Exactly, Jesus says we know them by their fruit.
That's the core of Jesus' love.
Was Jesus a man of color .
- Thread starter Bee1
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Exactly, Jesus says we know them by their fruit.
That's the core of Jesus' love.
glorydaz
Well-known member
All men sin and come short of the glory of God.
The wages of sin is death.
You figure it out.
God's Truth
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Do you not know that GOD is the one who said we must die physically because we sin?
God's Truth
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If you don't know what God feels like, you are not saved.
God's Truth
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That is why I showed you the scripture where Jesus calls Peter Satan. Peter wanted to stop Jesus from being sacrificed and killed.
Of course, murderers don’t please God, but God planned it that way. Jesus willingly did it.
WatchmanOnTheWall
Well-known member
You are in idolatry as your god is what you imagine rather than what is written.
marhig
Well-known member
Salvation isn't received through believing that Jesus died on the cross to save us. We are saved by the grace of God through faith once we hear the word and believe. And then we are to live it out and obey God and live by his will.
In Hebrews 12 it says this.
You have not yet resisted into blood striving against sin
This is the poured out life. Living right before God in our flesh and blood, striving against sin. This is the blood poured out. It's nothing to do with the natural blood of Jesus but the life he lived by baring witness to the truth, he came by water and by blood, (by the word of God and he lived it out in the flesh.) It says in the Bible that Jesus began to do and teach, he preached and lived by the commandments he was given of God and only spoke what the father gave him to speak, and he strived against sin and fought Satan on his own ground and won! And we need his life (his blood) within us, to cleanse and strengthen us by the power of the Holy Spirit to keep us alive in God. Without God and Christ, we can't overcome the world and we are still dead in our sins.
And I know I'm being saved, because if I wasn't being saved I'd still be loving the flesh and the things of this world and building up in it. But it means nothing to me anymore, I'm coming down in the world and letting go through Christ Jesus. And I love God first in my life before anyone or anything, and I follow Jesus from my heart not just with my mouth and I know that God is strengthening me to overcome. Without him I'd be still dead, but I'm not I'm alive in God and I know he's with me.
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marhig
Well-known member
So God planned to do something that doesn't please him?
Here he goes again...
marhig
Well-known member
That's being dead to God, not dead naturally.
marhig
Well-known member
Sin unto death, means that by carrying on wilfully sinning once we know the truth, we can then become dead to God.
WatchmanOnTheWall
Well-known member
Jesus had mastery over sin:
John 14:30 ►
I will not say much more to you, for the prince of this world is coming. He has no hold over me,
You are a retched sinner who sins daily in many ways both knowingly and unknowing. Just like the rest of us.
You humanise Jesus too much and totally ignore the main reason for His death. He was the Passover Lamb. He died at the same time the lambs were dying. The Israelite's had performed Passover for over 1500 years as a prophetic foreshadowing and preparation of this event. Jesus death and resurrection was the greatest event in all history. His death gave mankind a way to get into Heaven where there was no way before.
marhig
Well-known member
Can you not see the he was a living sacrifice? He laid down his life for others and to live by the will of God, bringing us the truth through the gospel. Bringing us a new a living way to follow.
Why did God need Jesus to die on a cross so save us from his own wrath? And to those who believe that Jesus is God, then that means God came from heaven to be crucified by men under the influence of Satan to save us from his own wrath???
Why? That makes no sense at all?
And Jesus clearly says that it was done under the power of darkness, is God darkness?
Also, how did Jesus have mastery over sin?
WatchmanOnTheWall
Well-known member
That's because you are thinking in modern worldly terms. What you must understand is when Adam sinned it broke trust with God. Adam had no way of getting that trust back, he had literally nothing that he could give God to make up for it and could do nothing to make up for it. The only thing he could do is die to prove how sorry he was but there was no honourable way to die to prove this. God then gave them an example of what Adam could do and that was to offer a sacrifice and God sacrificed an animal from which He made their garments from the hide. This was the first sacrifice and from then sacrificial offerings were the way to say sorry to God in the hope trust would be restored. After 4000 years of various sacrificial 'systems' Jesus was the ultimate fulfilment of this and was what God needed in order to be satisfied that the payment for the original sin of Adam (and all mankind's sins) were settled.
You may not think this make sense but think, say you had a crime commited against you and the judge let the criminal off without any punishment. Would that be fair, no, of course not. Sin must be punished or recompense made. Jesus' death is our recompense and Jesus took our punishment. God was satisfied because Jesus was sinless and was therefore the best of the 'flock' just like the lambs that were chosen at Passover had to be the best of the flock without defect.
You are refering to:
Luke 22:53
“Every day I was with you in the temple courts and you did not lay a hand on me. But this is your hour--when darkness reigns."
This thread explains what Jesus really meant by that statement: http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...3-nights-in-the-Heart-of-the-Earth&highlight=
He was God, God can not sin.
marhig
Well-known member
The animal sacrifices in the old testament were the natural, the sacrifice of Jesus was spiritual. Meaning he didn't naturally die to save us, he was put to death by the power of the Spirit. A living sacrifice, dead to self will, but alive in God, and he was born of God in the womb, we have to be put to death once we enter in to the covenant through the blood of the lamb, that's through his life, a life without a spot or blemish of sin and a garment woven from the top to the bottom that couldn't be corrupted. and those who belong to God are to live it out and follow him, and be covered and strengthened by him, and because he has overcome the world, he can help us to overcome too.
You are looking at everything naturally not spiritually, Paul is talking in the Spirit, and the cross of Christ is the cross Jesus bore, it's foolishness to those that perish because they love the flesh and don't want to bare their cross and partake in Christ's sufferings.
How can people not see that to kill Jesus pleased not God? Even Paul says it, and he is the one who people say preached about the cross.
It's their hour and the power of darkness is because they were under the influence of Satan. Jesus said that the devil was their father, not God. And they did that wicked act under the power of Satan who is the prince of darkness. Jesus could have turned away and turned from the cross, but he has to go through it to overcome Satan, if he had of walked away, Satan would have won and overcome him. But by suffering everything set before him and baring it and showing love and forgiveness in return right up until his last breath, Jesus overcame Satan and this world, he couldn't touch him. Jesus was tempted as we are, and he could have sinned, but he didn't he resisted the devil all the way to the end. If Jesus couldn't have sinned, then he wasn't likened to his brethren in every way. But he was likened to his brethren, he says himself he was a man, so that means that he could sin like a man, but because he turned from sin, God gave him the power over all flesh, just as he gives us the power over the flesh through Christ by the power of the Spirit if we turn away from sin and live by his will.
Jesus was saving though the gospel by the word of God, and God was within him reconciling the world into himself through Christ by the ministry of reconciliation, he didn't need to die to save, he was saving in his lifetime.
The death in the cross was part of the cup that he suffered, and in doing so and not sinning, he overcame everything that Satan did to him, he couldn't get Jesus to hate, or sin, no matter what he did to him, even crucifying him.
I will look at the thread you have posted a link to later, I'm just on my way out. Speak soon God willing
WatchmanOnTheWall
Well-known member
The animal sacrifices in the old testament were the natural, the sacrifice of Jesus was spiritual. Meaning he didn't naturally die to save us, he was put to death by the power of the Spirit. A living sacrifice, dead to self will, but alive in God, and he was born of God in the womb, we have to be put to death once we enter in to the covenant through the blood of the lamb, that's through his life, a life without a spot or blemish of sin and a garment woven from the top to the bottom that couldn't be corrupted. and those who belong to God are to live it out and follow him, and be covered and strengthened by him, and because he has overcome the world, he can help us to overcome too.
You are looking at everything naturally not spiritually, Paul is talking in the Spirit, and the cross of Christ is the cross Jesus bore, it's foolishness to those that perish because they love the flesh and don't want to bare their cross and partake in Christ's sufferings.
How can people not see that to kill Jesus pleased not God? Even Paul says it, and he is the one who people say preached about the cross.
It's their hour and the power of darkness is because they were under the influence of Satan. Jesus said that the devil was their father, not God. And they did that wicked act under the power of Satan who is the prince of darkness. Jesus could have turned away and turned from the cross, but he has to go through it to overcome Satan, if he had of walked away, Satan would have won and overcome him. But by suffering everything set before him and baring it and showing love and forgiveness in return right up until his last breath, Jesus overcame Satan and this world, he couldn't touch him. Jesus was tempted as we are, and he could have sinned, but he didn't he resisted the devil all the way to the end. If Jesus couldn't have sinned, then he wasn't likened to his brethren in every way. But he was likened to his brethren, he says himself he was a man, so that means that he could sin like a man, but because he turned from sin, God gave him the power over all flesh, just as he gives us the power over the flesh through Christ by the power of the Spirit if we turn away from sin and live by his will.
Jesus was saving though the gospel by the word of God, and God was within him reconciling the world into himself through Christ by the ministry of reconciliation, he didn't need to die to save, he was saving in his lifetime.
The death in the cross was part of the cup that he suffered, and in doing so and not sinning, he overcame everything that Satan did to him, he couldn't get Jesus to hate, or sin, no matter what he did to him, even crucifying him.
I will look at the thread you have posted a link to later, I'm just on my way out. Speak soon God willing
No one was saved before His death and resurrection. Your theology is off. Here is another thread for you: http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?128427-What-ever-happened-to/page5
Bee1
New member
If there was some type of physical evidence , with out of doubt proof that this man lived and died, do you know what that means to Christianity...churchs across the world will be filled to standing room only . What he roughly looked like would be very important to his existence.
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glorydaz
Well-known member
Sin earns death. Jesus died for sin. You say He didn't need to die.
That means your sins are not paid for, and you will have to pay for them yourself.
Are you the one who makes the rules now?
Your being sorry sure won't pay the penalty for your sins.
The wages of sin is death....as opposed to eternal life.
God's Truth
New member
There are people who still would not believe.
It doesn't matter what Jesus looked like.
If it mattered, God would have made sure there was an image.
We cannot emphasize this enough because it has been dismissed by many churches, like watchman is doing.