Scripture. What is considered Scripture?

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Then perhaps you can answer the two questions on Matthew’s genealogy:

1) Was Joseph a descendant of David’s Son Nathan or David’s son Solomon?
2) Matthew said there were 14 generations from David to the deportation. 1 Chronicles listed 18. Which one is wrong?

This may help:
Matthew wrote that there were 14 generations from David to the deportation. He listed the generations. He skips three generations, putting Uzziah in the place of Ahaziah, Joash, Amaziah, and Azariah.

So either Matthew has an error in counting the generations or 1 Chronicles 3 has an error in listing the generations.

Matthew 1 And David was the father of Solomon by the wife of Uriah, 7 and Solomon the father of Rehoboam, and Rehoboam the father of Abijah, and Abijah the father of Asaph, and Asaph the father of Jehoshaphat, and Jehoshaphat the father of Joram, and Joram the father of Uzziah, 9and Uzziah the father of Jotham, and Jotham the father of Ahaz, and Ahaz the father of Hezekiah...So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David to the deportation to Babylon, fourteen generations; and from the deportation to Babylon to the Messiah, fourteen generations.

1 Chronicles 3 The descendants of Solomon: Rehoboam, Abijah his son, Asa his son, Jehoshaphat his son, 11 Joram his son, Ahaziah his son, Joash his son, 12 Amaziah his son, Azariah his son, Jotham his son, 13 Ahaz his son, Hezekiah his son,


1 Chronicles 3.....Matthew
Solomon............ Solomom
Rehoboam...........Rehoboam
Abijah.............Abijah
Asa................Asaph
Jehoshaphat........Jehoshaphat
Joram..............Joram
Ahaziah............missing from Matthew
Joash..............missing from Matthew
Missing from 1 Chronicles......Uzziah
Amaziah............missing from Matthew
Azariah............missing from Matthew

Jotham.............Jotham
Ahaz...............Ahaz
Hezekiah...........Hezekiah

Minor differences in the names aren’t errors. Claiming there were 14 generations when there were 17 generations is an error. Actually, Matthew also skips Jehoiakim, so his miscount is off by 4. But I don’t want to pile on right now.

This is another error which disproves the man-made doctrine of inerrancy. It is an insignificant and minor error from the perspective of the validity and credibility of scriptures. It is another proof that the doctrine of inerrancy is false.

Translation: You are a bible corrector, not a bible believer.

We know.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
God never promised to perfectly preserved a set of writings. If you think He did, could you provide scriptural support for that claim?

Made up.

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. Psalms 12:6-7 KJV

Matthew 5 KJV
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 24 KJV

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Psalms 119 KJV

89 For ever, O Lord, thy word is settled in heaven...............
152 Concerning thy testimonies, I have known of old that thou hast founded them for ever.


And on, and on..

Watch him correct this, "re-interpret" it....Watch..
 

genuineoriginal

New member
Chapter, verse, that asserts that a translation cannot be scripture.
§13 An answer to the imputations of our adversaries
4 No cause therefore why the Word translated should be denied to be the Word, or forbidden to be current, notwithstanding that some imperfections and blemishes may be noted in the setting forth of it.
Prove what language(s) the "originals" were written.
§15 The purpose of the translators, with their number, furniture, care, etc.
10 If you ask what they had before them, truly it was the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, the Greek of the New.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. Psalms 12:6-7 KJV
"Them" in Psalms 12:7 is referring to the "faithful" mentioned in Psalms 12:1, not to the "words" mentioned in Psalms 12:6.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
I note that you will not even try to explain the errors.

As for “son,” I am likely your elder. I have probably been serving the Lord many more years than you. Have you been a Christian more than 55 years?

Confirmed:You are a bible corrector, not bible believer.

Give us a bible, that corrects all these alleged errors. What's the problem, droid? Correct them all, as we need to have this "scripture of truth." With all your brilliance, help out the LORD God, would you, as the influence, over the centuries, of the light, rain, heat, .....overpowered the LORD God, and He just could not see to it, to preserve a pure, sound, true, right scriptures, for His creatures, and He lost His masterpiece, even though He created the light.......universe, raises the dead........

"
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
§13 An answer to the imputations of our adversaries
4 No cause therefore why the Word translated should be denied to be the Word, or forbidden to be current, notwithstanding that some imperfections and blemishes may be noted in the setting forth of it.

§15 The purpose of the translators, with their number, furniture, care, etc.
10 If you ask what they had before them, truly it was the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, the Greek of the New.

Observe, the deception....Did he answer his own "argument?" Nope.

Again-Chapter, verse, that asserts that a translation cannot be scripture.

Again-Prove what language(s) the "originals" were written.


Genesis 42 KJV
23 And they knew not that Joseph understood them; for he spake unto them by an interpreter.


Luke 23:38 KJV And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, This Is The King Of The Jews.

At least 2 were translations.

Acts 21:40 KJV And when he had given him licence, Paul stood on the stairs, and beckoned with the hand unto the people. And when there was made a great silence, he spake unto them in the Hebrew tongue, saying,


Acts 22:2 KJV (And when they heard that he spake in the Hebrew tongue to them, they kept the more silence: and he saith,)

You: Well, uh, urr....
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
Made up.

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. Psalms 12:6-7 KJV

Matthew 5 KJV
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 24 KJV

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Psalms 119 KJV

89 For ever, O Lord, thy word is settled in heaven...............
152 Concerning thy testimonies, I have known of old that thou hast founded them for ever.


And on, and on..

Watch him correct this, "re-interpret" it....Watch..

:first:
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
§13 An answer to the imputations of our adversaries
4 No cause therefore why the Word translated should be denied to be the Word, or forbidden to be current, notwithstanding that some imperfections and blemishes may be noted in the setting forth of it.

§15 The purpose of the translators, with their number, furniture, care, etc.
10 If you ask what they had before them, truly it was the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, the Greek of the New.

You have "the originals," to maker that assessment? What's next? Quoting the love letters of the KJV translators? Their opinion is quite irrelevant. All scripture is(not was) given by inspiration. Nowhere does the book say that men/women are "inspired."
 
Last edited:

glorydaz

Well-known member
"Them" in Psalms 12:7 is referring to the "faithful" mentioned in Psalms 12:1, not to the "words" mentioned in Psalms 12:6.

Nope, he's speaking of God's words. Simple rules of grammar should tell you that, if you must ignore the content.

The words of the LORD are pure words,
Like silver tried in a furnace of earth,
Purified seven times.
You shall keep them, O LORD,
You shall preserve them from this generation forever.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
So you cannot quote chapter and verse that says the Bible in its entirety is the Word of God.

I was sure if that.

So your claim that you provided chapter and verse stating that was false.

Duly noted.

He is clueless.

All written words is not scripture (For eg., . "book of Jasher" Joshua 10:13 KJV; 2 Samuel 1:18 KJV). But all "Scripture" is written:

2 Chronicles 34 KJV
21 Go, enquire of the Lord for me, and for them that are left in Israel and in Judah, concerning the words of the book that is found: for great is the wrath of the Lord that is poured out upon us, because our fathers have not kept the word of the Lord, to do after all that is written in this book.


The written(by definition) scriptures are also called as God's "words"(plural)-" the words of the Lord":


Jerimaiah 36 KJV

Therefore go thou, and read in the roll, which thou hast written from my mouth, the words of the Lord in the ears of the people in the Lord's house upon the fasting day: and also thou shalt read them in the ears of all Judah that come out of their cities.


Many of these written scriptures were spoken, before they were written:

Jeremiah 30 KJV


Thus speaketh the Lord God of Israel, saying, Write thee all the words that I have spoken unto thee in a book.

In the above, the LORD God spoke. At other times, His holy prophets spoke.

2 Peter 1 KJV
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2 Samuel 23 KJV
The Spirit of the Lord spake by me, and his word was in my tongue.
 

2003cobra

New member
Define bible believer, bible corrector.


Not a peep.

How do you know that this alleged "the Lord" you cite, is not one of those "insignificant errors?" And your "I have probably been serving the Lord many more years than you. Have you been a Christian more than 55 years" is quite irrelevant.


And you're not a Christian, droid, as no member of the boc would correct the LORD God, and his book. Correcting any alleged scriptures, word of God, presupposes an authority over it-you are your own final authority. The bible is to correct you, not vice verse, and if one does not understand a verse, thinking it is in error, it is that person that is in error, not the scriptures, and that person needs to go back, and study the book, survey it, until he "gets it." That is what a bible believer(my emphasis) does.

You define bible believer, bible corrector.

You have placed yourself on the judgment seat of Jesus Christ to declare who is a Christian and who is not.

I would not want to be that arrogantly presumptuous.

Would you like to try to explain the errors?
 

2003cobra

New member
He is clueless.

All written words is not scripture (For eg., . "book of Jasher" Joshua 10:13 KJV; 2 Samuel 1:18 KJV). But all "Scripture" is written:

2 Chronicles 34 KJV
21 Go, enquire of the Lord for me, and for them that are left in Israel and in Judah, concerning the words of the book that is found: for great is the wrath of the Lord that is poured out upon us, because our fathers have not kept the word of the Lord, to do after all that is written in this book.


The written(by definition) scriptures are also called as God's "words"(plural)-" the words of the Lord":


Jerimaiah 36 KJV

Therefore go thou, and read in the roll, which thou hast written from my mouth, the words of the Lord in the ears of the people in the Lord's house upon the fasting day: and also thou shalt read them in the ears of all Judah that come out of their cities.


Many of these written scriptures were spoken, before they were written:

Jeremiah 30 KJV


Thus speaketh the Lord God of Israel, saying, Write thee all the words that I have spoken unto thee in a book.

In the above, the LORD God spoke. At other times, His holy prophets spoke.

2 Peter 1 KJV
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2 Samuel 23 KJV
The Spirit of the Lord spake by me, and his word was in my tongue.

Are you aware that Jesus quoted scripture that is not included in the canon?

John 7 37 On the last day of the festival, the great day, while Jesus was standing there, he cried out, “Let anyone who is thirsty come to me, 38 and let the one who believes in me drink. As the scripture has said, ‘Out of the believer’s heart (literally, belly) shall flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now he said this about the Spirit, which believers in him were to receive; for as yet there was no Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified

Did you think all scripture is in the canon?

Scripture is the Greek word graphe, which just means written documents. At the time of the New Testament writing, it just meant documents or writings.

Luke says that Joseph was a descendant of David through Nathan. Matthew says Joseph was a descendant of David through Nathan’s brother Solomon. Which one was it? If you believe you are powerful enough to sit on the judgment seat of Jesus Christ and decide who is a Christian and who is not, shouldn’t this be an easy question for you?
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
You have placed yourself on the judgment seat of Jesus Christ to declare who is a Christian and who is not.

The LORD God commands us to judge. You made that up.


Romans 10 KJV

1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness,
have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.


Survey Galatians 1.


Acts 13:10 KJV And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?

You, to Paul:You have placed yourself on the judgment seat of Jesus Christ to declare who is a Christian and who is not.I would not want to be that arrogantly presumptuous. Stop it Paul!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You just make things up, on the fly, bible corrector/rejector, avoiding providing scripture. Oh, yes....You don't have scripture...


Would you like to try to explain the errors?

1. There are none. The LORD God is right-you are in error. The bible is to correct you, not vice verse.

2. Care to define bible believer, and tell us where we can get a copy of the scriptures? Care to give us a book, that corrects all these alleged errors?


Not a peep.
 

john w

New member
Hall of Fame
Are you aware that Jesus quoted scripture that is not included in the canon?

John 7 37 On the last day of the festival, the great day, while Jesus was standing there, he cried out, “Let anyone who is thirsty come to me, 38 and let the one who believes in me drink. As the scripture has said, ‘Out of the believer’s heart (literally, belly) shall flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now he said this about the Spirit, which believers in him were to receive; for as yet there was no Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified
Did you think all scripture is in the canon?

Scripture is the Greek word graphe, which just means written documents. At the time of the New Testament writing, it just meant documents or writings.


Clueless-does not study the scriptures-does not have them.




vs.


Romans 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

Exodus 9 KJV
1 Then the Lord said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh, and tell him, Thus saith the Lord God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me.

16 And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.


Read it-scripture saith=the Lord said


Tell us where we can get a copy of the scriptures, that you cite. Care to give us a book, that corrects all these alleged errors?
 

2003cobra

New member
The LORD God commands us to judge. You made that up.


Romans 10 KJV

1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness,
have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.


Survey Galatians 1.


Acts 13:10 KJV And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?

You, to Paul:You have placed yourself on the judgment seat of Jesus Christ to declare who is a Christian and who is not.I would not want to be that arrogantly presumptuous. Stop it Paul!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You just make things up, on the fly, bible corrector/rejector, avoiding providing scripture. Oh, yes....You don't have scripture...




1. There are none. The LORD God is right-you are in error. The bible is to correct you, not vice verse.

2. Care to define bible believer, and tell us where we can get a copy of the scriptures? Care to give us a book, that corrects all these alleged errors?


Not a peep.
You think the Lord commanded you to take His place on the judgment seat of
Jesus Christ, yet you cannot even judge whether Nathan or Solomon was the ancestor of Joseph?

It appears you simply want to deny the truth, which is an unworthy approach for a person who claims to be a Christian.
 

2003cobra

New member
Are you aware that Jesus quoted scripture that is not included in the canon?

John 7 37 On the last day of the festival, the great day, while Jesus was standing there, he cried out, “Let anyone who is thirsty come to me, 38 and let the one who believes in me drink. As the scripture has said, ‘Out of the believer’s heart (literally, belly) shall flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now he said this about the Spirit, which believers in him were to receive; for as yet there was no Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified



Clueless-does not study the scriptures-does not have them.




vs.


Romans 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.

Exodus 9 KJV
1 Then the Lord said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh, and tell him, Thus saith the Lord God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me.

16 And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth.


Read it-scripture saith=the Lord said


Tell us where we can get a copy of the scriptures, that you cite. Care to give us a book, that corrects all these alleged errors?

Pretending “thus saith the Lord” in some texts, where God is quoted, means the entire Bible is quoting God is silly — like claiming a newspaper article that quotes Donald Trump means the entire newspaper is quoting the President.

Have you even thought about this?
 

daqq

Well-known member
Then perhaps you can answer the two questions on Matthew’s genealogy:

1) Was Joseph a descendant of David’s Son Nathan or David’s son Solomon?
2) Matthew said there were 14 generations from David to the deportation. 1 Chronicles listed 18. Which one is wrong?

This may help:
Matthew wrote that there were 14 generations from David to the deportation. He listed the generations. He skips three generations, putting Uzziah in the place of Ahaziah, Joash, Amaziah, and Azariah.

So either Matthew has an error in counting the generations or 1 Chronicles 3 has an error in listing the generations.

Matthew 1 And David was the father of Solomon by the wife of Uriah, 7 and Solomon the father of Rehoboam, and Rehoboam the father of Abijah, and Abijah the father of Asaph, and Asaph the father of Jehoshaphat, and Jehoshaphat the father of Joram, and Joram the father of Uzziah, 9and Uzziah the father of Jotham, and Jotham the father of Ahaz, and Ahaz the father of Hezekiah...So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David to the deportation to Babylon, fourteen generations; and from the deportation to Babylon to the Messiah, fourteen generations.

1 Chronicles 3 The descendants of Solomon: Rehoboam, Abijah his son, Asa his son, Jehoshaphat his son, 11 Joram his son, Ahaziah his son, Joash his son, 12 Amaziah his son, Azariah his son, Jotham his son, 13 Ahaz his son, Hezekiah his son,


1 Chronicles 3.....Matthew
Solomon............ Solomom
Rehoboam...........Rehoboam
Abijah.............Abijah
Asa................Asaph
Jehoshaphat........Jehoshaphat
Joram..............Joram
Ahaziah............missing from Matthew
Joash..............missing from Matthew
Missing from 1 Chronicles......Uzziah
Amaziah............missing from Matthew
Azariah............missing from Matthew

Jotham.............Jotham
Ahaz...............Ahaz
Hezekiah...........Hezekiah

Minor differences in the names aren’t errors. Claiming there were 14 generations when there were 17 generations is an error. Actually, Matthew also skips Jehoiakim, so his miscount is off by 4. But I don’t want to pile on right now.

This is another error which disproves the man-made doctrine of inerrancy. It is an insignificant and minor error from the perspective of the validity and credibility of scriptures. It is another proof that the doctrine of inerrancy is false.

Here is another example for you to ponder:

Isaiah 1:1 KJV
1 The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah.

Isaiah 14:28-29 KJV
28 In the year that king Ahaz died was this burden.
29 Rejoice not thou, whole Palestina, because the rod of him that smote thee is broken: for out of the serpent's root shall come forth a cockatrice, and his fruit shall be a fiery flying serpent.

Proverbs 30:11-14 KJV
11 There is a generation
[1] that curseth their father, and doth not bless their mother.
12 There is a generation
[2] that are pure in their own eyes, and yet is not washed from their filthiness.
13 There is a generation,
[3] O how lofty are their eyes! and their eyelids are lifted up.
14 There is a generation,
[4] whose teeth are as swords, and their jaw teeth as knives, to devour the poor from off the earth, and the needy from among men.

Matthew 12:39-45 KJV
39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation
[1] seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation,
[2] and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.
42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation,
[3] and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.
43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation
[4].

In other words, if you are going to accuse the scripture of being full of errors, then it would be better for you to stay away from chronologies until you understand from the Torah that there are four generations to the "first age" of a man: for these things are supernal and cannot be understood by the carnal minded belly walker, (O generation of vipers, lol).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lon
Top