God's Truth
New member
You know you have said it.
ECT Who is saved?
- Thread starter oatmeal
- Start date
You know you have said it.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Eph. 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
God's Truth
New member
God gives the gift to His children.
The not of yourselves is not of the purification works that kept the Gentiles away and it is why many Jews would not come to Jesus because they wanted to keep cleaning themselves as God had commanded before.
glorydaz
Well-known member
No it isn't. You lie when you claim Paul is talking about the Jews' rituals and rites in any way. Try actually reading Ephesians, for once in your life, instead of adding your own warped understanding to what Paul is saying. Who is he speaking to here?
Eph. 2:1-3
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
The Gentiles had no purification works, and Paul is preaching to the Gentiles very explicitly. Who is he speaking to here?
Eph. 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Cross Reference
New member
God's Truth
New member
Paul is talking about the purification works. Just read and you will see that every time no works is mentioned circumcision is mentioned.
The. Gentiles. were. dead. in. their. sins. because they did not do the purification works and atone for their sins with the ceremonial works.
Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,
They don't talk about anything that make them feel uncomfortable.
God's Truth
New member
They were ENEMIES of God's because they did NOT obey and atone for their sins and enter the covenant of circumcision.
glorydaz
Well-known member
No, they were enemies of God because they did not know or believe in Him. :doh:
God's Truth
New member
They did not know Him because they did not OBEY HIM.
1 John 2:4 Whoever says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person.
1 Corinthians 8:3 But whoever loves God is known by God
1 John 5:3 For this is what love for God is: to keep His commands. Now His commands are not a burden,
1 John 3:24 Those who obey his commands live in him, and he in them.
glorydaz
Well-known member
What kind of a wacko are you? Those dead works saved no one. Weren't intended to, either. You've been told this hundreds of times, and still you can't see.
Hebrews 10:4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
Abraham was saved before he was circumcised...you've been told that time and time again. Rom. 4:9-10
God's Truth
New member
Wow; without those works, one could NOT be in a covenant with God.
Without the shedding of blood there was NO FORGIVENESS OF SINS.
Leviticus 17:11 For the life of a creature is in the blood, and I have given it to you to make atonement for yourselves on the altar; it is the blood that makes atonement for one's life.
Hebrews 9:22
In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.
Abraham still had to get circumcised!
glorydaz
Well-known member
There ya go....just throw out the verse that says the blood of bulls and goats cannot take away sins, and then try and claim their blood could atone for sins. Foolish woman. :nono:
Abraham was circumcised as a seal - a sign of his faith.
Romans 4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
glorydaz
Well-known member
Three law verses and one grace verse. :chew:
This is the age of Grace. Being found IN HIM is truly "knowing" Him.
Philippians 3:9-11
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
God's Truth
New member
The righteousness that used to come from the law by DOING THE WORKS OF THE LAW:
The Burnt Offering; The Grain Offering; The Fellowship Offering; The Sin Offering; The Guilt Offering; Dietary Laws; Purification After Childbirth; Cleansing From Infectious Skin Diseases; Cleansing From Mildew; Discharges Causing Uncleanness; The Day of Atonement; Rules for Priests; The Sabbath; Firstfruits; The Passover and Unleavened Bread; Feast of Weeks; Feast of Trumpets; Feast of Tabernacles; Oil and Bread Set Before The LORD; the Sabbath Year; The Year of Jubilee; Circumcision.
But now we have a righteousness from Jesus.
glorydaz
Well-known member
:doh:
Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.
Those were but a shadow of what was to come....a figure for the time then present. They were merely a temporary covering for their conscience sake, and made no one righteous.
Hebrews 9:8-10 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: 9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; 10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
God's Truth
New member
There was no sacrifice for MURDER and ADULTERY. That does not mean the purification works did not justify. God gave them those works to PURIFY themselves.
God's Truth
New member
Remember when you used to deny that it did anything. Looks like you are learning something.
What you said about the conscience is wrong.
Cross Reference
New member
Cross Reference
New member
Yes. Devisive preaching/teaching usually is even when it is from the 'Word' of Jesus. Where do you attend presently?