Wrong. Please re-read post.
What is the express image of God?
- Thread starter keypurr
- Start date
Wrong. Please re-read post.
Can Jesus function independently of the spirit Christ? If the spirit Christ dis-incarnated - or was never incarnated - could Jesus fully function just like you and I?
RBBI - With all due respect this represents a horrible lack of understanding of basic Greek. In Greek, the word is the same - pneuma....
Hi Aner......With all due respect to you as well, I'm aware that the Greek word used is the same, but ghost is also a meaning, not just Spirit. The translation, then reflects the difference here below for a reason.
I dislike the Greek language intensely. Although I'm sure the language interpreters did their best as they do today as well, but the Spirit is the interpreter; after all He wrote the Book.
Jhn 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
Please note the difference, even though the Greek word is the same. It obviously would make no sense if they both said Spirit as in, "but this spake he of the Spirit.......for the Spirit was not yet given."
Now as to why it reads differently, the best example is below. Note that the disciples mentioned said they had been baptized by John, which means water baptism and the inward infilling of the Holy SPIRIT, yet they still needed something, according to Paul.
Act 19:1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
Act 19:2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
Act 19:3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism.
Act 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
Act 19:5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
Act 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
You ever notice how His name is used differently in certain passages? In some, He's Jesus the Christ, or Jesus Christ, but in others, as in Acts above, He's Christ Jesus. We know that Jesus Christ is Jesus the Christ to be proper since it was His title and not His name, so I wonder what Christ Jesus is intended to differentiate? How about Christ, the Jesus (one). Christ is a many-membered body since the day of Pentecost, because THAT was the SEED that was planted, and that Seed is THE INCORRUPTIBLE one.
Peace
I knew that one was a joke, but I've read several others on here, too. But no, I didn't know what it means. He's never led me to read any of the "early church fathers" writings. To me, they are all the books before John. :chuckle: Peace
You sure about that?
As do you.....may He lift you even higher into His presence and teach you His ways. Peace
Aren't you? What do you think ETERNAL LIFE IS?
Hey Stan - Did you get that Acts 10:38 text which substantiates that Jesus was anointed at His baptism?? I think we can safely move on now that we have established that. Thanks to KeyPurr for providing that text.
Aner
Keypurr is on my ignore list if you paid attention to my posts, and Acts 10:38 doesn't say what you purport it to. Try reading it IN context.
Then Peter began to speak: “I now realize how true it is that God does not show favouritism but accepts from every nation the one who fears him and does what is right. You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. You know what has happened throughout the province of Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached—how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.
You assume God did this anointing when Jesus was baptised by John, when in fact Jesus was anointed from birth. Again, read Luke 2 and what Simeon prophesied and confiemd, and also what the angels said in verse 11;
Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord.
Sorry about missing your Ignore for KeyPurr - I admittedly don't keep up on all the relational drama around here.
As to context, the only item that is relevant is that time of the anointing which occurred subsequent to John's beginning to preach his message. Regardless of providing a clear time of the anointing which the context does, the statement is totally sufficient within itself if one has a basic understanding of the concept of "an anointing" for an office (obviously the office of the Messiah). You are simply hung up on a text which you are misreading in the context to the whole of scripture (I have done the same in the past so it is quite obvious when someone else is doing so). This text totally clears up what is really obvious to any basic Bible reading even without this text.
With all due respect, I suspect your method in this instance is sourced from the same location that results in your having a hard time with such clear texts that describe Jesus as a man and God as the Father alone.
I have done my best and you are choosing to simply do what you want. Good luck, Aner.
Just stating the obvious.
and nowhere does the scriptures say Jesus was "anointed" at the water baptism. Do you think God couldn't think of the word when he inspired this account? The reason for Jesus' water baptism was made clear by Himself. That all righteousness be fulfilled. Matt 3:15
Maybe you can show us where the OFFICE of the Messiah is taught IN scripture? Quite frankly I'm not the one HUNG UP on this issue.
Your condescending nature is typical of keypurr and his ilk but not something that bothers me at all. I'm used to unis being like you.
Your words have already indicated you have NO respect for me so don't bother trying to play nice. Jesus was a man, a man that was/is God incarnate. I'd supply many scriptures but my experience with people of your ilk is that you are blind to them.
I am choosing to RIGHTLY divide the word of truth and you are choosing to deny the deity of Jesus, despite many scriptures that show the contrary. It is obvious you cannot or will not accept what hypostasis is.
It's pretty simple really, for anyone who is NOT inculcated.
1Mind1Spirit
Literal lunatic
keypurr
Well-known member
Jesus functioned before his anointing.
But once the seed (Christ) was in him, they were one.
His job started.
I see not reason to separated them here or in Heaven.
Christ (seed) was given the fullness of his Father, he is a created form of God. Phil 2. He however is not God but a god, an agent, a servant son of the most high. He had power to lay the foundation of the Universe. Heb 1, Col 1.
keypurr
Well-known member
Your welcome my friend, I have posted this verse many times but most can not see what is in it.
Does that (in your mind) convince you of the fact, you're
a scholar and a genius? Perhaps, you ought to motivate
yourself to write a book on the subject? Maybe it would
become a best seller? One never knows? Give it a shot.
I'll wait until it ends up in the bargain bin and purchase
it on paperback. If I mail it to you, would you autograph
it? I'll send it to you, "postage paid."
I think KeyPurr would simply say that he can read basic and obvious text - as opposed to being a scholar or genius. Admittedly, that is all that it took in this instance.
Stan
I believe it is appropriate to address your observation of my condescending attitude and my lack of respect for you first. I have a strong sense of a spirit of arrogance from you - and that spirit tends to rankle me which tends to manifest in my wording (though I don't think I tried to "play nice"...). Admittedly, this may not be my best trait.
I don't want to move from the issue of Jesus anointing because if we can't get that straight, it would not make sense to delve into any of the other dozen or so standard cherry picked texts trins use their basis being of the same essence as His own God.
However, I will note the real issue - your denial of the man Christ Jesus - the Lord and Master who bought us. The Word of God teaches that Jesus is a man - not an impersonal human nature actuated by a deity as the hypostatic union teaches. The man Christ Jesus is clearly, repeatedly and formally taught in scripture. Below are the texts though I suspect you know them. How about reading through them and telling me what other conclusion someone could come to?
Explicit Statements that Jesus is a Man
Luke 24:19 And he said to them, “What things?” And they said to him, “Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, a man [ἀνὴρ] who was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people,
NOTE: Jesus did not chastise them because of errant Christology ….
John 1:30 This is he of whom I said, ‘After me comes a man [ἀνὴρ] who ranks before me, because he was before me.’
John 3:27 John answered and said, A man [ἄνθρωπος] can receive nothing except it is given him from the heaven.
John 8:40 but now you seek to kill me, a man [ἄνθρωπος] who has told you the truth that I heard from God.
Acts 2:22, 23 “Men [Aνδρες] of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man [ἄνδρα] and attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know— 23 this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men
Acts 17:30, 31 “The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent, 31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man [ἀνὴρ] whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”
Rom 5:15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if by the trespass of the one the many died, how much more did the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man [ἄνθρωπος] Jesus Christ abound unto the many.
I Cor 15:21 For as by [δι’] a man [ἄνθρωπος] came death, by [δι’] a man [ἄνθρωπος] has come also the resurrection of the dead.
I Cor 15:47 The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man [ἄνθρωπος] is from heaven
ὁ πρῶτος ἄνθρωπος ἐκ γῆς χοϊκός, ὁ δεύτερος ἄνθρωπος ἐξ οὐρανοῦ.
Phil 2:7, 8 7 but emptied himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in the likeness of men;
8 and being found in fashion as a man [ἄνθρωπος], he humbled himself, becoming obedient even unto death, yea, the death of the cross.
I Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man [ἄνθρωπος] Christ Jesus,
Zechariah 6:12,13 "And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the Lord of hosts, saying, Behold the man [אִ֞ישׁ (backwards)] whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the Lord:
Explicit Statements that Jesus was Created
Heb 2:10, 11
10 For it was fitting that he, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering. 11 For he who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one source. (ὅ τε γὰρ ἁγιάζων καὶ οἱ ἁγιαζόμενοι ὅ τε γὰρ ἁγιάζων καὶ οἱ ἁγιαζόμενοι ἐξ ἑνὸς πάντες ἑνὸς πάντες). See ICor 8:6 for sense of ἐξ as the ultimate creative source.
Implicit Statements Jesus is a Man (sense is “man” without using term “man”)
n Matthew 9:8, But when the multitudes saw it, they marveled, and glorified God, which had given such power to men.
ICor15:45 Thus it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit.
Heb 2:10 - 18
10 For it was fitting that he, for whom and by whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the founder of their salvation perfect through suffering. 11 For he who sanctifies and those who are sanctified all have one source. That is why he is not ashamed to call them brothers,
12 saying,
“I will tell of your name to my brothers;
in the midst of the congregation I will sing your praise.”
13 And again, “I will put my trust in him.”
And again, “Behold, I and the children God has given me.”
14 Since therefore the children share in flesh and blood, he himself likewise partook of the same things, that through death he might destroy the one who has the power of death, that is, the devil, 15 and deliver all those who through fear of death were subject to lifelong slavery. 16 For surely it is not angels that he helps, but he helps the offspring of Abraham. 17 Therefore he had to be made like his brothers in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For because he himself has suffered when tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted.
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How about making your posts a little shorter? Nobody will read all
of what you posted here.