How Jesus Justifies the Ungodly, Romans 4:5.

Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
Everyone is born under the law and are lost, until they receive Christ as their savior.
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That's preaching salvation by works a person does!

Eph. 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

All the works of the unsaved are as filthy rags in God's sight Is. 64:6.

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us [Rom. 9:23], by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; [Rom. 8:16]

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Nanja said:
That's preaching salvation by works a person does!

Eph. 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

All the works of the unsaved are as filthy rags in God's sight Is. 64:6.

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us [Rom. 9:23], by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; [Rom. 8:16]

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
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Only in your twisted mind is faith a work.

Jesus encourages to believe in him.

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should not perish, but have everlasting life" John 3:16.

You are unsaved and are a perverter of God's word.
 
C

clefty

New member
Nanja said:
That's preaching salvation by works a person does!

Eph. 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

All the works of the unsaved are as filthy rags in God's sight Is. 64:6.

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us [Rom. 9:23], by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; [Rom. 8:16]

2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
Click to expand...

Works given us in Yahushua before the world began are still works...His works...that is our calling a holy calling...to live and love JUST AS HE DID HIS WAY...
 
Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member
Robert Pate said:
Only in your twisted mind is faith a work.

Jesus encourages to believe in him.

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should not perish, but have everlasting life" John 3:16.

You are unsaved and are a perverter of God's word.
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Nope! I proved it to you right from the scriptures.

Unless a person has been Born Again, all the works he does, including believing and receiving with his unregenerate heart /mind , are just as filthy rags Is. 64:6!
 
C

clefty

New member
Nanja said:
Failed! Your comments are worthless without supporting scripture!
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Seems odd to fell you with your own sword but you insist...

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us [Rom. 9:23], by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; [Rom. 8:16]

Now look at that closely what exactly is meant by the washing of regeneration...our baptism...is that a work?

Or is it the regeneration that causes us to desire baptism to signal that very act of regeneration...now what do you suppose the purpose or point of regeneration is?

A carnal fleshy heart works...but a regenerated one STOPS? Hardly

What exactly is meant by a RENEWING of the Holy Ghost? To continue living as before or a NEW life and love now radically different and FOLLOWING HIM HIS WAY?...you know, renewed for a purpose and point-a work given to us by HIM not of our own...not to just BE...static but ALIVE in HIM...to LIVE duh...

and hopefully bearing different fruits than before we were regenerated and renewed...fruits MORE LIKE HIM HIS not our previous carnal selves...




2 Tim. 1:9
Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.

Ok now look closely here...what are we called for? TO DO? WORKS...but according to HIS OWN purpose and grace...now again what EXACTLY is His purpose and grace given for?...

IF YOU LOVE ME what?...have faith alone?

Go and sin no more...seriously GO...LIVE as He would have you to
 
C

clefty

New member
Nanja said:
Nope! I proved it to you right from the scriptures.

Unless a person has been Born Again, all the works he does, including believing and receiving with his unregenerate heart /mind , are just as filthy rags Is. 64:6!
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The Jerusalem council met in Acts 15 a great time to preach and teach what you are attempting to advocate here...FAITH ALONE...

Instead they clarified 4 things goyim had to do merely to hang out with Jews...and hear Moses preached to them Sabbath after Sabbath as James understood would occur...

The irony that 3 of those 4 things were about dietary issues...dont eat EVEN CLEAN MEAT with blood in it...dont strangle EVEN CLEAN meat...and of course dont eat CLEAN meat especially if it is offered to idols...

Now given the "house rules" for fellowship...these desirous goyim wished to hear more and do more and you know BE MORE like the One Resurrected and Who defeated death...

So much for FAITH ALONE...
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

New member
Robert Pate said:
You think that scripture contradicts scripture.

Obey or works, means to be under the law. You are under the law and will be judged by the law.

Christians are justified by faith without the works of the law.
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No, you are the one who thinks scripture contradicts scripture.

Humans had to believe and obey since the beginning of time, but you claim Paul changed all that.

How pathetic that you falsely accuse Paul.
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

New member
Robert Pate said:
Jesus was born under the law. Lived under the law and died under the law.

Because he was sinless he was the epitome of the law.
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Jesus is the Law and the Prophets fulfilled.

That means that everything in the Old Testament was about him.

Jesus is also the promise of no more works, as in the ceremonial works.

You have limited your god to your silly ideas.

Nowhere anywhere in the Bible are we told that one day we will not have to obey God. LOLLOLLOL
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

New member
Robert Pate said:
The sins of the world have been atoned for, 1 John 2:2, 1 John 4:14, John 12:47, Hebrews 2:9, plus many others.

Those that do not have faith that Jesus atoned for the sins of the whole world will perish. Jesus is Lord, whether you believe it or not.
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Jesus atones for the sins we repent of doing.
 
Nanja

Nanja

Well-known member
clefty said:
The Jerusalem council met in Acts 15 a great time to preach and teach what you are attempting to advocate here...FAITH ALONE...

Instead they clarified 4 things goyim had to do merely to hang out with Jews...and hear Moses preached to them Sabbath after Sabbath as James understood would occur...

The irony that 3 of those 4 things were about dietary issues...dont eat EVEN CLEAN MEAT with blood in it...dont strangle EVEN CLEAN meat...and of course dont eat CLEAN meat especially if it is offered to idols...

Now given the "house rules" for fellowship...these desirous goyim wished to hear more and do more and you know BE MORE like the One Resurrected and Who defeated death...

So much for FAITH ALONE...
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Way off course!

Nanja
Unless a person has been Born Again, all the works he does, including believing and receiving with his unregenerate heart /mind , are just as filthy rags Is. 64:6!
Click to expand...
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
Nanja said:
Nope! I proved it to you right from the scriptures.

Unless a person has been Born Again, all the works he does, including believing and receiving with his unregenerate heart /mind , are just as filthy rags Is. 64:6!
Click to expand...

According to the New Testament, the only way that you can be born again is by hearing and believing the Gospel.

Here is the catch. If you hear and believe the Gospel you will no longer need Calvinism.
 
God's Truth

God's Truth

New member
Robert Pate said:
According to the New Testament, the only way that you can be born again is by hearing and believing the Gospel.

Here is the catch. If you hear and believe the Gospel you will no longer need Calvinism.
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You mean, if one hears and obeys.

If one hears and obeys, they will leave Calvinism, Catholicism, Baptistism, faith aloneism, and non denominationalism,and self taughtism,

If one believes and obeys Jesus, they will also be released from Satan's snare which causes them to teach against obedience to Christ.
 
R

Robert Pate

Well-known member
Banned
God's Truth said:
No, you are the one who thinks scripture contradicts scripture.

Humans had to believe and obey since the beginning of time, but you claim Paul changed all that.

How pathetic that you falsely accuse Paul.
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Paul says that you are a sinner, but you don't believe him, Romans 3:23.

A sinner is one that has transgressed God's Holy Law. If you only sin once that makes you a sinner.

Sinners cannot please God by their works or obedience to the law, Galatians 3:10. Once a sinner always a sinner.

You cannot change the fact that you are a sinner. You can repent until the cows come home, that does not change the fact that you are a sinner.
 
jamie

jamie

New member
LIFETIME MEMBER
Robert Pate said:
If you only sin once that makes you a sinner.
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And if you repent that wipes the slate clean as if it never happened.

If You, Lord, should mark iniquities, O Lord, who could stand?
But there is forgiveness with You, that You may be feared. (Psalm 130:3-4)​
 
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