Living by God's Law

[meshak]

If this temple was promised by God being more than a condition promise then there is a hope of a future temple and God's Law has not been done away with.

If the temple has not been built and will not be built then the promise was conditional for a certain past day and age.

Whatever the case regarding the temple Christians are not to live lawless, are to live by God's law, are to live by the law of Christ and bear one another's burdens, and can either learn from God's Law for themselves or that others might be saved.

It is strange way of explaining your reasons but most of us here in this thread agree that we are to obey Jesus' law.

 

[Jacob]

So which is it in your understanding. You didn't say Gentiles are God's people. Are the Jews God's people and Gentiles not? Are they both God's people but separate? Are they one in Christ and neither Jew nor Gentile?

Romans 3:29 NASB - 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also,

You may be thinking of this verse.

Galatians 3:28 NASB - 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Or, this one.

1 Corinthians 10:32 NASB - 32 Give no offense either to Jews or to Greeks or to the church of God;

Yes, he was born to be king. While on the earth, he said his kingdom was at hand. Did he establish it or is it still in the future?

I know Jesus is King and I believe He is King even now at the right hand of God. That is, before ascending to the Father He was King upon this earth.

Certainly His Kingdom was spoken of here.

Colossians 1:13 NASB - 13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

What about these?

Matthew 13:19 NASB - 19 "When anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is the one on whom seed was sown beside the road.

John 18:36 NASB - 36 Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm."

 

[Jacob]

It is strange way of explaining your reasons but most of us here in this thread agree that we are to obey Jesus' law.

We are to obey Jesus' law or instruction yes. All of us.

Were Jesus' words and teaching for the Jews only? I say no.

Not everyone understands Jesus' word.

 

[meshak]

We are to obey Jesus' law or instruction yes. All of us.

Were Jesus' words and teaching for the Jews only? I say no.

Not everyone understands Jesus' word.

It is not hard to understand but we seem to be brain washed to believe His teachings are complicated. Paul explained it hard way.

Yes, His teachings are for everyone, not just for Jews only.

 

[Jacob]

It is not hard to understand but we seem to be brain washed to believe His teachings are complicated. Paul explained it hard way.

Yes, His teachings are for everyone, not just for Jews only.

Some believe that what He did and taught in observance of God's Law was only intended until He died. The belief is that then God's Law (which was for the Jews with the nations receiving benefit) was done away with. I have found difficulty with that position. That is, I don't think Jesus died to do away with the Law, even as I believe that no one is saved (insert here, eternal salvation in Christ who died for you for the forgiveness of sins and to give you the gift of eternal life) by obeying the Law.

 

[turbosixx]

Romans 3:29 NASB - 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also,

You may be thinking of this verse.

Galatians 3:28 NASB - 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Or, this one.

1 Corinthians 10:32 NASB - 32 Give no offense either to Jews or to Greeks or to the church of God;


I know Jesus is King and I believe He is King even now at the right hand of God. That is, before ascending to the Father He was King upon this earth.

Certainly His Kingdom was spoken of here.

Colossians 1:13 NASB - 13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,

What about these?

Matthew 13:19 NASB - 19 "When anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is the one on whom seed was sown beside the road.

John 18:36 NASB - 36 Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm."

I would suggest to you that the Jews as a physical people are no longer God's people. Who was more a Jew than Paul? Yet he abandoned it all for Christ.

Phil. 3:2 Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the false circumcision; 3 for we are the true circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh, 4 although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: 5 circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; 6 as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless.

7 But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. 8 More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, 9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

The things of the OT were for our learning. There were two people in the OT, Jews and Gentiles. Jews were God's people and Gentiles were not. Same for today, Christians are God's people and everyone else is not.



I suggest the church and the kingdom are the same. Jesus used them interchangeably as did Paul.
Matt. 16:18 I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven;

Acts 20:25 "And now, behold, I know that all of you, among whom I went about preaching the kingdom, will no longer see my face….28 Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

 

[Jacob]

I would suggest to you that the Jews as a physical people are no longer God's people. Who was more a Jew than Paul? Yet he abandoned it all for Christ.

Phil. 3:2 Beware of the dogs, beware of the evil workers, beware of the false circumcision; 3 for we are the true circumcision, who worship in the Spirit of God and glory in Christ Jesus and put no confidence in the flesh, 4 although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: 5 circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; 6 as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless.

7 But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. 8 More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, 9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,

The things of the OT were for our learning. There were two people in the OT, Jews and Gentiles. Jews were God's people and Gentiles were not. Same for today, Christians are God's people and everyone else is not.



I suggest the church and the kingdom are the same. Jesus used them interchangeably as did Paul.
Matt. 16:18 I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven;

Acts 20:25 "And now, behold, I know that all of you, among whom I went about preaching the kingdom, will no longer see my face….28 Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

Does Paul answer your question here?

Romans 15:8-12 NASB - 8 For I say that Christ has become a servant to the circumcision on behalf of the truth of God to confirm the promises given to the fathers, 9 and for the Gentiles to glorify God for His mercy; as it is written,"THEREFORE I WILL GIVE PRAISE TO YOU AMONG THE GENTILES,AND I WILL SING TO YOUR NAME." 10 Again he says, "REJOICE, O GENTILES, WITH HIS PEOPLE." 11 And again, "PRAISE THE LORD ALL YOU GENTILES,AND LET ALL THE PEOPLES PRAISE HIM." 12 Again Isaiah says, "THERE SHALL COME THE ROOT OF JESSE, AND HE WHO ARISES TO RULE OVER THE GENTILES, IN HIM SHALL THE GENTILES HOPE."

 

[turbosixx]

Does Paul answer your question here?

Romans 15:8-12 NASB - 8 For I say that Christ has become a servant to the circumcision on behalf of the truth of God to confirm the promises given to the fathers, 9 and for the Gentiles to glorify God for His mercy; as it is written,"THEREFORE I WILL GIVE PRAISE TO YOU AMONG THE GENTILES,AND I WILL SING TO YOUR NAME." 10 Again he says, "REJOICE, O GENTILES, WITH HIS PEOPLE." 11 And again, "PRAISE THE LORD ALL YOU GENTILES,AND LET ALL THE PEOPLES PRAISE HIM." 12 Again Isaiah says, "THERE SHALL COME THE ROOT OF JESSE, AND HE WHO ARISES TO RULE OVER THE GENTILES, IN HIM SHALL THE GENTILES HOPE."

I currently don't have a question as to who is God's people.

The gospel is the new covenant and it's for everyone. It was to the Jew first because they were the ones looking for and could prove the Messiah from the Law and prophets.

Mark 16:15 And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.
Matt. 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations,

And in Christ the wall has been torn down and we are all spiritual Israel.
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise.

 

[Jacob]

I currently don't have a question as to who is God's people.

The gospel is the new covenant and it's for everyone. It was to the Jew first because they were the ones looking for and could prove the Messiah from the Law and prophets.

Mark 16:15 And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.
Matt. 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations,

And in Christ the wall has been torn down and we are all spiritual Israel.
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise.

Israel was the name given to Jacob, Abraham's grandson. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob (Israel). The nation of Israel began with Israel and his 12 sons.

The Gentiles can rejoice with the people of God.

 

[achduke]

I'm still not sure if you believed he established his kingdom. Do you believe the Jews are still God's people?

Not Jews, Israel, which include the believing Jews.

 

[achduke]

The Jews are God's people. But God is the God of the Gentiles as well.

When did Christ's kingdom come to be? He was born to be King.

John 18:37 Therefore Pilate said to Him, “So You are a king?” Jesus answered, “You say correctly that I am a king. For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice.”

Gentiles are grafted in.

 

[achduke]

I currently don't have a question as to who is God's people.

The gospel is the new covenant and it's for everyone. It was to the Jew first because they were the ones looking for and could prove the Messiah from the Law and prophets.

Mark 16:15 And He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.
Matt. 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations,

And in Christ the wall has been torn down and we are all spiritual Israel.
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's descendants, heirs according to promise.

The new covenant was promised to both houses of Israel. The House of Israel and the House of Judah. Gentiles are grafted in.

Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days are coming," says the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah--

Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry,

Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,

Romans 11:26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, and He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;

 

[turbosixx]

The new covenant was promised to both houses of Israel. The House of Israel and the House of Judah. Gentiles are grafted in.

Jeremiah 31:31 "Behold, the days are coming," says the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah--

Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry,

Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,

Romans 11:26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, and He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;

That's the way I understand it. Fellow heirs.

 

[achduke]

That's the way I understand it. Fellow heirs.

Not only fellow heirs but grafted onto the root. The same tree! God brought out a vine from Egypt and planted it. Israel is called a green olive tree. Israel then revolts under Solomon and is broken into two kingdom(Judah and Joseph) or two olive trees. Ezekiel shows that these two olive trees will be united again into one. Romans 11 shows how the wild branches and native branches will be grafted back on to the root.

Psalm 80:8 Thou hast brought a vine out of Egypt: thou hast cast out the heathen, and planted it.

Jeremiah 11:16 The LORD called thy name, A green olive tree, fair, and of goodly fruit: with the noise of a great tumult he hath kindled fire upon it, and the branches of it are broken. 17 For the LORD of hosts, that planted thee, hath pronounced evil against thee, for the evil of the house of Israel and of the house of Judah, which they have done against themselves to provoke me to anger in offering incense unto Baal.

Isaiah 5:4 What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?

Isaiah 5:5 And now go to; I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; and break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:

Isaiah 5:7 For the vineyard of the LORD of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for judgment, but behold oppression; for righteousness, but behold a cry.

John 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

1 Kings 11:31-32 31 And he said to Jeroboam, Take thee ten pieces: for thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel, Behold, I will rend the kingdom out of the hand of Solomon, and will give ten tribes to thee: 32(But he shall have one tribe for my servant David's sake, and for Jerusalem's sake, the city which I have chosen out of all the tribes of Israel

Zechariah 4:11-12 11Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side thereof? 12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?

Ezekiel 37:16-17 16 Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions: 17 And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.

Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

Romans 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

 

[Ben Masada]

It is strange way of explaining your reasons but most of us here in this thread agree that we are to obey Jesus' law.

Jesus did not command any new law. His law was the same as the one proclaimed to Moses in the Sinai. Hence, Jesus' bottom line to his parable of the Richman and Lazarus when he implied that the only way to get salvation from hell-fire was by listening to "Moses" aka the Law. (Luke 16:29-31)

 

[Totton Linnet]

Whatever your walk in life it makes sense to live according to God's Law. What are your thoughts about this? What does living according to God's Law look like? What does it look like for you, if anything?

What does the Bible say about living according to God's Law, if anything?

Living according to the letter of God's law looks like a Pharisee

 

[achduke]

Living according to the letter of God's law looks like a Pharisee

A big problem with the Pharisee's is that they put their own laws above God's law.

 

[meshak]

A big problem with the Pharisee's is that they put their own laws above God's law.

You are right, Pharisees disregarded Jesus' law.

That's why they killed Him. They hated Jesus' messages.

 

[Jacob]

Living according to the letter of God's law looks like a Pharisee

You are talking about what it looks like to you to live according to the letter of God's law.

A study of the Pharisees is not beyond us.

I believe you are thinking of the following verse. It talks about living by the Spirit or living by the letter of the Law.

Romans 7:6 NASB - 6 But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.

When a person lives by the Spirit of God do they naturally obey God? Does obedience to God involve obedience to God's Law? Are God's commands found in the Law for any of us to obey? They hold the sinner guilty, but are they to be obeyed by the believer?

We are not to be lawless. So what do we do with God's Law, the Law of Moses? What do we do if Jesus is our new priesthood, meaning that there is a change of law that has taken place? What do we do if among those without law we are to be under the law of Christ, not being without God's law?

Is the Law eternal? Is the Law for the nation of Israel? Is the Law for Gentiles? Has anything replaced the Law?

Has Ezekiel's temple been built? Will it ever be built?

I know we are to obey God's commands. Is the problem obeying the letter of the Law because we were once bound to the Law but are no longer bound to the Law? Is obeying the letter of the Law legalism? Is there any way to obey the Law, maybe by the Spirit, that would not be the letter of the Law and legalism?

The Law can be preached to the unbeliever or sinner. Unbelievers are sinners. They are not yet new creations in Christ. Those who are believers are born again and have the Spirit of God inside of them.

I know you are not against law period so this is my response if that is okay with you. If God's Law is written on our minds and hearts does that mean we obey God's Law naturally? Does it mean we are able to obey God's Law, or capable of obeying God's Law, whereas we once were not (able to obey or capable of obeying)?

For Christians is there a Law of God to observe? Is it true that we are to obey God's commands even if we do not all obey the Law of Moses in its entirety? Are God's commands (found in or are they) the Law of Moses or (are they) something else?

 

[Robert Pate]

You are talking about what it looks like to you to live according to the letter of God's law.

A study of the Pharisees is not beyond us.

I believe you are thinking of the following verse. It talks about living by the Spirit or living by the letter of the Law.

Romans 7:6 NASB - 6 But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.

When a person lives by the Spirit of God do they naturally obey God? Does obedience to God involve obedience to God's Law? Are God's commands found in the Law for any of us to obey? They hold the sinner guilty, but are they to be obeyed by the believer?

We are not to be lawless. So what do we do with God's Law, the Law of Moses? What do we do if Jesus is our new priesthood, meaning that there is a change of law that has taken place? What do we do if among those without law we are to be under the law of Christ, not being without God's law?

Is the Law eternal? Is the Law for the nation of Israel? Is the Law for Gentiles? Has anything replaced the Law?

Has Ezekiel's temple been built? Will it ever be built?

I know we are to obey God's commands. Is the problem obeying the letter of the Law because we were once bound to the Law but are no longer bound to the Law? Is obeying the letter of the Law legalism? Is there any way to obey the Law, maybe by the Spirit, that would not be the letter of the Law and legalism?

The Law can be preached to the unbeliever or sinner. Unbelievers are sinners. They are not yet new creations in Christ. Those who are believers are born again and have the Spirit of God inside of them.

I know you are not against law period so this is my response if that is okay with you. If God's Law is written on our minds and hearts does that mean we obey God's Law naturally? Does it mean we are able to obey God's Law, or capable of obeying God's Law, whereas we once were not (able to obey or capable of obeying)?

For Christians is there a Law of God to observe? Is it true that we are to obey God's commands even if we do not all obey the Law of Moses in its entirety? Are God's commands (found in or are they) the Law of Moses or (are they) something else?

"Who also made us able ministers of the New Testament; not of the letter (the law) but of the Spirit: for the letter (the law) kills, but the Spirit gives life" 2 Corinthians 3:6.