noguru
Well-known member
Then do it! You started this whole discourse by claiming you already had these figures.
Is America great?
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
- Start date
Then do it! You started this whole discourse by claiming you already had these figures.
The percentage of pregnancies that end in an abortion is lower in the United States than it is in various other countries:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/health/daily/051606/teensex.html
- Sweden 68.8
- France 50.5
- Canada 46.4
- Great Britain 39.4
- United States 34.9
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/health/daily/051606/teensex.html
Homicide is homicide. You should know better as a Catholic. From the Catechism.
Intentional homicide
2268 The fifth commandment forbids direct and intentional killing as gravely sinful. The murderer and those who co-operate voluntarily in murder commit a sin that cries out to heaven for vengeance. (68)
Infanticide, (69) fratricide, parricide and the murder of a spouse are especially grave crimes by reason of the natural bonds which they break. Concern for eugenics or public health cannot justify any murder, even if commanded by public authority.
This has little to do with the intentional homicide rate.
Using recent figures the calcs are as follows:
(US population/homicides) x 100,000
(314,000,000/(12,800 + 1,200,000)) = 380 homicides per 100k
???????
We discussed Chile, which you originally proposed. The homicide rate is 4 compared to the US rate of 38. this is at least the third time I have posted it for you.
noguru
Well-known member
Right, and when I asked you if you were holding up Chile as an example of a nation with less violence that should be held as a model for other countries you seemed to reject that idea. Now I could be mistaken, so now is the time for you to clarify.
Chile's homicide rate is 95 times less than the US. Do we really need to say more???
noguru
Well-known member
A simple "yes" would do. You could have admitted your intention when I first asked and we might have avoided the ensuing confusion.
Sure, no problem. Pray for the US to quit killing it's children.
moparguy
New member
America has not been great in the moral sense for a very long time; IMO at least since the 20s (but probably earlier).
What moral greatness we did have was always diluted by the national sins, such as slavery, and refusing to honor our oaths of office, etc, virtual (if not really) rapists in the office of the president, you name it.
The recent horribly hateful and irrational down-turn into anarchism as the foundation for law has been a disgusting thing to watch and live through.
What moral greatness we did have was always diluted by the national sins, such as slavery, and refusing to honor our oaths of office, etc, virtual (if not really) rapists in the office of the president, you name it.
The recent horribly hateful and irrational down-turn into anarchism as the foundation for law has been a disgusting thing to watch and live through.
This has little to do with the intentional homicide rate.
Notice, compared to four European nations, the U.S. has the lowest abortion rate per 100 pregnancies. And it continues to decline. I think that's a good thing, don't you?
Notice, compared to four European nations, the U.S. has the lowest abortion rate per 100 pregnancies. And it continues to decline. I think that's a good thing, don't you?
The RCC considers abortion a homicide and it most certainly is intentional.
As long as abortion is allowed by law it will never be a "good thing".
Way to show that anti American ax you have grinding ther. He said having a lower and decreasing rate of abortion was a good thing. It's sad when a bias interferes with rational process.
Make up your mind.Yay, you lynched a couple fewer black people last year.lain:
Else, he was confronted with facts that make his focus on America a bit problematic and dodged them.
lifeisgood
New member
Yes, America is still great; however, as the church goes so goes a nation, and IMO, the church is not going very well.
The church needs to get off its high horse, get on its knees, humble ourselves, and pray, and seek God's face, and turn from our wicked ways; then (and only then) will God hear from heaven, and will forgive our sin, and will heal our land.
The greatest export of America used to be the True Gospel of Jesus Christ and Him Crucified.
The church needs to get off its high horse, get on its knees, humble ourselves, and pray, and seek God's face, and turn from our wicked ways; then (and only then) will God hear from heaven, and will forgive our sin, and will heal our land.
The greatest export of America used to be the True Gospel of Jesus Christ and Him Crucified.
You want me to draw some distinction between hanging a man and dismembering a child?
A rational person would agree that a declining homicide rate and a declining abortion rate are good things.
Which, I suppose, is why you don't agree.
With all due respect giving validity to the notion that "a declining abortion rate is a good thing" is a typical misrepresentation used by the abortion lobby to support it's cause. I am not insinuating you are supporting abortion only making this point clear. You are not alone though, many people are confused about how statistics are used to manipulate public opinion. In this case the magnitude is misrepresented.
For example, abortions reduced 12% from 1.21M in 2008 to 1.06M in 2011 which might appear positive at first glace. However, In 2011 there were a total of 12,700 homicides so any reduction of abortions is not worthy of mention given the fact that it is by far the number one cause of homicide in the US BY A FACTOR OF 123 compared to the next cause of homicide deaths in the US (firearms).
Furthermore, on average 2.5M Americans die every year (2008) and of that figure 850k +/- are due to heart disease. Abortion is therefore the leading cause of DEATH in the US.
So while it is true there was a nominal decrease in abortions the unprecedented AMOUNT compared to other causes clearly demonstrates a grave problem.
Finally, when the US is at war people don't champion that there was a net reduction in US troops killed from one year to the next because that would be ridiculous, they want the war to end and the troops to come home. Abortion is little different in magnitude of deaths than war but at least our troops have a way to defend themselves.
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Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security