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Quote from the Bible and we'll discuss.
What is the Gospel?
- Thread starter Sonnet
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Just before Saul became Paul, God had cut off Israel (Acts 8, when Steven was murdered), and God's covenant with them had been set aside for later, so that God could temporarily work with the Gentiles.
The message Jesus gave Paul had always been available, but it obscured by God making His second covenant with Abraham (Genesis 17).
What do you think "came with grace" and "full of grace and truth" mean?
Where in four gospels did Jesus teach grace? How could Jesus have taught grace if He never once uttered the word grace?
God's Truth
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hahahaha You think God cut off Israel when Stephen was stoned to death. No, the UNFAITHFUL Jews were cut off when Jesus started his earthly ministry.
Luke 19:42 and said, "If you, even you, had only known on this day what would bring you peace--but now it is hidden from your eyes.
Luke 8:10
He said, "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of God has been given to you, but to others I speak in parables, so that, "'though seeing, they may not see; though hearing, they may not understand.'
John 12:40
"He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so they can neither see with their eyes, nor understand with their hearts, nor turn--and I would heal them."
Romans 11:8
as it is written: "God gave them a spirit of stupor, eyes that could not see and ears that could not hear, to this very day."
Matthew 13:14
In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah: "'You will be ever hearing but never understanding; you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
Mark 4:12 so that, "'they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!'"
Mark 8:17And Jesus, aware of this, said to them, "Why do you discuss the fact that you have no bread? Do you not yet see or understand? Do you have a hardened heart? 18"HAVING EYES, DO YOU NOT SEE? AND HAVING EARS, DO YOU NOT HEAR? And do you not remember,
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Technically, with anyone apart from Israel (both Jews and Greeks).
No, the message that Jesus gave Paul was hid in God and not available or known by anyone before.
Eph 3:9 (AKJV/PCE)
(3:9) And to make all [men] see what [is] the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
Anything "hid in God" is definitely not known by anyone else.
God's Truth
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I already did. Go look, or I will post them again for you.
So what about the covenant made in Genesis 15?
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Anything but the Bible, eh?
God's Truth
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It was not hid from the lost sheep of Israel.
Not all from Israel are Israel.
There are spiritual Jews who had faith before Jesus came.
Those are the Jews who God kept for Himself and then gave them to Jesus when Jesus came.
Jesus said he would not lose one that God gave him.
They were God's, but now they had to go through Jesus to remain God's.
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What covenant would that be?
God's Truth
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I gave you scriptures that say Jesus came with grace.
Jesus taught forgiveness through him.
That is what Paul taught, forgiveness through Jesus Christ.
Spoiler
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I have a Bible. Which covenant are you talking about?
That passage does not mention a covenant.
That passage does not mention a covenant.
I asked for you to quote Jesus TEACHING grace. Are you unable to do that?
We aren't talking about forgiveness. We're talking about grace. We'll get to forgiveness in a bit, after and only after you understand that grace is not law.
Where in the Bible are the verses where Jesus teaches grace?
The verses you gave do not show Jesus teaching grace.
So, GT, where does Jesus utter the word grace in the Bible? And where does the Bible show Him teaching grace?
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
Purdy sure that's a MAD site.
Yet they don't presume the hyper-dispism that you do.
Verse 18.
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My bad... the land covenant. What about it?
God's Truth
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Give it up, JR. The Bible says plainly that Jesus came with grace. You try to change it to say Jesus came gracefully.
Just believe the scriptures, they are the truth.
The good news is Jesus.
Don't you know that?
God's Truth
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Paul is speaking to the Corinthian Gentiles. Paul says he is a minister of a NEW COVENANT.
2 Corinthians 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
The Greater Glory of the New Covenant
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness!
Paul says he is a MINISTER of a NEW COVENANT, and that it is THE MINISTRY/COVENANT of the SPIRIT.
Jesus came and made a NEW COVENANT.
Paul says he is a MINISTER of a NEW COVENANT, and that it is THE MINISTRY/COVENANT of the SPIRIT. That is the same New Covenant that Jesus preached. Jesus promised the Holy Spirit to those in the New Covenant.
Jesus says his words are SPIRIT.
See John 6:63.
Romans 11:27
For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
1 Corinthians 11:25
In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.”
2 Corinthians 2:12
[ Ministers of the New Covenant ] Now when I went to Troas to preach the gospel of Christ and found that the Lord had opened a door for me,
2 Corinthians 3:6
He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
2 Corinthians 3:7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was,
John 6:54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.
John 6:55
For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.
Luke 22:20 In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.
Galatians 3:15
[ The Law and the Promise ] Brothers and sisters, let me take an example from everyday life. Just as no one can set aside or add to a human covenant that has been duly established, so it is in this case.
Galatians 3:17
What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise.
Galatians 4:24
These things are being taken figuratively: The women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children who are to be slaves: This is Hagar.