ECT SALVATION: OLD TESTAMENT VS NEW

Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
can you explain how you are not a sinner?
Click to expand...

This is why I love the KJV:

Ephesians 1:1 (KJV 1900)

"PAUL, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus".


As a saint in learning how to be faithful, will there not be times when one falls short of the glory God? Is that not what God's chastisement is all about?

I was born in sin. How can it not be said I am sinner except I have been born again to build my new life upon the new foundation of "Redemption". If we understand that it is not by "cheap grace" we have that privilege then we will know what we do will be based upon our love TO God and by that same quality of love given Him, by His new life in me which makes it all possible and that life cannot sin, where does that place me in the scheme of things and for which I am made no less responsible as Jesus was responsible, for handling God's Glory. Where is there room for sin in that which IS the Christian life? Anything short of that will certainly reveal a dirty white robe __ as it should.
 
chrysostom

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Cross Reference said:
This is why I love the KJV:

Ephesians 1:1 (KJV 1900).
Click to expand...

so you are using this to show that you are not a sinner
and
we should listen to you as you explain the rest of the bible?


Ephesians 1:1 (KJV)

1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
so you are using this to show that you are not a sinner
and
we should listen to you as you explain the rest of the bible?

Ephesians 1:1 (KJV)

1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
Click to expand...

Just curious, what does the verse say to you that you should believe otherwise __ assuming you are born again?

Just in case you did get all I stated let re-post to make sure:

"I was born in sin. How can it not be said I am sinner except I have been born again to build my new life upon the new foundation of "Redemption". If we understand that it is not by "cheap grace" we have that privilege then we will know what we do will be based upon our love TO God and by that same quality of love given Him, by His new life in me which makes it all possible and that life cannot sin, where does that place me in the scheme of things and for which I am made no less responsible as Jesus was responsible, for handling God's Glory. Where is there room for sin in that which IS the Christian life? Anything short of that will certainly reveal a dirty white robe __ as it should."
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
I am not born again
but
I am a believer
and
that is exactly what paul meant by saints
Click to expand...

"Exactly"?? So you must then also know what it means to "put on the whole armor of God" and know the reason why?

BTW, Do you believe there can be other than saints who are faithful?
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
will it protect me from you?
I think so
because I am not move by your argument
Click to expand...

re whole armor:
I take it you don't have understanding for that either. You seem to be a very needy "saint". What are you taking into yourself these days, crossword puzzles?

Let me guess: You worship your church?
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
yes
a sinner must continually ask for help
Click to expand...

Shouldn't have to if you know what the issue surrounding your salvation is all about. You should be rejoicing in your tribulations __ purposed for your purifying your soul.

don't you need help?
Click to expand...

Nope. My help comes from the Lord when my mind is steadfast upon Him. That, too is part learning how to be faithful. He dwells within me and I am "learning" how to let Him have His way in my life that my life and His become synonymous. That isn't easy but, nevertheless, that which He compels by His love revealed TO me.
Click to expand...
 
chrysostom

chrysostom

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Cross Reference said:
Shouldn't have to if you know what the issue surrounding your salvation is all about. You should be rejoicing in your tribulations __ purposed for your purifying your soul.



Nope. My help comes from the Lord when my mind is steadfast upon Him. That, too is part learning how to be faithful. He dwells within me and I am "learning" how to let Him have His way in my life that my life and His become synonymous. That isn't easy but, nevertheless, that which He compels by His love revealed TO me.
Click to expand...

what about those who can't convince themselves that they are not sinning?

listening to you could be very discouraging
and
it might convince them that they are hopelessly lost
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
what about those who can't convince themselves that they are not sinning?
Click to expand...

If in Christ the conviction comes by the Holy Spirit.

listening to you could be very discouraging
and
it might convince them that they are hopelessly lost
Click to expand...

Jesus spoke strongly when He taught and preached. Here is intimacy: "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you." John 6:53 (KJV)

Heres the deal when being born again is factored in:

". . . . Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his." Romans 8:9 (KJV 1900)

I don't personally believe that that is for salvation as much as being born again whereby one can only advance in unity with Christ jesus and the Father per John 17:3, 21-23 (KJV) "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."

Does that add anything to your understanding? I hope so.
Click to expand...
 
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
so all I really have to do is convince myself that I am not sinning?
Click to expand...

Like I said __ repeatedly __ you gotta be born again!!! All the convincing in the world is no substitute. If you are truly serious about Jesus Christ, it should be no problem for Christ Jesus in choosing you because you will desire it with all you heart, mind, soul and strength and be willing to to pay that price. If you believe you are there in that disposition pray to him to perform it in you. No comprise here. He wants nothing less than our whole life and any clinging to our church doctrines and creeds won't carry the day. Our whole being, not one aspect of it, has to be brought to comprehend the love of God. Only the new birth from above can be the vehicle for that because it is relationally conveyed.

I believe it was Shakespeare who said : "To thine own self be true".
 
TFTn5280

TFTn5280

New member
Arsenios said:
One of the biggest mis-translations in English Christianity was that given in the KJV of the Lord's Prayer of the term "epiousios artos" as "Daily Bread"... And western scholars have been trying to justify it ever since... EPI means "down from above" which equals "upon"... As you know, ousios means essence, and the term can only be properly translated as "super-essential Bread, and this means Christ, His Body, the Bread of Life, which we eat in Holy Communion...

The Indwelling of Christ in us is an hypostatic fact, which is given to us when we are BAPTIZED INTO CHRIST... This is what gives us Christ as the RENEWAL of our fallen hypostasis which we inherit from the Fall of Adam... Hypostasis means Person... When we are REBORN from above, we are JOINED together with Christ in an Enhypostatic Union... WHO we ARE CHANGES... It is not about Power, which the Holy Spirit gave to all the OT Saints, but who retained their fallen selves as their hypostases, but is about the New Creation which we BECOME in our persons [hypostases] by our being joined together with Christ IN His Body, the Church, wherein we ARE Baptized by Christ... Power may or may not come later, according to the purposing of God and the actions of the one so baptized...

The "old man" is still around until death, so that our living of ever-repentant lives enduring to the end is an essential feature of the living of a Life in Christ, because the world and its demonic rulership hates us and is ever trying to trip us into sin from the freedom in Christ which we enjoy, even and especially in the midst of tribulations...

Making any sense?

Arsenios

ps - Is Thomas your name?
Click to expand...

Well it does make sense; however, I don't know if I am bringing my presuppositions to it to the point that I am reading it for what I want to say or for what you are attempting to convey; for to me I hear you saying there is a big difference between epi before Christ's glorification and Christ in us after it; hence I hear you saying that there was a significant difference between the righteousness reckoned to Abraham by faith in the OT and those of Paul after the fulfillment of the covenant in the NT, he then sharing in the vicarious-ontological faith and righteousness of Christ. Yes? To which I would agree.

Yes, my name is Thomas
 
Last edited:
Cross Reference

Cross Reference

New member
chrysostom said:
how does that happen?
Click to expand...
My last should have explained that. What part are you not understanding?

Try this:

Jn 15:16,19. Take vs 19 to heart because it is the mark of a true Christian and the evidence of hate
is sometimes readily seen among the purely religious Christians, those of the mere intellect crowd.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top