Nope, it's about God's kingdom. (Mark 12:27)
Jamie, do you see that this physical world will pass away and Jesus will make all things new?
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Nope, it's about God's kingdom. (Mark 12:27)
Nope, it's about God's kingdom. (Mark 12:27)
Since heaven and earth have not passed away it should be obvious that the law has not been fulfilled.
Even in Paul's day the law foreshadowed things to come.
The Mosaic law prohibited human sacrifice. Jesus died for sin in spite of the law.
How could something excluded by the law be a fulfillment of the law?
Are you claiming that has been fulfilled? Is North Korea being blessed through Abraham? Is Syria being blessed? Iran?
Who are you trying to fool?
Nope, it's about God's kingdom. (Mark 12:27)
Eh, let’s not bring in Mel’s Gibson’s Catholic influence of the cross.1 of 5 for GT to Debate (The entire book of Galatians)
How much do I really have to type here? This is straight forward. After that long post that tied up chapter 2, I'm going to go straight into chapter 3.
Galatians 3 (HCSB)
3 You foolish Galatians! Who has hypnotized you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was vividly portrayed as crucified?
Paul is building in his frustration. He asks the Galatians how they could be so gullible.
I always wonder if Paul opened this with the words he was really thinking. It's pretty obvious he is livid. He asks the Galatians who deceived them and drew them away from the simplicity of the gospel.
He then asks them why they have forgotten every word about the sacrifice of Jesus. He basically had popped in Mel Gibson's "The Passion" and explained how God coming and dying for them was such a big deal!
Our faith and obedience to Christ is not different from obeying Moses.2 I only want to learn this from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law or by hearing with faith?
Paul is essentially frustrated as goodness and is struggling to keep cool headed in spite of how angry he obviously is.
Paul immediately divides the difference between Absolute Faith and Obedience to Moses.
For those of you that hate the idea that the old covenant is all of Moses and believe absolute Faith (Alone) is a lie, you should probably throw your bible away. Paul is working up to some serious Grace by faith (Alone) verbiage.
If you feel you are righteous and better than an Athiest or an outright, raging sinner because of your righteousness through obedience to any part of Moses, throw your bible away. Paul is about to hurt your feelings.
3 Are you so foolish? After beginning with the Spirit, are you now going to be made complete by the flesh?
Spirit = Holy Spirit of Jesus that comes through Faith and Love (Alone) in Jesus, as your Perfection. This means that you understand that Jesus is your sole righteousness.
The moment you have faith in this, you are instantly complete in ALL of your salvational needs for a lifetime and eternity. He is your cloak of Righteousness that covers your dying and sinful flesh.
When using Moses WITHOUT recognizing the Spirit in what Moses said, you have now taken away the truth about Jesus FULFILLING WHAT MOSES SAID AND THE LAW. You had just explained to Jamie how Jesus fulfilled what Moses said! Now in your confusion you have completely done away with that and have nailed obedience to the cross. God did NOT nail obedience to the cross! God did not nail Jesus’ words to the cross, the word of Jesus WHO SAYS repent or perish, and blessed rather are those who hear and do it.Flesh = Obeying any standard of Moses to believe you are completing Jesus work of salvation on any level. Judgment and Condemnation come with using Moses as your measuring stick.
If Moses brings you any personal assurance or spiritual pride, you're not doing it right.
If you judge and condemn any human being by standards found in Moses, you're not doing it right! No matter who is telling you to condemn or judge by Moses, you mustn't believe a word they say.
4 Did you suffer so much for nothing—if in fact it was for nothing?
Did you get shunned by Jews, Greeks and government to the point of fearing for your lives for nothing. Have you lost your jobs for nothing? Have you helped spread the simple message of Jesus's powerful blood for nothing? Are you seriously risking your lives for the pure and simple Gospel message that you are now rejecting?
5 So then, does God supply you with the Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law or by hearing with faith?
Does the spiritual revelation of Jesus's teachings and the working of amazing miracles occur all around you, in you and come from you because of Faith (ALONE) and the Spirit that comes with Faith (ALONE)? Did you receive the fruits of the Spirit from Faith (Alone)?
Obeying Moses nowadays is IMPOSSIBLE unless you obey Jesus!!!Or, does any good thing come from obedience to Moses and judgment towards your fellow man?
6 Just as Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness,
Abraham trusted that God is good. He believed that God provided all of His needs and saw God provide all of his needs. By Abraham's Faith Alone, he was counted Righteous. As in, void of judgment by the Law of obedience. All of his sins are blotted away with the death of Jesus!
7 then understand that those who have faith are Abraham’s sons.
If you can simply understand Faith alone, then you are given Jesus's cloak of righteousness and salvation is guaranteed by Jesus's payment of your entire life's debt of sin; past, present and future!
8 Now the Scripture saw in advance that God would justify the Gentiles by faith and told the good news ahead of time to Abraham, saying, All the nations will be blessed through you.
Jesus always knew He would save all of mankind through His death and resurrection.
Jesus told Abraham that He would bless the entire human race through the Son of the Promise (Jesus) that would be born of the lineage of his (Abraham's) son of Promise. (Isaac)
9 So those who have faith are blessed with Abraham, who had faith.
All you have to do is put your complete faith in Jesus as you are. This will instantly make you as right with God as you have read Abraham to be.
You and Abraham become co heirs with Jesus by your Faith, void of human effort in Jesus!
GT,Nameless,
I hope to reply to your posts tomorrow. You are going kind of fast now. I hope you slow down a little.
Heaven and earth did NOT have to pass away BECAUSE Jesus fulfilled the Law and the Prophets.
Jamie,That is one of the most absurd claims I have ever read. I'll agree that for the most part Jesus complied with the parts of the law that applied to him but I fail to see how a man could fulfill the ordinances for women since they did not apply to him or any other man.
I also fail to see how Jesus fulfilled the law for the Levites since he wasn't a Levite.
Even if Jesus had somehow fulfilled the law for women and Levites what does that have to do with the church of God?
The church of God is not subject to Mosaic law and never has been. Your point is moot. Invalid. Doesn't apply. Irrelevant. Inane.
That is one of the most absurd claims I have ever read. I'll agree that for the most part Jesus complied with the parts of the law that applied to him but I fail to see how a man could fulfill the ordinances for women since they did not apply to him or any other man.
I also fail to see how Jesus fulfilled the law for the Levites since he wasn't a Levite.
Even if Jesus had somehow fulfilled the law for women and Levites what does that have to do with the church of God?
The church of God is not subject to Mosaic law and never has been. Your point is moot. Invalid. Doesn't apply. Irrelevant. Inane.
GT,
You didn't get a chance to address the previous verses and my post on them. I'm issuing a Weekend grace period to catch up.
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I thought I have been caught up. Link me to the post, or give me the post number.
re #7,
you may find that you have to redo some sections because later Galatian material may drastically changed earlier.
If I understand you correctly, you are pointing out what Daqq pointed out, but I addressed this in the second chunk of Galatians and added to my initial post.
I have addressed the way Daqq and I were in disagreement, and I am slowly expounding on the way curse does ties to The old covenant law/Moses throughout all of it.
It is a reoccurring theme in all of Pauls writings, but directly obvious in Galatians through repetition.
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http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...f-Galatians)&p=4760621&viewfull=1#post4760621
And # 125 above it are the verses.
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re #7,
you may find that you have to redo some sections because later Galatian material may drastically changed earlier.
Can you give an example so I don't have to sift through 196 posts?