Yet another Roman Catholic curse that is still in force today

glassjester

glassjester

Well-known member
Cruciform said:
No doubt. Those who are accurately informed regarding ecclesiastical history during the Middle Ages, however, will acknowledge and affirm the historical facts. Of course, those who are willing to acknowledge and affirm the facts will probably already have become Catholics by this point.
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For sure.

"To be deep in history is to cease to be protestant."
 
Cruciform

Cruciform

New member
Crucible said:
You're Church liked to dictate, let all things go which benefits itself, and wash it's hands clean if the tide turns on them. They did it in the Crusades, they did it at the time you are referring to, and they do it now.
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Straw Man Fallacy. You know exactly nothing about the Catholic Church, let alone about the Crusades. Your ignorance is displayed in everything you post.

Regarding the Crusades, see the following sources:

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Stark, GOD'S BATTALIONS: The Case for the Crusades (HarperOne, 2009)


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Weidenkopf, THE GLORY OF THE CRUSADES (Cathoic Answers Press, 2014)


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Tyerman, GOD'S WAR: A New History of the Crusades (Belknap Press, 2006)​
 
Crucible

Crucible

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God's chosen cannot lose in war. It never happened in the Bible, and is why the militant Muslims even today do as they do despite their lacking power.

The Christians did not achieve what they swore was promised to happen.

So what does that make the Catholic Church :idunno:

History is revised a lot- to be 'deep in history' typically ends up with an arbitrary bias.
 
glassjester

glassjester

Well-known member
Crucible said:
God's chosen cannot lose in war. It never happened in the Bible, and is why the militant Muslims even today do as they do despite their lacking power.

The Christians did not achieve what they swore was promised to happen.

So what does that make the Catholic Church :idunno:

History is revised a lot- to be 'deep in history' typically ends up with an arbitrary bias.
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So we shouldn't trust historians, but we should trust the author of an article claiming that Psalm 108 is a curse.

Ok...
 
Cruciform

Cruciform

New member
lifeisgood said:
Yeah, heresy against the CATHOLIC CHURCH... Sorry for the confusion.
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As has already been observed, heresy was considered a capital crime against the State, and was thus punished by the State. Looks like you're still confused.

Back to Post #35.
 
lifeisgood

lifeisgood

New member
Cruciform said:
As has already been observed, heresy was considered a capital crime against the State, and was thus punished by the State. Looks like you're still confused.

Back to Post #35.
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Yeah, heresy against the CATHOLIC CHURCH... Looks like you're still confused.
 
glassjester

glassjester

Well-known member
lifeisgood said:
Yeah, heresy against the CATHOLIC CHURCH... Looks like you're still confused.
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musterion said:
Cruciferous can't help but lie. It's all he's got.
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:doh:


It is redundant to point out that heresy is against the beliefs of the Church.
That's what heresy means. What other kind of heresy is there?
Heresy against the Magna Carta?
Heresy against Newtonian Physics?

Those things aren't called heresy, are they?
Yes, we know what heresy means.


Nevertheless...

The state considered heresy (beliefs contrary to Church teaching) a crime. The state arrested heretics. The state tried heretics. The state executed heretics.

What's your point?

How does the criminal status of heresy, maintained by a civil government, determine whether Catholic doctrine is true or not?

More specifically, which doctrine of the Church is made false because England arrested heretics?


Oh, and do you believe Psalm 108 is a curse?
(Anti-Catholics will continue to ignore this.)
 
lifeisgood

lifeisgood

New member
glassjester said:
What's your point?
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It is all about the Roman Catholic Church Organization (RCCO) working in cahoots with the state to have people who did NOT agree with the RCCO's beliefs and considered them person non grata to have them killed by the state as they did not belief in the RCCO's beliefs.

Translation: You do not believe exactly like the RCCO? Off with your head. And the state was in complete accord with the RCCO; therefore, carrying out the dirty deed. This way, the RCCO could say, 'No, not I but the state' and wash their hands like Pilate.

glassjester said:
Oh, and do you believe Psalm 108 is a curse?
(Anti-Catholics will continue to ignore this.)
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I have no idea of what you are talking about.
 
glassjester

glassjester

Well-known member
musterion said:
There was no practical difference between state and church in Catholic countries in those days. State answered to church. You pretend to not know that.
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lifeisgood said:
It is all about the Roman Catholic Church Organization (RCCO) working in cahoots with the state to have people who did NOT agree with the RCCO's beliefs and considered them person non grata to have them killed by the state as they did not belief in the RCCO's beliefs.

Translation: You do not believe exactly like the RCCO? Off with your head. And the state was in complete accord with the RCCO; therefore, carrying out the dirty deed. This way, the RCCO could say, 'No, not I but the state' and wash their hands like Pilate.
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Oh please.
The state had its own interests in mind.
You speak as if heresy was the only capital offense of the time.
There were hundreds.


Besides, heresy remained a capital crime even after the English Reformation.
Yes, England killed whoever they considered an enemy of the state-religion (and therefore an enemy of the state, itself) no matter what that religion happened to be.

You did not accurately summarize the law of the land by saying, "You do not believe exactly like the RCCO? Off with your head."

A better summation would be, "You do not believe exactly like the king? Off with your head."


Hence the numerous Catholics executed, following England's invention of their own brand of Protestantism:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_..._for_their_faith_in_England_1534.E2.80.931680



lifeisgood said:
I have no idea of what you are talking about.
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The article in the OP claims that Psalm 108 is a curse.
I don't have any idea what it's talking about either.
 
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Crucible

Crucible

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glassjester said:
How does the criminal status of heresy, maintained by a civil government, determine whether Catholic doctrine is true or not?
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The Catholic Church never went after the inquisitors or said anything about these 'civil crimes of heresy', but they'll take the heads off of their own to pay the price for the pope's mistakes.

The Catholic Church, like any governmental establishment, is going to tailor it's history to be defensible. It's just that simple, and you are free to believe the divinized, innocent version all you want :wave2:
 
glassjester

glassjester

Well-known member
Crucible said:
The Catholic Church never went after the inquisitors or said anything about these 'civil crimes of heresy', but they'll take the heads off of their own to pay the price for the pope's mistakes.

The Catholic Church, like any governmental establishment, is going to tailor it's history to be defensible. It's just that simple, and you are free to believe the divinized, innocent version all you want :wave2:
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Heresy, under the religious English monarchy, was seen as treason.
Are you saying the Church had the power to stop England from executing traitors?

And which particular Catholic belief was suddenly made untrue by England's criminal code?
Feel free to browse: http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/_INDEX.HTM
 
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