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Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
I capitalize the "Word"
This is a tangent, but it is common in the religion of Christianity, especially "Protestants" from the catholic perspective to use silly buzzwords. This is commonly one of them. Yes, the translation is wrong. Logos is logic and reasoning.
 

Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
I still see no reason to think the Bible teaches that believing Jews formed a church in the days of the Apostles and that Jewish believers could be born-again of the Spirit in some way not applicable to Gentile converts to Christ.
If you won't read the "Old Testament" then you won't get it. So you think Peter is just foolhardy? Or the Lord Jesus Christ? I will give you the "New Testament" since you won't read the prophets. But first I will show you the standard. From Genesis.

Now the Lord had said to Abram:

“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
2 I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
3 I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you
;


And in Matthew he said this.

22 And behold, a woman of Canaan came from that region and cried out to Him, saying, “Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David! My daughter is severely demon-possessed.”

23 But He answered her not a word.

And His disciples came and urged Him, saying, “Send her away, for she cries out after us.” 24 But He answered and said, “I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”


25 Then she came and worshiped Him, saying, “Lord, help me!”

26 But He answered and said, “It is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the little dogs.

She blessed Israel, and showing great allegiance to a duty (faith) and he blessed her. But not until after.

According to Luke, Peter stated what we are saying. Peter, full of the Holy Spirit. Leader of the Little Flock.

25 As Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him and fell down at his feet and worshiped him. 26 But Peter lifted him up, saying, “Stand up; I myself am also a man.” 27 And as he talked with him, he went in and found many who had come together. 28 Then he said to them, “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with or go to one of another nation.

I would show you the "Old Testament", but you seem to not care about what Jesus taught. But there you have it.

edit: So much for "Papal authority".
 

marke

Well-known member
It was mysterious to me at one time as well. It comes from the 'way' one reads the scriptures and with certain filters in mind, involved. "Born again" was something akin to 'born of the Spirit' today in scope, but they are saying that the passage has a narrower scope: Nicodemus and Israel's need to become spiritual in understand and being (correction requested if need be, or further explanation and thanks Mid Acts).
What scriptures teach an alleged division between the so-called church of saved Jews from the church of saved Gentiles?
 

marke

Well-known member
This is a tangent, but it is common in the religion of Christianity, especially "Protestants" from the catholic perspective to use silly buzzwords. This is commonly one of them. Yes, the translation is wrong. Logos is logic and reasoning.
I'm not following you. Do you think capitalizing of 'Word" is wrong?

1 John 5:7
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
 

marke

Well-known member
If you won't read the "Old Testament" then you won't get it. So you think Peter is just foolhardy? Or the Lord Jesus Christ? I will give you the "New Testament" since you won't read the prophets. But first I will show you the standard. From Genesis.

Now the Lord had said to Abram:

“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
2 I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
3 I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you
;


And in Matthew he said this.

22 And behold, a woman of Canaan came from that region and cried out to Him, saying, “Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David! My daughter is severely demon-possessed.”

23 But He answered her not a word.

And His disciples came and urged Him, saying, “Send her away, for she cries out after us.” 24 But He answered and said, “I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”


25 Then she came and worshiped Him, saying, “Lord, help me!”

26 But He answered and said, “It is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the little dogs.

She blessed Israel, and showing great allegiance to a duty (faith) and he blessed her. But not until after.

According to Luke, Peter stated what we are saying. Peter, full of the Holy Spirit. Leader of the Little Flock.

25 As Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him and fell down at his feet and worshiped him. 26 But Peter lifted him up, saying, “Stand up; I myself am also a man.” 27 And as he talked with him, he went in and found many who had come together. 28 Then he said to them, “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with or go to one of another nation.

I would show you the "Old Testament", but you seem to not care about what Jesus taught. But there you have it.

edit: So much for "Papal authority".
The New Testament clearly divides humans into one of three groups: The Jews, the Gentiles, and Christians.
1 Corinthians 10:32
Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:
 

Lon

Well-known member
What scriptures teach an alleged division between the so-called church of saved Jews from the church of saved Gentiles?
Let me say, I'm not exactly Mid Acts, just that I've read quite a bit to this point and have good number of agreements. Point being, you may not be asking the right guy but a middle man may suffice.

The divisions come from the changes in venue between Jews and gentiles in Acts and Paul's writings. If you follow Acts, and read concurring letters from Paul, you come away with an understanding that Paul is the only apostle to the gentiles (us) that wrote extensively and we have today. In Paul's letters, he himself makes differentiation between his message and that which was given to the other Apostles. For instance, when you see Galatians, there is a clearly marked difference in attendance between gentiles and Jewish Christians and Paul had the need of 'opposing Peter to his face' over the separation, part of which was likely over food prep and 'unclean' gentiles, even if Christians. Even if this comes as too foreign, I recommend listening a bit because the Mid Acts position does make a lot of sense. You may, like me, not become Mid Acts, but thinking their way will indeed help you understand your Bible in a way that makes sense and even help you organize your own theology system, because Mid Acts is fairly simple to grasp and does a good job of giving perspective over whys and other troubling issues of understanding. Think of it kind of like arranging a garage. Some people just do it better, maybe not for me, but I can learn quite a bit with how better they are organized.

Again, any Mid Acts please clarify or chime in on anything pertinent or not quite right, please and ty (my theology garage isn't as tidy).

In Him
 
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marke

Well-known member
Let me say, I'm not exactly Mid Acts, just that I've read quite a bit to this point and have good number of agreements. Point being, you may not be asking the right guy but a middle man may suffice.

The divisions come from the changes in venue between Jews and gentiles in Acts and Paul's writings. If you follow Acts, and read concurring letters from Paul, you come away with an understanding that Paul is the only apostle to the gentiles (us) that wrote extensively and we have today. In Paul's letters, he himself makes differentiation between his message and that which was given to the other Apostles. For instance, when you see Galatians, there is a clearly marked difference in attendance between gentiles and Jewish Christians and Paul had the need of 'opposing Peter to his face' over the separation, part of which was likely over food prep and 'unclean' gentiles, even if Christians. Even if this comes as too foreign, I recommend listening a bit because the Mid Acts position does make a lot of sense. You may, like me, not become Mid Acts, but thinking their way will indeed help you understand your Bible in a way that makes sense and even help you organize your own theology system, because Mid Acts is fairly simple to grasp and does a good job of giving perspective over whys and other troubling issues of understanding. Think of it kind of like arranging a garage. Some people just do it better, maybe not for me, but I can learn quite a bit with how better they are organized.

Again, any Mid Acts please clarify or chime in on anything pertinent or not quite right, please and ty (my theology garage isn't as tidy).

In Him
The Lord added to the church daily in Acts 2. The Apostles were called Christians by Acts 11 and the Apostles and the Christians taught by Paul were referred to as the 'church.'
 

Idolater

"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.



Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.



And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.

26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

27 For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.

28 Ye are they which have continued with me in my temptations.

29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom,

31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.


The Lord added to the church daily in Acts 2. The Apostles were called Christians by Acts 11 and the Apostles and the Christians taught by Paul were referred to as the 'church.'

Also, the Apostle Saint Paul calls our Lord Jesus Christ's body the Church. Our Lord Jesus Christ said He's going to build a Church. Saint John the Evangelist also calls the Church by the name Church. Peter refers to the Church by the metaphor of a temple, and lively stones, which Paul also talks about; the Church being the new temple, along with the Church being the body of our Lord Jesus Christ, through a mystery.

For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
 

Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
The Lord added to the church daily in Acts 2
Can you explain why The Holy Spirit had to show Peter unclean animals? Why? Since you claim the church started in Acts 2 with all the world. Are you a covenant stealer? I wonder if you think you have "tongues" and is a private devotional language. Even though Paul says otherwise to those in Corinth.
 

Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
This is a tangent, but it is common in the religion of Christianity, especially "Protestants" from the catholic perspective to use silly buzzwords. This is commonly one of them. Yes, the translation is wrong. Logos is logic and reasoning.
So is the misuse of the word "amen". Sometimes I can't believe what I am seeing.

Amen, I am telling you.

This is a partial translation and how they use it. I don't read any of these foreign languages. But others do and state what they mean. It means "truly", or "for certain". So what the Lord Jesus Christ said was

Truly I am telling you

He was emphasizing a point. And I see it everywhere now. Especially social media.
 

marke

Well-known member
Can you explain why The Holy Spirit had to show Peter unclean animals? Why? Since you claim the church started in Acts 2 with all the world. Are you a covenant stealer? I wonder if you think you have "tongues" and is a private devotional language. Even though Paul says otherwise to those in Corinth.
I believe the transition from Jew to the Church was gradual, so to speak, and not instantaneous. God did not slam the door shut on the Jews at any particular moment in time in His setting Jews aside for a season until the fulness of the Gentiles (saved Gentile and Jewish Christians) is accomplished.
 

Right Divider

Body part
And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.



Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.



And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.

26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

27 For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth.

28 Ye are they which have continued with me in my temptations.

29 And I appoint unto you a kingdom,

31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.




Also, the Apostle Saint Paul calls our Lord Jesus Christ's body the Church. Our Lord Jesus Christ said He's going to build a Church. Saint John the Evangelist also calls the Church by the name Church. Peter refers to the Church by the metaphor of a temple, and lively stones, which Paul also talks about; the Church being the new temple, along with the Church being the body of our Lord Jesus Christ, through a mystery.

For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
There is more than one "church" in the Bible.

Don't be such a simpleton.
 

Nick M

Black Rifles Matter
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
I believe the transition from Jew to the Church was gradual, so to speak, and not instantaneous. God did not slam the door shut on the Jews at any particular moment in time in His setting Jews aside for a season until the fulness of the Gentiles (saved Gentile and Jewish Christians) is accomplished.
The revelation to Paul was certainly gradual. I am telling you now to read Acts, slowly, and think about things. Not just out of context a single sentence. Study it.

Acts 26 16 But rise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to make you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen and of the things which I will yet reveal to you.

As mentioned before, even the books of the NT are in an order by work of the Holy Spirit. Including Paul's letters sandwiched between the law of Moses.

11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles.
 
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