CALVINISM: The Belief that God Predestinates People to Hell Before Birth.
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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Eagles Wings
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That's much better than I did.
Ask Mr. Religion
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It was a tricky question and I think ignores the covenant of redemption (pactum salutis) which would hold that all members of the Godhead participated in that covenant. So do not take missing this one too badly.
AMR
Lon
Well-known member
This points to the way, again, that we see salvation. Some see it as an 'event' or a couple of events. Your explanation suggests such, and it is true. It is also true that Salvation isn't necessarily when I called upon the Lord, because you are correct that a prior event occurred. You'd agree with me that God saves/saved us. The wording we use between 'saved' and 'saves' separates how we think of our salvation and the way it happened. When I tell people 'how I was saved' (events that led to it) it tends to be less Calvinistic. When I tell people "how God saved me" it tends to be more Calvinistic (as is also true with you - also 'saved' can be 'saves' in this case too, depending on how our description works.
Whenever I hear about salvation, I see 1) process and/or 2) event
Later in life, I've come to think 'independence' (free will) is what Satan promised Adam and Eve in the Garden, that they'd be "Like God" and that "They'd be able to decide themselves good and evil."
It then made sense, and I agree, that men must call upon the name of the Lord, but it also meant we were in a state where we decide for ourselves 'like God' so in no need of God in that condition. A lie, yes, but it is the framework of our condition. The Serpent in this case, was saying what he was experiencing for himself: an ability to make his own choices regarding good and evil. Many people attribute our 'free will' to God, but I believe it is more a gift from the Serpent. That was a huge turn-around for me in my theology. I'm convinced from re-reading scripture, that free will is more the result of the Fall than God's intention (not arguing or propping up something against another's theology, just giving some of my observations, I think, directly from Bible study. I'd not imperialize them, just want to help another see where some of us Calvinists are coming from). Thank you for your gracious reply. -Lon
Lon
Well-known member
Salvation Quiz
Salvation Quiz
I don't like tests, but we are to study to show we are approved.
I hope, and pray (actually praying) others will rise to the challenge and occasion. -Lon
Salvation Quiz
I hope a few will take time for this and reflect upon scriptures.
I don't like tests, but we are to study to show we are approved.
I hope, and pray (actually praying) others will rise to the challenge and occasion. -Lon
Hey diddly doo Ned...
Free Will? So Satan is a Liberator and Jesus is the Tyrant?
# Don't even worry about responding...
You're full of more extra biblical ideas than [MENTION=1746]freelight[/MENTION] .
# Tool ... Here's something for you to whine about... yup... you're softer than a pair of hello kitty slippers wrapped with silk and rolled in Hanna Montana Stickers. I'm certain that I wouldn't respect you if you... even if you were the Child of Superman man and Mother Teresa...
Whenever you open your mouth... same outcome...
It's a Whiney combination of Arrogance, Ignorance and verbose Distortion wrapped in the allegory of unicorn fantasy... nicknamed Calvinism.
# Buckle up your bicycle helmet... with replacement theology written in crayon on the side... and no matter how much you inhibit the gospel with your gnostic, Reformed Lies... remember Jesus still thinks you're special and Israel still matters to God!
# AMR Clone ... but less humorous and vastly more naive to reality... AMR has more Wit... you are a whit wit. # ; )
# You're not Tweedle dee ... do the math T.D.
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Nanja
Well-known member
After I was Born of God.
Calvinism is for people believe in a sovereign god- one who isn't subject to popes or free will.
There's not really anything of anti-Calvinist qualms that hold up to scrutiny, and there aren't that many of them at that. They are mostly rehashed over and over again, from those like Robert Pate, who has made yet another thread blabbering the same old nonsense
There's not really anything of anti-Calvinist qualms that hold up to scrutiny, and there aren't that many of them at that. They are mostly rehashed over and over again, from those like Robert Pate, who has made yet another thread blabbering the same old nonsense
Calvinism is for people believe in a sovereign god- one who isn't subject to popes or free will.
There's not really anything of anti-Calvinist qualms that hold up to scrutiny, and there aren't that many of them at that. They are mostly rehashed over and over again, from those like Robert Pate, who has made yet another thread blabbering the same old nonsense
Paul said, Examine yourself to see if you are in the faith.
Calvinism is just the opposite of what the Bible teaches. The Bible plainly teaches that we are justified by faith in Christ and his Gospel. Calvinism teaches that the Gospel and justification by faith are not necessary because they have been predestinated to salvation. No need for Christ and his Gospel. Not only is Calvinism anti-Gospel it is also anti-Christ. If you continue in that religion you will never see heaven.
fishrovmen
Active member
Robert,
If you want to discredit "Calvinism", a good way to do that would be to quote the source of your claim that Calvinism teaches that the Gospel and justification by faith are not necessary.
I would like to see that source reference!
If you want to discredit "Calvinism", a good way to do that would be to quote the source of your claim that Calvinism teaches that the Gospel and justification by faith are not necessary.
I would like to see that source reference!
Are you saved by election or grace?
No lies... I know this deception well... Tap dancing and all sorts of theological smoke and mirrors...
But... (John 3:16f) stands as a major issue to you. And... (Ephesians 2:8) accentuates our part... Hey... Whatta you know... (John 6:29) shows our part too...
Work denotes "effort"... BELIEF...
#Choice trumps Election of Human contriving... every time.
It's not like God emphasizes choice at the very get go, by introducing two trees... right?
If you have been declared by God that you are saved before the foundation of the world.
Then you don't need Christ, nor do you need his Gospel. This is why Calvinism is anti-Gospel and anti-Christ.
fishrovmen
Active member
Where is the source information?
fishrovmen
Active member
Grace through faith, just as Paul taught.
(Philippians 3:9) Faith
(John 6:29) Belief is our "Work"
Where's yours? Can you back up your Tulip... if the Reformed lens... made by extra biblical (extra canonical) men... is shattered?
Scripture Alone?
Faith Alone?
Christ Alone?
Nope... not while you think that Reformed lens matters.
It sounds so sweet... but you have wrapped it in bitter. Are you Elect?
fishrovmen
Active member
I was asking for source information from someone else. That's why I quoted their post.
fishrovmen
Active member
As far as I know, all believers are "elect".
I was throwing in my 2 cents. That's why I replied.