Bob Enyart Child Abuse- spanking conviction

[Nathon Detroit]

All kids are different (something allsmiles has no clue about). I have raised 6 awesome kids and each one has been different from the other.

Some of them required frequent spankings to keep them pointed in the right direction, while others required almost no spankings their entire life.

Not all of them are grown-up yet, but so far they are 6 of the neatest kids you will ever meet and not one of them would trade the discipline they have received in their lives for anything else.

 

[allsmiles]

That they will understand not to tear up the Kleenex?

Knight was right. It is clear you've never had to help in the raising of a child, in any capacity.

I already agreed with Knight that I have no children. I have been a child who was subjected to physically violent discipline and I have had five younger brothers and sisters.

It's not about the pain.

Though if there is absolutely no pain it is pointless. It has to at least sting to have an effect.

It's not about the pain but without it the discipline is pointless. Vacuous, out-dated ideas. You're stuck in the bronze-age.

There is absolutely no glee in this, you moron.

And you can't be sadistic if you're a sociopath.

Prove that harm is being done...

Didn't I already answer this question? Yes, I would.

You did answer the question and that was my bad.

And I don't have to prove anything. I'm not an attorney but there are plenty who wouldn't blink an eye before throwing the book at you.

Isn't advocating criminal behavior illegal?

 

[allsmiles]

I'm not going to argue with you any more Knight.

I'm enjoying my time back at TOL and I'm not in the mood to endanger it.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I'm not going to argue with you any more Knight.

We were arguing?

Seemed to me like you were sayin' stupid stuff that you are ignorant about and I was correcting you.

I'm enjoying my time back at TOL and I'm not in the mood to endanger it.

I'm glad that my website is enjoyable for you.

 

[allsmiles]

We were arguing?

Seemed to me like you were sayin' stupid stuff that you are ignorant about and I was correcting you.

Correctng me seems to imply that I was learning something... as far as I can remember you've never taught me anything. Maybe if you were able to hit me...?

I'm glad that my website is enjoyable for you.

It's the best on the web :up:

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Correctng me seems to imply that I was learning something... as far as I can remember you've never taught me anything.

Well then... I guess you have learned that I haven't taught you anything, which is a bit of a self defeating argument isn't it?

OK, ok... I am getting off topic... please go back to the discussion.

 

[Ktoyou]

As a child I burned my hand on a stove and all it took to recover was some ice and A&D ointment.

The child would learn through experience, not deliberate physical violence inflicted by a dominant influence, to not touch the stove. He would teach himself which is perhaps the most important part. He wouldn't be forced to comply.

What is it with you and inflicting violence and forcing people into complicity?

I saw that! :chew:

I see it every time. Whenever your type wants to make a point, you use extreme examples and the given standard, then you assume a free language that extends the lie to a mundane surrealism. It is just a simple ploy and has no realty.

I spanked my kids but you cannot say I ever abused them and they would testify that I had it easier because I had my kids when spanking was no a confused issue with abuse.

 

[Ktoyou]

A two year old can be capable of being toilet trained, so yes it's quite possible.



What is it with your obsession with inflicting pain? Especially with inflicting pain on those who can't fight back?

That you're gleefully willing to inflict pain on a defenseless child is only evidence that you're unimaginative and sadistic.

People are put in jail for harming minors. I wish the administration was more willing to scrutinize your encouragement of criminal behavior.

I saw that too.:chew:

 

[koban]

I spanked my kids .....

K2 - you spanked your kids.

What would you do if your estranged spouse's boyfriend/girlfriend spanked your child against your wishes?



Me, I'd put the boyfriend in a cast, if not in the ground.

 

[Ktoyou]

K2 - you spanked your kids.

What would you do if your estranged spouse's boyfriend/girlfriend spanked your child against your wishes?



Me, I'd put the boyfriend in a cast, if not in the ground.

estranged?

If someone was estranged I would have put them in jail.

 

[koban]

and that's the way it played out.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

K2 - you spanked your kids.

What would you do if your estranged spouse's boyfriend/girlfriend spanked your child against your wishes?



Me, I'd put the boyfriend in a cast, if not in the ground.

I don't get that logic. :idunno:

If my kids are misbehaving, or worse yet disrespecting their mother, and I was not there to discipline them I would be thankful that another person loved my kids enough to set them straight.

Children should NOT be taught that it's "OK" to behave like animals when their father or mother isn't around.

Koban, aren't you a public school supporter? Don't you support a teachers right to discipline a student? Didn't we just agree on that in a thread not so long ago?

 

[WizardofOz]

I've already spanked a child for it. Not my own, but I was babysitting.

Really? Not that it really matters, but how old was the child?

Does anyone here with kids want their babysitter to spank their kids? I know I don't. You'll only confuse their conception of authority.

 

[cattyfan]

No. I am advocating the child teaching himself a lesson. Experiential knowledge will always trump physically violent punishment as a teaching device.

This is a classically stupid response. You don't let children "teach themselves." If you did, they might as well be raising themselves in a jungle. A parent's job is to teach their children...and sometimes a swat on the butt is the teaching tool necessary. A two year old doesn't understand logic, but they understand discipline when it's consistant and attention getting.

And using your "logic," you would let a kid run in front of the car. If he survived getting run over a few times, he'll learn the lesson not to run out into the street.

 

[cattyfan]

Incidentally, parents who allow their children to intentionally get burned as a means of "teaching them" get found to be neglectful and/or abusive, and have their children taken away.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Does anyone here with kids want their babysitter to spank their kids? I know I don't. You'll only confuse their conception of authority.

I wouldn't let anyone babysit my kids if they weren't prepared to properly discipline my children.

Why on earth would you ever want someone to be entrusted with your children who doesn't discipline them when they are misbehaving.

That being said, I only let people know and trust watch my kids.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Incidentally, parents who allow their children to intentionally get burned as a means of "teaching them" get found to be neglectful and/or abusive, and have their children taken away.

Thank God allsmilies has to yet to reproduce.

However...

I am guessing (unless he is as dumb as he acts) that he wont actually be that stupid when and if he has children.

 

[WizardofOz]

I wouldn't let anyone babysit my kids if they weren't prepared to properly discipline my children.

Why on earth would you ever want someone to be entrusted with your children who doesn't discipline them when they are misbehaving.

There are other ways babysitters can discipline that would not involve spanking.

I don't want any babysitter to spank either of my boys because that is the role of parents IMO. Babysitters don't need to touch either of my boy's bottoms, discipline or not, regardless of how well I know or trust them. It's not so much how I would feel about the spanking, but how my children would feel about it. I feel it could cause confusion in the child.

That being said, I only let people know and trust watch my kids.

Like I said, I feel this occurring could easily confuse the conception of authority in the child and who's role it is to physically punish them. I guess I am not a "it takes a village type" in this regard. Even if you know and trust the sitter, you're children may not be so familiar or even comfortable with that individual. Also, the sitter may be inconsistent with what behavior they feel would constitute a spanking as compared to the parents.

It certainly had better be clear between the parents and sitter beforehand that this type of discipline is OK.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

There are other ways babysitters can discipline that would not involve spanking.

That's true but if a spanking is in order.... then a spanking is in order.

I don't want any babysitter to spank either of my boys because that is the role of parents IMO.

That is an unwise strategy. You are teaching your children that they can misbehave when you are not around.

Babysitters don't need to touch either of my boy's bottoms, discipline or not, regardless of how well I know or trust them. It's not so much how I would feel about the spanking, but how my children would feel about it. I feel it could cause confusion.

You are causing the confusion by setting different standards of discipline based on your availability.

Like I said, I feel this occurring could easily confuse the conception of authority in the child and who's role it is to physically punish them. I guess I am not a "it takes a village type" in this regard. Even if you know and trust the sitter, you're children may not be so familiar or even comfortable with that individual. Also, the sitter may be inconsistent with what behavior they feel would constitute a spanking as compared to the parents.

It certainly better be clear between the parents and sitter beforehand that this type of discipline is OK.

Would you allow your children's grandparents to spank them if they were babysitting them?

 

[WizardofOz]

That's true but if a spanking is in order.... then a spanking is in order.

That is an unwise strategy. You are teaching your children that they can misbehave when you are not around.

You are causing the confusion by setting different standards of discipline based on your availability.

Not at all. If a spanking is in order, it will come. By the parents. The child can be told lovingly by the parents what they did that constitutes the punishment so they know what it's from, and then have at it. I am not even totally opposed to a babysitter physically disciplining my child, slapping a hand or what have you; but spanking? No. Like I said, no matter how much I know or trust the person, I don't want them touching my child's bottom. Especially seeing as how my child may not know or trust the person like I do.

Would you allow your children's grandparents to spank them if they were babysitting them?

I almost included this story in my last post. There was quite a debate in my family when my sister and I were rather young. We were at my grandmother's and my sister and my cousin were arguing about something. My grandmother hit my sister with a switch. My father was furious when he found out. He felt this was usurping his and my mother's role as disciplinarians. He only dealt out physical punishment by spanking, not hitting with a switch, and my sister was a very well behaved child, rarely needing to be spanked; implying that he did not wholly trust my grandmother's judgment when she decided this form of punishment was necessary or warranted. He felt it was inconsistent punishment in both his eyes as well as in the eyes of my sister.

I agree with him 100%:idunno: