Also you don`t believe a person can be saved by Belief and trust Jesus as their savior only?????
Also you don`t believe in tithes according to Mal:3:8: Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.
Mal:3:9: Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.
Let God bless you
peace
c.moore
New member
JustAchristian
here is also something to study with out contradicting yourself.
I chech out your link so please check out mine
This is also good for you also Melody.
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/baptism.htm
I hope you let this bless you
here is also something to study with out contradicting yourself.
I chech out your link so please check out mine
This is also good for you also Melody.
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/baptism.htm
I hope you let this bless you
Last edited:
B
biblicalanser4u
Guest
JustaChristian, peace and blessings to you.
If you would, instead of posting the whole quote next time, without answering a single point, I ask that you answer my points 1 by 1. Can we do that? Thank You.
2. The Body of Christ of this dispensation is a joint-body of Jews and Gentiles, but the minstry of Pentecost and for some seven or eight years thereafter was to the Jews only as shown by:
Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: JEWS ONLY!!!!!
22--Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: JEWS ONLY!!!!!! Acts 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk? JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
v 25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
v26-Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!!!
Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel, JEWS ONLY!!!!!!! Acts 5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!!
Acts 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only. To WHO? JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
Please answer that, I begging YOU!!!!
If you would, instead of posting the whole quote next time, without answering a single point, I ask that you answer my points 1 by 1. Can we do that? Thank You.
Your reference to the Church of Christ here is misapplied. You are totally ignoring the fact that the Acts references you gave, Peter is speaking to the Jews ONLY!!!!!
Totally off the topic!!!!!!!!!!!!
True, I'm glad you see it.
Then why do you follow that?
Again, what church? As I have explained in earlier posts, Pentecost was all about Isreal. Peter even says so twice in Acts 2. Why ignore that? Answer Point 2 PLEASE?
2. The Body of Christ of this dispensation is a joint-body of Jews and Gentiles, but the minstry of Pentecost and for some seven or eight years thereafter was to the Jews only as shown by:
Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: JEWS ONLY!!!!!
22--Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: JEWS ONLY!!!!!! Acts 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk? JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
v 25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
v26-Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!!!
Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel, JEWS ONLY!!!!!!! Acts 5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!!
Acts 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only. To WHO? JEWS ONLY!!!!!!!
Please answer that, I begging YOU!!!!
Yes!!!!! That is the SECOND COMING!!!
Again, after Jesus returns
As for all your sentences before your last sentence, You are very mistaken. As for your last sentence, since I belong to the Body of Christ started by Paul (In the 1st century), I guess Im doing ok then.
true again.
JustAChristian
New member
Will The Lord Return To The Earth?
Will The Lord Return To The Earth?
biblicalanser4u,
Can you give me one verse of scripture that Jesus will come to the earth again? Now, I don't want some obscure statement that refers to Israel and Judah's return after the captivity, I want explicit and clear referance to Jesus coming again and establishing a kingdom in Jerusalem.
With respect to Daniel's prophesy (Dan. 2:44). Daniel is specific about this being the in a time of "these Kings". It is during a time when there were consecutive kingdoms. It was to be a kingdom that would destroy all other kingdoms -- not physically but spiritually; by consuming them with righteousness. The Lord mentionsed that his kingdom was not to be a physical or worldly kingdom, but a kingdom non-the-less. His kingdom is the church (Matthew 16:18-20), and is everlasting. The church will be delivered to heaven to continue in everlastingness. Christ is King of Kings and Lord of lords. We have been translated out of darkness into the kingdom (present continueing) of the Lord (Col.1:13). Have a great day.
Now, do you want to get back on the thread? Baptism is the general subject of this course.
JustAChristian
Will The Lord Return To The Earth?
biblicalanser4u,
Can you give me one verse of scripture that Jesus will come to the earth again? Now, I don't want some obscure statement that refers to Israel and Judah's return after the captivity, I want explicit and clear referance to Jesus coming again and establishing a kingdom in Jerusalem.
With respect to Daniel's prophesy (Dan. 2:44). Daniel is specific about this being the in a time of "these Kings". It is during a time when there were consecutive kingdoms. It was to be a kingdom that would destroy all other kingdoms -- not physically but spiritually; by consuming them with righteousness. The Lord mentionsed that his kingdom was not to be a physical or worldly kingdom, but a kingdom non-the-less. His kingdom is the church (Matthew 16:18-20), and is everlasting. The church will be delivered to heaven to continue in everlastingness. Christ is King of Kings and Lord of lords. We have been translated out of darkness into the kingdom (present continueing) of the Lord (Col.1:13). Have a great day.
Now, do you want to get back on the thread? Baptism is the general subject of this course.
JustAChristian
c.moore
New member
Re: c.moore is still waiting!
Re: c.moore is still waiting!
Quote by c.moore
no it`s about what you said and wrote in your post that is confussing, check it out for yourself.
Quote by JustAchristian
Symbolism needs to be understood in order to give proper biblical interpretation. Water is symbolized as a grave in Romans 6. We are buried in the grave of water. A grave consist of a hole, dirt and covering up.
Quote by c.moore
Are you saying that the water baptism is really a symbol of the spiritual baptism??????
Quote JustAchristian
In the latter part of Gal. 3:27, Paul states that in baptism we "put on Christ." Again we come to symbolism.
Quote c.moore
Are you saying that water baptism is a symbol AGAIN??????????????????????
Quote JustAchristian
WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS ABOUT BAPTISM
Baptism is the point at which a person is united with Christ into His death and resurrection into "newness of life" (Rom 6:3)
There is only ONE recognized baptism. "One Lord, one faith, one baptism," (Eph 4:5)
There is not a spiritual baptism and a water baptism.
The baptism recognized is the one instituted by Christ himself, which He said was in order to "fulfill ALL righteousness" (Mt 3:15).
Quote c.moore
You said; that you didn´t say this in one of your post, but here is the proof again.
I don`t know if your lieing ,or if your confused.
I hope this is not the reason why you don`t understand about the truth of water baptism.
Please check out what you posted, because so how it look like you was calling me a liar, but I don`t let this bother me because I can humble myself even though I know I am right, and correct about something. If you can`t didvide rightly your posts, then I think you will have A hard time dividing the bible.
I just want to be a help and A blessing to you,
I guess because it`s just Jesus in me, but check this out JustAchristian!
Quote by JustAchristian
I have never contended that there was never two baptisms. In fact, there is three baptisms : Water, Holy Spirit and fire. Am I getting too deep for you c.moore? What we need to always do is in fact, rightly divide the word of God. John came baptizing in the Jordan (water baptism). Jesus baptized with the Holy Spirit (On the day of Pentecost over the Apostles, and at the house of Cornelius. This fulfulled the promise that all flesh (Jew and Gentile) would be baptrized with the Holy Spirit. All flesh does not mean all people, for there are numerous examples of Christians that did not experience the HolySpirit baptism in the Bible.
Quote by cmoore
What`s up with that JustAchristian?
You write about my spelling and say it so bad, but you can see the log in your eyes about you contraditions.
HHHHHHHHHMMMMMMMMM???????
I am still waiting again for an answer JustAchristian.
I wounder how long will you take this time to answer, or run away.
Let God bless you
peace
Re: c.moore is still waiting!
Quote by c.moore
no it`s about what you said and wrote in your post that is confussing, check it out for yourself.
Quote by JustAchristian
Symbolism needs to be understood in order to give proper biblical interpretation. Water is symbolized as a grave in Romans 6. We are buried in the grave of water. A grave consist of a hole, dirt and covering up.
Quote by c.moore
Are you saying that the water baptism is really a symbol of the spiritual baptism??????
Quote JustAchristian
In the latter part of Gal. 3:27, Paul states that in baptism we "put on Christ." Again we come to symbolism.
Quote c.moore
Are you saying that water baptism is a symbol AGAIN??????????????????????
Quote JustAchristian
WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS ABOUT BAPTISM
Baptism is the point at which a person is united with Christ into His death and resurrection into "newness of life" (Rom 6:3)
There is only ONE recognized baptism. "One Lord, one faith, one baptism," (Eph 4:5)
There is not a spiritual baptism and a water baptism.
The baptism recognized is the one instituted by Christ himself, which He said was in order to "fulfill ALL righteousness" (Mt 3:15).
Quote c.moore
You said; that you didn´t say this in one of your post, but here is the proof again.
I don`t know if your lieing ,or if your confused.
I hope this is not the reason why you don`t understand about the truth of water baptism.
Please check out what you posted, because so how it look like you was calling me a liar, but I don`t let this bother me because I can humble myself even though I know I am right, and correct about something. If you can`t didvide rightly your posts, then I think you will have A hard time dividing the bible.
I just want to be a help and A blessing to you,
I guess because it`s just Jesus in me, but check this out JustAchristian!
Quote by JustAchristian
I have never contended that there was never two baptisms. In fact, there is three baptisms : Water, Holy Spirit and fire. Am I getting too deep for you c.moore? What we need to always do is in fact, rightly divide the word of God. John came baptizing in the Jordan (water baptism). Jesus baptized with the Holy Spirit (On the day of Pentecost over the Apostles, and at the house of Cornelius. This fulfulled the promise that all flesh (Jew and Gentile) would be baptrized with the Holy Spirit. All flesh does not mean all people, for there are numerous examples of Christians that did not experience the HolySpirit baptism in the Bible.
Quote by cmoore
What`s up with that JustAchristian?
You write about my spelling and say it so bad, but you can see the log in your eyes about you contraditions.
HHHHHHHHHMMMMMMMMM???????
I am still waiting again for an answer JustAchristian.
I wounder how long will you take this time to answer, or run away.
Let God bless you
peace
Evangelion
New member
This is getting crazier and crazier...
On the one hand, I agree with JustAChristian on the subject of baptism.
On the other hand, I agree with Biblicalanser4u on the subject of the Second Advent!
On the one hand, I agree with JustAChristian on the subject of baptism.
On the other hand, I agree with Biblicalanser4u on the subject of the Second Advent!
c.moore
New member
Originally posted by Evangelion
This is getting crazier and crazier...
On the one hand, I agree with JustAChristian on the subject of baptism.
On the other hand, I agree with Biblicalanser4u on the subject of the Second Advent!
Quote by c.moore
Everybody is at a certain level in their faith walk.
Some have it , and some lack Hosea 4:6
and
Ro:12:3: For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
Ro:12:4: For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:
Ro:12:5: So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Ro:12:6: Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
God Bless
peace
missedmarks
New member
Here's a hypothetical
Bubba is a murderer, rapist, child molestor, and everything else you can think of. He 'finds Jesus' in the days before his execution, and is Baptized "properly" (by whatever means of Baptism you feel is correct.
Jimbo is a good boy, not perfect, but a good boy. He is a Christian his whole life and does his best to be a "good and faithfull servant" unfortunatly he was Baptized "improperly" (by whatever means of Baptism you feel is wrong)
Mother Thereasa devotes her whole life to doing God's work for the poor. As a Catholic she was probably baptized as an infant.
I contend that all these people are saved. Not because of their works, not because of the way they were Baptized, not because of the way they lived their lives. They are all saved because they have faith in Jesus Christ their saivor. For those who believe baptism is necessary, they all believed and were baptized.
Jesus commanded Baptism. You can dig deeper and find biblical support for just about any method of Baptizing, I have yet to find anything that says God will deny you his gifts for being baptized "wrong" If the Glory is given to God, I don't believe there is a wrong way to baptize.
Jesus died for your sins, so you may have eternal life. He did not die so you could follow a bunch of rules and rituals and MAYBE earn eternal life (if you get everything right)
Bubba is a murderer, rapist, child molestor, and everything else you can think of. He 'finds Jesus' in the days before his execution, and is Baptized "properly" (by whatever means of Baptism you feel is correct.
Jimbo is a good boy, not perfect, but a good boy. He is a Christian his whole life and does his best to be a "good and faithfull servant" unfortunatly he was Baptized "improperly" (by whatever means of Baptism you feel is wrong)
Mother Thereasa devotes her whole life to doing God's work for the poor. As a Catholic she was probably baptized as an infant.
I contend that all these people are saved. Not because of their works, not because of the way they were Baptized, not because of the way they lived their lives. They are all saved because they have faith in Jesus Christ their saivor. For those who believe baptism is necessary, they all believed and were baptized.
Jesus commanded Baptism. You can dig deeper and find biblical support for just about any method of Baptizing, I have yet to find anything that says God will deny you his gifts for being baptized "wrong" If the Glory is given to God, I don't believe there is a wrong way to baptize.
Jesus died for your sins, so you may have eternal life. He did not die so you could follow a bunch of rules and rituals and MAYBE earn eternal life (if you get everything right)
missedmarks
New member
One more point.
Where is your faith and trust? Is it in the rite of Baptism, your interpetation of scripture, your church, your church leaders, the men who built the church. Or is it in God who is the Lord of all these things.
I believe very strongly in the doctirne of my church, but in the end I am fully prepared to be proven wrong, in the end my faith is in God, and my saivor Jesus Christ, recieved through the Holy Spirit. I know mankind makes mistakes, God does not.
Where is your faith and trust? Is it in the rite of Baptism, your interpetation of scripture, your church, your church leaders, the men who built the church. Or is it in God who is the Lord of all these things.
I believe very strongly in the doctirne of my church, but in the end I am fully prepared to be proven wrong, in the end my faith is in God, and my saivor Jesus Christ, recieved through the Holy Spirit. I know mankind makes mistakes, God does not.
Evangelion
New member
Missedmarks, Evangelicals believe that they are "saved" instantly, from the very moment that they "let Jesus into their hearts" or "confess the name of Jesus." (Some even believe that they cannot lose their "salvation.") But people such as Kevin and myself do not believe that we are "saved" instantly after baptism. To us (as with Catholics), salvation is the end of a life-long process.
For this reason, questions such as "Which saves, baptism or Christ?" are simply irrelevant to us. They are, in fact, false dichotomies.
For this reason, questions such as "Which saves, baptism or Christ?" are simply irrelevant to us. They are, in fact, false dichotomies.
missedmarks
New member
I understand what you believe, and I understand what Evangelicals believe, it's all about the placement of Justification and Sanctification,
I am talking about the belief (I think Melody and JustaChristian and the primary proponants) that you can be somehow damned for failing to undergo a 'correct' baptism.
I am talking about the belief (I think Melody and JustaChristian and the primary proponants) that you can be somehow damned for failing to undergo a 'correct' baptism.
JustAChristian
New member
Responding to c.moore
Responding to c.moore
Baptism symbolizes the death, and burial of the "old man of sin" and resurrection into new life in Jesus Christ (Rom 6:3-5).
c.moore, I don't know what you are trying to prove by your ridiculous statement, and your spelling is still bad. Why don't you write this in Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and do the spell check. Lets get some intelligence to your rhetoric What makes you think I don't know the truth about baptism. It is very simple to understand. All you've got to do is accept what the bible has to say. "..baptism doth also now save us" (1 Peter 3:19-21). "He that believes and is baptized shall be saved" (Mark 16:16). "...arise and be baptized and wash away thy sins" (Acts 22:16). All these contexts require water. Water is in the plan for cleansing of sins (Acts 8:36).
c.moore, you couldn't recognize a proper entry if it came up and smacked you in the face. Your heart is so filthy with rotten man made doctrine that even talking to you like this almost makes me sick. If you were intelligent enough to carry on an rewarding debate, I could tolerate you more, but sometimes I think its worthless to think that will ever happen. Why don't you go study your bible for an hour or so each day and see if you can get some of those "man made cobwebs" out of your head.
JustAChristian
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
Responding to c.moore
Baptism symbolizes the death, and burial of the "old man of sin" and resurrection into new life in Jesus Christ (Rom 6:3-5).
c.moore, I don't know what you are trying to prove by your ridiculous statement, and your spelling is still bad. Why don't you write this in Word Perfect or Microsoft Word and do the spell check. Lets get some intelligence to your rhetoric What makes you think I don't know the truth about baptism. It is very simple to understand. All you've got to do is accept what the bible has to say. "..baptism doth also now save us" (1 Peter 3:19-21). "He that believes and is baptized shall be saved" (Mark 16:16). "...arise and be baptized and wash away thy sins" (Acts 22:16). All these contexts require water. Water is in the plan for cleansing of sins (Acts 8:36).
c.moore, you couldn't recognize a proper entry if it came up and smacked you in the face. Your heart is so filthy with rotten man made doctrine that even talking to you like this almost makes me sick. If you were intelligent enough to carry on an rewarding debate, I could tolerate you more, but sometimes I think its worthless to think that will ever happen. Why don't you go study your bible for an hour or so each day and see if you can get some of those "man made cobwebs" out of your head.
JustAChristian
Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
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JustAChristian
New member
What Makes The Difference?
What Makes The Difference?
missedmarks,
Opinions are like noses, everybody has one. From what I see in you post, your opinion and 99 cents will get you a cup of coffee at McDonalds. Morality, opinions and feelings have no place in God's plan of salvation. Jesus said, "Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32). Faith comes by hearing the word of God (Romans 10:17). "This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?" (Gal. 3:2). The "hearing of faith" is obeying the commands of God through Christ (John 7:21-24; Heb. 5:8-9). Baptism for the remission of sins is a command (Acts 2:38; Acts 10:47-49). If we do not abide in the doctrine of Christ (meaning obeying his commands) we have not God (2 John 9).
JustAChristian
1 Peter 1:22-23
22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
What Makes The Difference?
missedmarks,
Opinions are like noses, everybody has one. From what I see in you post, your opinion and 99 cents will get you a cup of coffee at McDonalds. Morality, opinions and feelings have no place in God's plan of salvation. Jesus said, "Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32). Faith comes by hearing the word of God (Romans 10:17). "This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?" (Gal. 3:2). The "hearing of faith" is obeying the commands of God through Christ (John 7:21-24; Heb. 5:8-9). Baptism for the remission of sins is a command (Acts 2:38; Acts 10:47-49). If we do not abide in the doctrine of Christ (meaning obeying his commands) we have not God (2 John 9).
JustAChristian
1 Peter 1:22-23
22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
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c.moore
New member
Hello missedmarks
You can see that these people that believe that water baptism is salvation are deceived, and no matter how we prove them wrong, they are deceived to believe their false doctrine.
2Th:2:10: And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th:2:11: And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th:2:12: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
2Th:2:13: But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
2Th:2:14: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Th:2:15: Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
This is why I praise the Lord everyday , that I have the truth in me , and I thank God that I am not one of these deceived christians, and people.
I could have been a Muslim,Mormon, or a Jehovah Wittness,or a dedicated Roman catholic , but, I thank God that His grace was on me to see the truth, and accept the truth, and I thank God for the heart that God gave me before the earth was even made, praise God.
Paul thought with all his heart , that killing christian was doing God`s will, untill God open his eyes, to see the truth.
notice that God open his eyes, and not theology, or debates, and doctrines. It hard to convince someone that is brain washed into a lie, and I think this is a spiritual matter rather than a theology matter.Eph:6:12: For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Eph:6:18: Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
I than you, and I know the Lord Jesus is proud of you that you are spreading the truth, even if other don`t accept, at least when they stand before the judgement seat of Christ , they can`t say that know one never told them the truth, and that all we can do is spread the truth and we will get a reward one day for trying to show love by helping other find the good news, and trust in Jesus alone.
Again, good job, in your teaching, and spreading the gospel.
God bless you
peace
You can see that these people that believe that water baptism is salvation are deceived, and no matter how we prove them wrong, they are deceived to believe their false doctrine.
2Th:2:10: And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th:2:11: And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th:2:12: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
2Th:2:13: But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
2Th:2:14: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Th:2:15: Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
This is why I praise the Lord everyday , that I have the truth in me , and I thank God that I am not one of these deceived christians, and people.
I could have been a Muslim,Mormon, or a Jehovah Wittness,or a dedicated Roman catholic , but, I thank God that His grace was on me to see the truth, and accept the truth, and I thank God for the heart that God gave me before the earth was even made, praise God.
Paul thought with all his heart , that killing christian was doing God`s will, untill God open his eyes, to see the truth.
notice that God open his eyes, and not theology, or debates, and doctrines. It hard to convince someone that is brain washed into a lie, and I think this is a spiritual matter rather than a theology matter.Eph:6:12: For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Eph:6:18: Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
I than you, and I know the Lord Jesus is proud of you that you are spreading the truth, even if other don`t accept, at least when they stand before the judgement seat of Christ , they can`t say that know one never told them the truth, and that all we can do is spread the truth and we will get a reward one day for trying to show love by helping other find the good news, and trust in Jesus alone.
Again, good job, in your teaching, and spreading the gospel.
God bless you
peace
missedmarks
New member
JustaChristian,
Yeah I know, It's the opinion that I (and millions of others) have formed after reading the Bible and considering it as a whole. God demands your obediance, but Christ's sacrifice makes up for your shortcomings.
Salvation comes from Jesus, not from the actions we take in response to him. If obediance saved, we wouldn't need a saivor.
c. moore
JustaChristain, has a different belief, but as long as his trust is in Jesus Christ, he is just as saved as you and I.
Yeah I know, It's the opinion that I (and millions of others) have formed after reading the Bible and considering it as a whole. God demands your obediance, but Christ's sacrifice makes up for your shortcomings.
Salvation comes from Jesus, not from the actions we take in response to him. If obediance saved, we wouldn't need a saivor.
c. moore
JustaChristain, has a different belief, but as long as his trust is in Jesus Christ, he is just as saved as you and I.