God's Truth
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Because they lived their physical lives not having the promise.
Are there Saints In Heaven? Poll Question
- Thread starter patrick jane
- Start date
Because they lived their physical lives not having the promise.
Rosenritter
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Seeing that we have zero passages telling us that there are people in heaven, and two telling us specifically about people not being in heaven... I'm thinking about it. Zero compared to two.
Rosenritter
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What do you see there?
God's Truth
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I gave scriptures about spirits being in heaven. Look at your post #339. Try actually reading what I said this time and reply by addressing the scriptures.
God's Truth
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Rosenritter
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Let's make sure we're talking about the same passage. Is this what you're talking about?
1 Peter 3:18-20 KJV
(18) For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
(19) By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
(20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
Diagram that passage for a moment. "By which" points to which phrase?
Jesus didn't preach by being put to death in the flesh, he preached by being quickened by the Spirit. That quickening by the Spirit is an event that declared victory precisely three days and three nights after he was put to death in the flesh. Paul explains this so as to where we can avoid any confusion:
1 Corinthians 15:44-45 KJV
(44) It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
(45) And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
I think you may be mistaking the word "preached" to mean "stand in front of a crowd and talk persuasively." That is one application of the word, but it essentially means "proclaimed." As such to your question of "when" the answer would be "when he was risen, having been quickened by the Spirit." Had Christ merely perished on that cross there would be no victory to preach. Yet his resurrection his victory over those spirits is proclaimed.
Spoiler
God's Truth
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Being quickened in the Spirit means alive in the Spirit.
His Spirit is the Holy Spirit.
The scriptures say plainly that after he died on the cross he went and preached to the spirits in prison/hell.
Rosenritter
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I'm just asking you what you see. Take that as mocking you if you like, but I'm providing you an opportunity to answer.
I do notice that although you say you are in a spiritual realm right now, the fruits of your realm do not seem to yield love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, or temperance. By their fruits you shall know them, it is written. You discern a false prophet by whether their prophecy comes to pass, and you discern whether one is truly in Christ by the fruits of the spirit, and whether they are willing to love one another.
Rosenritter
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Ah, I see. Paul plainly didn't know what he was talking about when he said that when Jesus was resurrected he was made a quickening spirit. Thanks for the clarification of Truth from your Spiritual Realm.
God's Truth
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I don't need you for the opportunity to speak God's Truth.
You are ensnared by Satan the accuser to accuse.
2 Timothy 2:26 and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.
Revelation 12:10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say: "Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Messiah. For the accuser of our brothers and sisters, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down.
God's Truth
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Notice you don't address what I say. Jesus is the Holy Spirit. The scriptures say he died and went in his Spirit and preached to those in prison/hell. His Spirit is the Holy Spirit.
Let's say for the sake of discussion that "Messiah" is the Christ.
Paul said, "For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ." (1 Corinthians 10:4)
Paul is referring to the Christ we know as Jesus the Christ.
Obviously they received the promised Messiah in their lifetime. You're not claiming a different Christ are you?
Multiple scripture tells us that.
Paul claimed that Jesus was the firstborn from the dead.
"But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect." (Hebrews 12:22-23)
"These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. For those who say such things declare plainly that they seek a homeland. And truly if they had called to mind that country from which they had come out, they would have had opportunity to return. But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.
Could this be the city of the Living God?
"to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven" (Hebrews 12:23)
Registered in heaven, not reside in heaven. The firstborn are registered in the Lamb's Book of Life.
Is it possible Jesus was referring to the temple of his body?
popsthebuilder
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I've read your latest responses and commend you for them. But I ask; what of Enoch?
peace
Rosenritter
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But you see GT, I have no need to accuse you. You do a fine job of turning most of the population of this board against you by your very own self. Please take it to heart where it speaks of what the fruits of the Right Spirit are: love, joy, peace.... and so forth.
Against these there is no law.
Rosenritter
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Paul says Enoch died in the faith, not having received the promises. What's the question about Enoch?
"So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. And Enoch walked with God; and he was not for God took him." (Genesis 5:23-24)
The phrase "he was not" means he ceased to exist.