United Methodist Savage-Dammann

[Poly]

Originally posted by Jabez

The more i think about it Turbo has a good point...

I agree. Turbo has explained this perfectly. Unfortunately the willful ignorance of some on this board will never cease to amaze me.

 

[st4him]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

I apologize. My sarcasm got the best of me. By no means am I arguing that "we" (people already in the church) should "let in anyone." Your examples point out the real issue: how do we "determine" when someone is "living" in sin, that is they commit the same sins over and over to the point where it is a lifestyle.

Believe it or not I am fairly "conservative" on the whole "gay" issue in this country and especially in the church. It breaks my heart that the UMC and other churches struggle with this issue so much. But as I said before I am afraid I am on the "losing side."

I admit I was getting a little testy on this thread because I listened to Enyart spew forth venom against the UMC for 20 minutes, and I heard very little, in any, of Christ in his tirade.

Apology accepted. I understand how emotions can get the better of us. It happens to me far to often (especially when talking to "christians" in the workplace or such that have no care for theology- It's the study of God!! How can a Christian not care!!!).
But I digress...as far as Enyart goes, again I don't blame you. I don't know much about him, so I can not go into detail, but everything I have seen from him is SCARY. Who is this man and how can we stop him from doing damage to the Church?! :bang:


In His service,
st4Him

 

[Servo]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

Sorry, damage is already done. Bob should repent.

Originally posted by Freak

Yes, he should. :up:

Have you two knuckleheads even bothered to listen to the show?

BTW Freak, Bob's # is 1-800-836-9278. Call anytime.

 

[Christine]

Originally posted by Freak

UnChristian, hardly, as they believe in the same triune God we do.

http://www.umc.org/interior.asp?mid=1629

I didn't say that their doctrinal statement isn't similiar to more evangelical churches. Most Methodsits probably have no idea what their doctrine is.

In fact, their offical website denounces homosexuality.

Since the practice of homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teaching, self-avowed practicing homosexuals are not to be accepted as candidates, ordained as ministers, or appointed to serve in The United Methodist Church.

http://www.umc.org/interior.asp?ptid=1&mid=1324

That's right. They say it's incompatible. That's not the same as saying it's a sin. As a result, using that reasoning, they let this lesbian keep her position :down:

Perhaps some better research, on your part, would dismiss your confusion.

My mother was saved in the Methodist church and her little brother is a UMC pastor. Many of her sibllings still attend UMC chrurches. I have seen what it has done for them, left them without a good defense of the faith, and some without salvation. My only advice to them is to get out.

 

[cur_deus_homo]

Originally posted by Shimei

Have you two knuckleheads even bothered to listen to the show?

Uh, duh. I see you haven't read my posts on this board or even the one just before the one where you ask this question where I was quoted as stating that "I listened to Enyart spew forth venom against the UMC for 20 minutes, and I heard very little, in any, of Christ in his tirade."

Got anything to contribute, or are you going to attempt to defend the indefensible?

 

[Jefferson]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo
I listened to Enyart spew forth venom against the UMC for 20 minutes, and I heard very little, in any, of Christ in his tirade.

So call him on his show and tell him what you think of him. 1-800-836-9278 Monday-Friday 5:00-5:30 Eastern.

 

[cur_deus_homo]

Originally posted by Jefferson

So call him on his show and tell him what you think of him. 1-800-836-9278 Monday-Friday 5:00-5:30 Eastern.

No thanks. I don't care to join him as he wallows in the mud of hatred and self-righteousness.

 

[Jefferson]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

No thanks. I don't care to join him as he wallows in the mud of hatred and self-righteousness.

Coward.

 

[cur_deus_homo]

Originally posted by Jefferson

Coward.

Go ahead, call me a few more names before Fellowship Week!

 

[Turbo]

Originally posted by Turbo

You could call him off the air to confront him, and if he won't repent, you could then call on the air and rebuke him publicly.


Originally posted by Freak

Give me his personal number and I will. I promise you this.

So, how did he respond to your rebuke?

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by Christine

I didn't say that their doctrinal statement isn't similiar to more evangelical churches. Most Methodsits probably have no idea what their doctrine is.

And this is based on what objective study?

That's right. They say it's incompatible. That's not the same as saying it's a sin. As a result, using that reasoning, they let this lesbian keep her position.

Re-read their social statements for they do in fact consider homosexuality as a sin.

My mother was saved in the Methodist church and her little brother is a UMC pastor. Many of her sibllings still attend UMC chrurches.

Imagine that, people getting saved in the Methodist church. People do get saved in other churches besides yours.

I have seen what it has done for them, left them without a good defense of the faith, and some without salvation. My only advice to them is to get out.

My advice for you is this: Research first then post. For it's apparent you don't have a clue on what's going on.

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by Turbo

So, how did he respond to your rebuke?

He hasn't responded here on TOL to my rebuke. But, I will call him and hope he repents. I'll give you a report, ok?

 

[Jabez]

Originally posted by Freak

He hasn't responded here on TOL to my rebuke. But, I will call him and hope he repents. I'll give you a report, ok?

Iam looking forward to see what happens..

 

[Turbo]

Originally posted by Freak

He hasn't responded here on TOL to my rebuke.

As I said weeks ago, he most likely hasn't seen it. He's not exactly a regular here.

But, I will call him ...

Will that be in the near future?

I'll give you a report, ok?

OK.

 

[Christine]

Originally posted by Freak

And this is based on what objective study?

I guess. I've known lots of UMC's that act as if issues such as creation vs. evolution, salvation (how you get to heaven, whether or not you need to be born again), and other very important issues don't matter. While I understand that growth is not necesssary for salvation, they should not remain babes forever. If they stay in the UMC they will remain babes.

Re-read their social statements for they do in fact consider homosexuality as a sin.

Then they aren't being very consistent in allowing that "lady pastor" to keep her position. Doesn't it almost seem that if they say it's a sin, that they would be using a double standard?

Imagine that, people getting saved in the Methodist church.

Yes, it can happen, but not very often, and that was over 20 years ago. Now it's even more liberal, and even less chance of someone getting saved.

People do get saved in other churches besides yours.

Good, because I don't attend church.

My advice for you is this: Research first then post. For it's apparent you don't have a clue on what's going on.

What about yourself, are you willing to research and see that the UMC is one of the most liberal denominations in America?

 

[JoyfulRook]

OK, he was saying that the United Methodists are for the most part going straight to hell, (Bill Clinton, Hitlery Clinton). He does not believe (and neither do I) that ALL United Methodists that are going to hell. Just most of them

And Lezbian Pastors aren't helping any :flamer:

 

[Servo]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

Uh, duh. I see you haven't read my posts on this board or even the one just before the one where you ask this question where I was quoted as stating that "I listened to Enyart spew forth venom against the UMC for 20 minutes, and I heard very little, in any, of Christ in his tirade."

Got anything to contribute, or are you going to attempt to defend the indefensible?

Sorry _homo, I forgot about post 13 of 76. If you actually listened to the show, I think you could understand the context if which Enyart was referring to "ALL".

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by Christine

I guess. I've known lots of UMC's that act as if issues such as creation vs. evolution, salvation (how you get to heaven, whether or not you need to be born again), and other very important issues don't matter. While I understand that growth is not necesssary for salvation, they should not remain babes forever. If they stay in the UMC they will remain babes.

This based on your personal experience. Well, I'm telling you from personal experience what you say isn't true.

Then they aren't being very consistent in allowing that "lady pastor" to keep her position. Doesn't it almost seem that if they say it's a sin, that they would be using a double standard?

Humans are imperfect creations and human organizations are imperfect too. The facts are what they are--the UMC does not endorse homosexuality.

Yes, it can happen, but not very often, and that was over 20 years ago. Now it's even more liberal, and even less chance of someone getting saved.

I think I can speak as more of a authority then yourself on this subject as I attended a Methodist Church for nearly 20 years and have family going back several generations who attended UMC churches. Furthermore...I have spoken in dozens of UMC churches across the world and can attest that many of them still proclaim the gospel.

Good, because I don't attend church.

If you're saved by Jesus then you are the church--the member of the Body of Christ.

What about yourself, are you willing to research and see that the UMC is one of the most liberal denominations in America?

Look, you've shown yourself as one who hasn't studied the issue. I have proven to you via their offical website that they do in fact embrace every essential of the Christian Faith. You have yet proven where this isn't the case except to share some family stories. :down:

 

[cur_deus_homo]

Originally posted by Shimei

Sorry _homo, I forgot about post 13 of 76. If you actually listened to the show, I think you could understand the context if which Enyart was referring to "ALL".

That's quite OK. And, yes, I did understand the context, the context being a 20-minute tirade about how 8.5 million people aren't Christian and are "ALL" going to hell.

 

[cur_deus_homo]

Originally posted by Dread Helm

He does not believe (and neither do I) that ALL United Methodists that are going to hell. Just most of them

If he doesn't believe that then why did he say that we are "ALL" going to hell?