What is the Gospel?

[George Affleck]

He is as capable of keeping His Word pure, as He was of keeping Adam pure.

So that would be a No? He's not able to keep His Word pure?
And to that you want to add that He was incapable of keeping Adam pure?
Any other attributes you would like to add about this impotent god you are introducing us to?

Do you really believe that all men who lived and died without the Bible are damned?
And that no men are saved without having the scripture?

You said "we".
Here is your statement:

The important thing is not that we understand the Bible, but that we seek God.

Does that sound like men who lived and died?
Please learn that words have actual meanings attached to them.




Note to all:
Anyone who encourages a moving away from God's Word in favour of seeking God on their own is working for Satan. His first action on earth was to encourage Eve to doubt God's words. And he has been doing it ever since.

 

[blackbirdking]

So that would be a No? He's not able to keep His Word pure?
And to that you want to add that He was incapable of keeping Adam pure?
Any other attributes you would like to add about this impotent god you are introducing us to?

Why do you think God was unable to keep Adam pure? You said it, not me.

You said "we".
Here is your statement:

Does that sound like men who lived and died?
Please learn that words have actual meanings attached to them.

I meant exactly what I said.
Why do you assume that someone who is seeking God would not seek what God wrote?
And yes, please learn that words do only mean what say and not what you read into them.

If a man reads what a woman wrote, so what; on the other hand, if a man learns of a particular woman, he will want to read what she wrote. Striving to understand the Bible is useless if you don't care about the Author.

Note to all:
Anyone who encourages a moving away from God's Word in favour of seeking God on their own is working for Satan. His first action on earth was to encourage Eve to doubt God's words. And he has been doing it ever since.

Anyone who assumes that seeking God is to move away from the Bible, clearly doesn't understand the character of God or the Bible.
If Eve would have been seeking God she would not have doubted His words.
What part of that do you not understand?
She wasn't seeking God and that's why she doubted God's words!

If what you say is true, everybody who is reading the Bible is going to be saved.

If what I'm saying is true, everybody who is seeking God is going to be saved.

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Notice it says nothing about reading the Bible. Do you have a scripture to negate this one?

 

[glorydaz]

Psalms 19:1The heavens declare the glory of God,
and the sky abovea proclaims his handiwork.
2Day to day pours out speech,
and night to night reveals knowledge.
3There is no speech, nor are there words,
whose voice is not heard.
4Their voiceb goes out through all the earth,
and their words to the end of the world.

David seems to agree with BBK.

I’m out of this. I honestly am.

I had stopped posting for a while. And I came back for the sake of a brother who is in Christ’s drawing Love. [MENTION=16283]Sonnet[/MENTION]

All my best

Poetry is a beautiful thing, but it has a purpose. One I'm afraid is being missed. God's handiwork only displays certain aspects of God's glory. We see the glory of God revealed in all of creation, but we do not see the glory of God as revealed in the face of Jesus Christ.... as we do in the word of God. If what was revealed in nature was sufficient in itself, we wouldn't have been given the word of God at all.

Anyway......I'm surprised you're so invested in supporting one member here, EE, that you get offended when we voice disagreement. What's up with that? :think:

 

[glorydaz]

I can’t fight with friends... anymore...

All my love to all of you...

[MENTION=12969]Sherman[/MENTION]... Please ****ing ban me... I don’t want to raise my fists to fellow believers... anymore...

All my love and best to all of you.

Good grief. There is no excuse for this self pity.

You act like you've never been in a spiritual battle before.

Study up on the Armour of God, and get off your duff. Giving up like this is unacceptable. :nono:

 

[blackbirdking]

Amen...

Blessings to you... Lover of Christ, Friend of the searching and defender of the Blood.

I have no clue how real you are, but thanks and seek Him.

Philippians 3:7But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. 8Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, 9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: 10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; 11If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Poetry is a beautiful thing, but it has a purpose. One I'm afraid is being missed. God's handiwork only displays certain aspects of God's glory. We see the glory of God revealed in all of creation, but we do not see the glory of God as revealed in the face of Jesus Christ.... as we do in the word of God. If what was revealed in nature was sufficient in itself, we wouldn't have been given the word of God at all.

Anyway......I'm surprised you're so invested in supporting one member here, EE, that you get offended when we voice disagreement. What's up with that? :think:

Because BBK is correct... and they are witnessing to Sonnet...

I put them on my credibility!

Why do you think God was unable to keep Adam pure? You said it, not me.



I meant exactly what I said.
Why do you assume that someone who is seeking God would not seek what God wrote?
And yes, please learn that words do only mean what say and not what you read into them.

If a man reads what a woman wrote, so what; on the other hand, if a man learns of a particular woman, he will want to read what she wrote. Striving to understand the Bible is useless if you don't care about the Author.




Anyone who assumes that seeking God is to move away from the Bible, clearly doesn't understand the character of God or the Bible.
If Eve would have been seeking God she would not have doubted His words.
What part of that do you not understand?
She wasn't seeking God and that's why she doubted God's words!

If what you say is true, everybody who is reading the Bible is going to be saved.

If what I'm saying is true, everybody who is seeking God is going to be saved.

Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Notice it says nothing about reading the Bible. Do you have a scripture to negate this one?

If they doubt the Divinity of Christ... Mock Israel or condemn brethren... be it on my head...

However... I do not believe they will. I hear the Spirit of Jesus speaking in their words.

This is why.

I deleted my flame out. I am a mere clay vessel... cracked and worn.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Good grief. There is no excuse for this self pity.

You act like you've never been in a spiritual battle before.

Study up on the Armour of God, and get off your duff. Giving up like this is unacceptable. :nono:

Please delete my quote. I deleted it. Please forgive my weakness. I have retracted my failure.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

I have no clue how real you are, but thanks and seek Him.

Philippians 3:7But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. 8Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, 9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: 10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; 11If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

As real as they get... now carry on and move forward in God’s Graces. Your words are critical here... on this particular thread... dispute the opposition that others are giving.

You are encouragement to Sonnet... all else is irrelevant.

 

[glorydaz]

My apologies for not being more verbally clear.
I meant to say;
The Bible is not worth a tinkers damn to somebody who doesn't believe there is Someone behind it. They won't even bother to read it. If a man seeks God, God will lead him into truth whether it be the Bible or some other means of revelation. You really think God doesn't reveal Himself today? You better think again.

When a man seeks God he will inadvertently be drawn to the Bible. The church has tried cramming the Bible down the throats of unbelievers and it hasn't worked. Maybe if those unbelievers saw the light shining they would glorify God who is in heaven.
You cannot find the gospel that can save you without first finding the God that can save.

Go back and read the entire thread and put into context my post that you first responded to. I was writing to someone who acknowledged that he didn't even know if God existed.

Many disagreements about scripture and the character of God occur for this same reason. Men read what they want to see, rather than striving to know the character of the author.

Well, you can claim the credit for this mess. You were vague, and now you double down on it.

That in yellow is in absolute contradiction to Holy Scripture.

The Gospel comes first.....it is the Power of God unto salvation. It's the hearing of the Gospel that saves.

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!​

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Well, you can claim the credit for this mess. You were vague, and now you double down on it.

That in yellow is in absolute contradiction to Holy Scripture.

The Gospel comes first.....it is the Power of God unto salvation. It's the hearing of the Gospel that saves.

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!​

John 5:39 ... God is before Scripture... not the other way around.

 

[blackbirdking]

Hmmm....sounds new age to me.

How do you propose we seek God without the Bible?

How do you propose we are lead into Truth without the Bible?

Just make sure you masticate well before ingesting.

Matthew 4:4But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.​

Interesting that you think that God is nowhere to be found except hidden in scripture. It's not my call to tell you where to find Him; however, if you don't seek Him, you will never find Him in scripture either.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Allah is in the Qu’ ran ... Hinduism’s Perception of their God’s are in the Veda... but Jesus Christ is alive and breathing, teaching within the hearts of mankind. The Bible only amplifies what the Spirit already utters... into the hearts and souls of all that listen.

If that’s newage... then I’m the Queen of England!

 

[glorydaz]

As real as they get... now carry on and move forward in God’s Graces. Your words are critical here... on this particular thread... dispute the opposition that others are giving.

You are encouragement to Sonnet... all else is irrelevant.

Sonnet is not the babe you seem to think him. He doesn't need the kind of encouragement blackbirdking is giving him. If anything, it's the other way around.

I'll go so far as to say what you're doing here with this "encouraging" business and back slapping isn't good for anyone involved.

1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.​

Opposition is "irrelevant"? What of "iron sharpeneth iron"?

 

[glorydaz]

Allah is in the Qu’ ran ... Hinduism’s Perception of their God’s are in the Veda... but Jesus Christ is alive and breathing, teaching within the hearts of mankind. The Bible only amplifies what the Spirit already utters... into the hearts and souls of all that listen.

If that’s newage... then I’m the Queen of England!

Shall I bow now or later?

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Interesting that you think that God is nowhere to be found except hidden in scripture. It's not my call to tell you where to find Him; however, if you don't seek Him, you will never find Him in scripture either.

GD knows Him well. But we can get locked “into” scripture... and forget that God first explodes into our life “outside” of scripture.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Shall I bow now or later?

So you do not believe the Gospel can exist or knowledge of Jesus Christ... without scripture?

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Sonnet is not the babe you seem to think him. He doesn't need the kind of encouragement blackbirdking is giving him. If anything, it's the other way around.

I'll go so far as to say what you're doing here with this "encouraging" business and back slapping isn't good for anyone involved.

1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.​

Opposition is "irrelevant"? What of "iron sharpeneth iron"?

The Bible doesn’t save. Jesus saves. I believe in scripture and it’s inerrancy... but BBK is on the money.

Sonnet knows scripture better than MANY Christians and He is drowning in DOUBT. He needs to Experience the Author! Sonnet needs Jesus before anything else! That’s BBK’s point...

That’s why I’m backing BBK!

 

[blackbirdking]

Well, you can claim the credit for this mess. You were vague, and now you double down on it.

That in yellow is in absolute contradiction to Holy Scripture.

The Gospel comes first.....it is the Power of God unto salvation. It's the hearing of the Gospel that saves.

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!​

Now hear that; a cart pulling a horse.
How can anyone believe a Gospel without believing in a Gospel Giver firstly.

How can a man believe a sent Gospel if he believes it came from nowhere? Your own words refute your statement.

A man must believe in the one who sent the message before he can accept the message as truth.

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

Sonnet is not the babe you seem to think him. He doesn't need the kind of encouragement blackbirdking is giving him. If anything, it's the other way around.

I'll go so far as to say what you're doing here with this "encouraging" business and back slapping isn't good for anyone involved.

1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.​

Opposition is "irrelevant"? What of "iron sharpeneth iron"?

I’m sure opposing you at this moment and I’m not slapping your back.

Hope you feel sharpened.

 

[Sonnet]

In both instances I have provided an analysis in my answer. Your only response, is basically "no, I disagree".

I do not have time to engage when another is unwilling (or unable) to meet me at the same level.

AMR

Indeed, it is only by what Our Lord accomplished that anyone can be brought into the Kingdom. This is the majestic and exclusive claim that only Christianity makes, setting aside all other belief systems. Exactly how is one brought into the Kingdom of God?

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:7 Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'

Our Lord is not telling one to take charge of his own salvation and make a good decision. Rather "You must be born again" is is simply a statement of fact, not a command to be obeyed. It is a declarative, not an imperative, sentence.

In fact, the words of the Our Lord, instead of suggesting that Nicodemus should assume personal responsibility for his own salvation, teach exactly the opposite idea.

The purpose of the entire Nicodemus passage might be summarized like this: Regeneration is not something any man can do, for flesh can only produce flesh. It is a miraculous work of God's Spirit, who blows when and where He pleases.

Our Lord here is saying, "Yes, Nicodemus, the new birth is a necessity, but neither you nor any other man can cause it to happen, even if you could think of a way to return to the womb of your mother. Only God can perform this work."

AMR

One wonders why Jesus chose the OT story that He did if your interpretation is correct. Infected and dying Israelites have the choice to look or not look. If we assume your position, then it is God deciding which of the Israelites would look. This impugns God's character as though He were merely presiding over a game of fast and loose.

You deny that Jesus is speaking imperatively, but we have Him saying:

“You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things? Very truly I tell you, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man. Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”

The link between believing Jesus and being born again unto eternal life is clear and Jesus is enjoining this from Nicodemus.

Regarding your point about the rebirth being the work of God - then I can't see there is an issue. That the mechanics of such a Spiritual rebirth must be all God's work is incontrovertible - no man would claim such ability.

Your:

Our Lord here is saying, "Yes, Nicodemus, the new birth is a necessity, but neither you nor any other man can cause it to happen, even if you could think of a way to return to the womb of your mother. Only God can perform this work."

holds only with regard to such mechanics. There is no verse that says what you imply - that 'neither you nor any other man can cause it to happen' is somehow directly related to an inability to choose to believe.

You may have missed #491.