Rape victims

[WizardofOz]

do we deserve the consequences of our actions, when we know the risks we are taking and choose to ignore those risks?

if i put on klan robes and a hood and go to Michael Brown's funeral and taunt his grieving parents with racial slurs, do i deserve the beating i will get?

did I ask for it?

Nope. You would deserve mockery and contempt but not physical violence.

 

[ClimateSanity]

Yup

Talk about a sick puppy. :sigh:

 

[intojoy]

Talk about a sick puppy. :sigh:

It's what I'm saying

 

[patrick jane]

do we deserve the consequences of our actions, when we know the risks we are taking and choose to ignore those risks?

if i put on klan robes and a hood and go to Michael Brown's funeral and taunt his grieving parents with racial slurs, do i deserve the beating i will get?

did I ask for it?

You just assume you will get beaten ? Maybe they would just strip you and move you along -

 

[elohiym]

That sounds like karma, not grace

I like grace better.

 

[serpentdove]

How should they be treated?
With compassion or blame?

Compassion (and the rapist should be put to death [Ex. 21:16]).

 

[bybee]

Nope. You would deserve mockery and contempt but not physical violence.

He attempts to justify and glorify violence as a response to provocation thereby absolving the responder from the obligation to exercise self control.
The Lord God determines what we deserve. We are obligated to control ourselves and not descend to the level of depravity ourselves.

 

[theophilus]

 

[ok doser]

do we deserve the consequences of our actions, when we know the risks we are taking and choose to ignore those risks?

if i put on klan robes and a hood and go to Michael Brown's funeral and taunt his grieving parents with racial slurs, do i deserve the beating i will get?

did I ask for it?

Nope. You would deserve mockery and contempt but not physical violence.

obviously, i disagree :idunno:

He attempts to justify

nope

and glorify

nope

violence as a response to provocation

rather, if i were the protagonist in that scenario, i would be acting in disregard to a risk of a consequence that I would have known was likely

thereby absolving the responder from the obligation to exercise self control.

nope - i've been clear about this too - at this point your "misunderstanding" of my position is looking more and more like willful dishonesty - iow, blatant lying

 

[Arthur Brain]

ok doser asks:

artie replies:

why?

why should she expect any consequences?

Unless she's never experienced a hangover before then it's a natural consequence of drinking to excess. Rape isn't comparable and as such not a natural consequence or in any way "deserved". Only a loon or a nut could confuse the two or advocate for the latter.

hypocrite

Nope, I would have been had I condoned it, so no dice doofus

all people?

Why of course not dude, only those you deem deserving of it. lain:

but that's not faaaaiiiirrrrrr!

Are you whinging about lawyers again?

cite?

Sure:

"likewise, I would say that certain circumstances exist in which a woman deserves to be raped, in that she had earned it by her actions"

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4528653&postcount=106

hypocrite

Nope, supra.

 

[Arthur Brain]

amen. There have been cases where groups of men that were polled of attitudes toward rape. Those whom had the attitude that some women "ask for it" were chosen to spend a couple of days helping rape victims. After witnessing the victims and listening to their ordeals >>>>> every single one in the group changed their attitude. They all realized that no woman should have to endure
what they experienced. It makes a lsting impression.

It shouldn't have needed to be said but well said.

 

[Crucible]

How should they be treated?
With compassion or blame?

It depends on if they are actually victims or not. We can sit here and venerate 'rape awareness' all day, but what about the men falsely accused?
I don't know if you've noticed, but because of men standing up, women are actually getting prosecuted for false accusations.

It's about time.

 

[ClimateSanity]

It depends on if they are actually victims or not. We can sit here and venerate 'rape awareness' all day, but what about the men falsely accused?
I don't know if you've noticed, but because of men standing up, women are actually getting prosecuted for false accusations.

It's about time.

False accusations don't exist. Just ask some of our PC tyrants on this board.

 

[bybee]

Your statement is judgmental and unkind.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Here is what is fundamentally wrong in the thinking of those who say some women deserve to be raped....sex to them is brutal.

Because a girl wants sex, she is asking to be brutalised.

We can argue all day long as to whether girls should want sex or not, the fact is they do.

 

[ok doser]

i posted this in another thread yesterday, but it's pertinent here:

Student Op-Ed: ‘Yes Means Yes’ Is Not Enough Because Sometimes ‘Yes Means No’


Apparently, you can be “raped by rape culture.” When it comes to consent, it’s not enough to teach that “no means no” or even that only “yes means yes” — because sometimes “yes” can actually mean “no.”

At least that’s the point of view expressed in an op-ed written by Jordan Bosiljevac for Claremont McKenna College’s student newspaper, the Forum. In the piece, Bosiljevac explains that she and her friends even came up with a phrase to describe someone having sex with you who you didn’t want to have sex with even though you told him that you did, which they apparently consider a form of rape: “We coined the term ‘raped by rape culture’ to describe what it was like to say yes, coerced by the culture that had raised us and the systems of power that worked on us, and to still want ‘no,’” she writes in the April 30 article, titled “Why Yes Can Mean No.” “We coined the term ‘raped by rape culture’”.

Bosiljevac writes that she’s been dealing with the oppression of this culture her whole life — beginning with having to endure relatives kissing her cheeks “even as I winced and turned away” — and that it continues to influence her sexual decision-making abilities, almost to the point where she doesn’t seem to think she really has any ability to make those decisions at all. She describes one incident in particular in which she had hooked up with a guy who had asked her outright if she was okay with what was happening and she had told him “yes” — explaining that even though she had said “yes,” she had really meant “no,” and it wasn’t really entirely her fault that she couldn’t just say what she wanted: “Sometimes, for me, there was obligation from already having gone back to someone’s room, not wanting to ruin a good friendship, loneliness, worry that no one else would ever be interested, a fear that if I did say no, they might not stop, the influence of alcohol, and an understanding that hookups are ‘supposed’ to be fun,” she writes.

Bosiljevac also throws racism and homophobia into the blame-game mix, asserting that “consent is a privilege, and it was built for wealthy, heterosexual, cis, white, western, able-bodied masculinity. . . . When you’re poor, disabled, queer, non-white, trans, or feminine, ‘no’ isn’t for you.” She does, however, clarify that you can actually be a person in one of these groups, or, as she explains it, “a person oppressed in these systems of power,” and still be capable of having “empowering consensual experiences.”

Yep — even if you’re a female, you’re still capable of maybe actually wanting to have sex and enjoying it sometimes! Glad she clarified. If she hadn’t, I would have never imagined such a thing could be possible. So what do we do? After all, there’s no way to tell if a woman is actually wanting to have sex or just saying that she wants to have sex even though she doesn’t because she’s a helpless victim of male oppression that makes it impossible for her to use the right words. Lest you think Bosiljevac is just complaining, she does offer a solution: “First, we have to realize that all oppression is connected, and all rape is racist, classist, ableist, patriarchal, hetero and cissexist,” she writes. “We cannot make consent available to all if we are not simultaneously disrupting these structures.”

this is the ridiculous nonsense that feminism has brought us to

 

[Crucible]

I feel that this subject even being brought up to men in the first place is 'subtle misandry'. The reason being is because men don't need to be aware of rape, it is something that women need to be aware of. To bring it to men is to suppose that they need to be taught not to transgress a woman, and that is where the misandry lies.

If women want to talk among themselves on matters of avoiding dubious situations or ways of protection, that is perfectly fine. But, what do you expect men to do about it? Men have made laws against rape and rapists are prosecuted- there is no 'rape culture'. That is an imagined paranoia.

 

[ClimateSanity]

I feel that this subject even being brought up to men in the first place is 'subtle misandry'. The reason being is because men don't need to be aware of rape, it is something that women need to be aware of. To bring it to men is to suppose that they need to be taught not to transgress a woman, and that is where the misandry lies.

If women want to talk among themselves on matters of avoiding dubious situations or ways of protection, that is perfectly fine. But, what do you expect men to do about it? Men have made laws against rape and rapists are prosecuted- there is no 'rape culture'. That is an imagined paranoia.

Again, any misandry is a figment of your imagination. Men are nasty brutes. Women can do no wrong. Therefore, there only exists misogyny. The PC police will remind you of that in the most emotional, and spiteful way possible if you persist down this irresponsible path.

 

[annabenedetti]

Again, any misandry is a figment of your imagination. Men are nasty brutes. Women can do no wrong. Therefore, there only exists misogyny. The PC police will remind you of that in the most emotional, and spiteful way possible if you persist down this irresponsible path.

On your favorite topic again, Dolo?

 

[ok doser]

On your favorite topic again, Dolo?

do you have anything to contribute to the thread bananahead, or are you just going to whine about other posters?

for instance, what do you think of the op-ed from claremont mckenna?