United Methodist Savage-Dammann

[Jefferson]

United Methodist Savage-Dammann

Friday March 26th, 2004. This is show #62.

 

[Jefferson]

BEST QUOTE OF THE SHOW:

When this country was founded...and Thomas Jefferson was the governor of Virginia. Do you know what the law of the land was back then? That a homosexual, if convicted, would be put to death. . . .

Now that we've accepted homosexuality - it's now legal and acceptable - how many people die these days from homosexuality world wide? Millions? And how many were we putting to death in the first hundred years of America with the pilgrims? I can't remember one in recorded American history. I don't know of one. I've never heard of one. Yet potentially millions were saved from the tortured life and death of being a homosexual because the law said, "Don't be a homosexual." And there was zero tolerance toward homosexuality.

So God's law was merciful and has saved countless millions throughout history. Man's compassion is wicked and has led to utter distruction of so many.

 

[Greywolf]

Originally posted by Jefferson
BEST QUOTE OF THE SHOW:
When this country was founded...and Thomas Jefferson was the governor of Virginia. Do you know what the law of the land was back then? That a homosexual, if convicted, would be put to death. . . .

Appeal to Tradition

Now that we've accepted homosexuality - it's now legal and acceptable - how many people die these days from homosexuality world wide? Millions? And how many were we putting to death in the first hundred years of America with the pilgrims? I can't remember one in recorded American history. I don't know of one. I've never heard of one. Yet potentially millions were saved from the tortured life and death of being a homosexual because the law said, "Don't be a homosexual." And there was zero tolerance toward homosexuality.

No one has ever died because of homosexuality. People die becuase they sleep with people who have STD's, which is not unique to homosexuality. I also don't see why Bob keeps acting like all homosexuals are miserable. I've seen no indication that they are.

So God's law was merciful and has saved countless millions throughout history. Man's compassion is wicked and has led to utter distruction of so many.

I think I'll make a law. My law is that we should all spend our lives curled up in a fetal position in a corner in our houses, only leaving the house when absolutely necessary. If everyone were to follow that rule, then I bet that the fatality and crime rates everywhere would plumit. My law could save countless millions. But no, the wicked people have to go and disobey me.

 

[st4him]

What does this have to do with United Methodists?

 

[Christine]

Maybe it has something to do with their lesbian "pastor" that they recently said could keep her job.

 

[Zakath]

Let's play historical revisionism, Bob Enyart style...

When this country was founded...and Thomas Jefferson was the governor of Virginia.

Actually Jefferson was not governor of Virginia until 1779. Patrick Henry was governor in 1776.

Do you know what the law of the land was back then? That a homosexual, if convicted, would be put to death. . . .

There was no "law of the land" since the U.S. Code did not exist. Each state (former colony) maintained their own laws.

• Virginia had no sodomy law of its own (previously it had held British law) until 1792. In 1810, Virginia eliminated the death penalty for sodomy for free people, but kept it for slaves. The death penalty was eliminated for slaves in 1860. Jefferson, by the way, opposed the death penalty for sodomy...
• In 1821, Connecticut eliminated the death penalty for sodomy.
• In 1812, New Hampshire eliminated the death penalty for sodomy.
• In 1805, Massachusetts eliminated the death penalty for sodomy. Only one execution was ever recorded as being ordered in Massachusetts for sodomy and the record is unclear as to whether the sentence was actually carried out.
• In Georgia, sodomy was legal throughout the colonial period and not outlawed until 1833 when it was classified as a misdemeanor. Georgia never had the death penalty for sodomy.
• In New Jersey, there was a death penalty for sodomy until 1796 when the penalty was reduced to inprisonment.
• In New York, the death penalty for sodomy was eliminated in 1796.
• North Carolina eliminated the death penalty for sodomy in 1861.
• Maryland operated under English Law for 161 year and there are only three recorded cases tried under sodomy statues. None resulted in the death penalty. In 1793, the penalty for sodomy conviction was set to fine and imprisonment.
• Pennsylvania was the only colony to have been founded without a death penalty for sodomy when practiced by whites. English Law, carrying the death penalty was put in place in 1693 and reduced to imprisonment in 1694. Blacks were subject to the death penalty from 1700. In 1718, English Law was again put into place, making sodomy a capital crime. In 1786, after the only execution for sodomy in the colony's history (1785), the penalty for sodomy was reduced to fine and imprisonment.
• South Carolina eliminated the death penalty for sodomy in 1869, though the capital punishment provisions appear to have been ignored for years prior to the repeal.
• Vermont, following British Law, eliminated the death penalty for sodomy in 1861 when Britain did.
• Delaware eliminated capital punishment for felony in 1826.

[Source]

 

[Jefferson]

Originally posted by st4him

What does this have to do with United Methodists?

Here's the pertinent United Methodist quote from the show:

If you attend a United Methodist church it's not too late. You can escape and go instead to a Christian church. Look for a Christian church instead of a United Methodist church. Does it sound Christian? United Methodist. You know you've got the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. United Methodist. What does that mean? Is that Christian? United Methodist. Here's what it means: They're all together going to Hell. Any method will do. What do you have to do to get to Hell? Nothing. You're already going. So they're united all together going to Hell on the wide road to Hell.

 

[Greywolf]

Bob's vision must be going, he seems to have missed the second part of United Methodist.

Meth·od·ist
A member of an evangelical Protestant church founded on the principles of John and Charles Wesley in England in the early 18th century and characterized by active concern with social welfare and public morals.

 

[cur_deus_homo]

If you attend a United Methodist church it's not too late. You can escape and go instead to a Christian church. Look for a Christian church instead of a United Methodist church. Does it sound Christian? United Methodist. You know you've got the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. United Methodist. What does that mean? Is that Christian? United Methodist. Here's what it means: They're all together going to Hell. Any method will do. What do you have to do to get to Hell? Nothing. You're already going. So they're united all together going to Hell on the wide road to Hell.

:darwinsm: :chuckle: :kookoo: :ha: :devil:

Hey, Bob, read Romans 2.

'nuff said.

 

[Freak]

Enyart declared:

"United Methodist. What does that mean? Is that Christian? United Methodist. Here's what it means: They're all together going to Hell. Any method will do. What do you have to do to get to Hell? Nothing. You're already going. So they're united all together going to Hell on the wide road to Hell."

Enyart is obviously in error as the United Methodists embrace the the triune God, the deity of Christ, justification by faith, etc. His remark, "They're all going to hell" is a lie. Some are but not all. This kind of sloppy broadcasting is uncalled for. Many Methodists love Jesus and serve Him. It's clear Enyart is bordering on cultic behavior by exclaiming lies, like he has done here. :down:

 

[Jabez]

Originally posted by Freak

Enyart declared:

"United Methodist. What does that mean? Is that Christian? United Methodist. Here's what it means: They're all together going to Hell. Any method will do. What do you have to do to get to Hell? Nothing. You're already going. So they're united all together going to Hell on the wide road to Hell."

Enyart is obviously in error as the United Methodists embrace the the triune God, the deity of Christ, justification by faith, etc. His remark, "They're all going to hell" is a lie. Some are but not all. This kind of sloppy broadcasting is uncalled for. Many Methodists love Jesus and serve Him. It's clear Enyart is bordering on cultic behavior by exclaiming lies, like he has done here. :down:

If indeed he said that,he is wrong.

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by Jabez

If indeed he said that,he is wrong.

Yes, he is wrong. Not all Methodists are hell-bound. My grandmother is a Methodist yet she believes justification is by faith alone in Christ. She has received Christ and has served Him for 50 years.

Enyart, repent of your slander. Making false and malicious statements or reports is uncalled for. :down:

 

[cur_deus_homo]

I wanted to hear Bob for myself, so I listened to the audio file. Sure enough, at the end of his remarks on the UMC Friday March 26th, 2004 (show #62) he said the very words quoted previously, namely "They're all together going to Hell."

I've said it before on TOL and I'll say it again. All United Methodists please repeat after me the enduring words of Huck Finn, "All right, then, I'll go to hell." Oh, sorry, Bob, that comes from perhaps the greatest American writer ever to set word to paper. For you, Bob, that means it comes from "post-New Testament writings."

Bob also made the phenomenally insightful comment that "Jesus never quoted the New Testament."

Until I started posting here I didn't know a thing about Bob. Now I think I know enough to feel truly sad and sorry for all of the people that listen to him and attend his church.

As for Bob himself, who talked about how United Methodists evidently don't read Romans because it's "too long" and then talked only about Romans chapter one, this United Methodist suggests Bob read the chapter after chapter one, that would be chapter two. Don't take anything for granted.

(OK, so my previous post wasn't "'nuff said.")

 

[Christine]

Originally posted by Greywolf

Bob's vision must be going, he seems to have missed the second part of United Methodist.

Greywolf: My mom is from a large UMC family. I know for a fact that they don't put the emphasis on salvation like most evangelical churches.
Why, there was even an 80 some year old man (UMC) on his death bed, the minister came over to comfort him, but would not, or did not, present the plan of salvation to the man. The man is now facing eternal judgment. That's not just an isolated case either. I know of several Methodists that, contrary to the mainstream Christian belief, believe that salvation is not taught in the Bible. They say that being "born again" is never mentioned in the Bible.
Don't get me wrong, I know some great Methodists which are more than likely saved, but I strongly believe they should get out of the Methodist church as soon as possible. It is surely a sin to stay in a church that promotes sodomy, communism, and other anti-Christian ideas. By staying in, they are standing with the UMC and saying that they promote what the UMC is doing.

 

[Zakath]

Well, perhaps it is a good thing that St. Bob the Broadcaster isn't in charge of deciding who flies and who fries after they dies...

(or does he think he is? :think: )

 

[Greywolf]

Originally posted by Zakath
Well, perhaps it is a good thing that St. Bob the Broadcaster isn't in charge of deciding who flies and who fries after they dies...

(or does he think he is? :think: )

Nah. That's beast's job.
http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=465649#post465649

 

[Zakath]

I'm beginning to think there's a long line of folks who think it's their perogative to make that decision. :chuckle:

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

I wanted to hear Bob for myself, so I listened to the audio file. Sure enough, at the end of his remarks on the UMC Friday March 26th, 2004 (show #62) he said the very words quoted previously, namely "They're all together going to Hell."

We know Enyart is now a slanderer...

Bob also made the phenomenally insightful comment that "Jesus never quoted the New Testament."

You got to be kidding me. :crackup:

Until I started posting here I didn't know a thing about Bob. Now I think I know enough to feel truly sad and sorry for all of the people that listen to him and attend his church.

Me too. :think:

 

[Turbo]

Originally posted by cur_deus_homo

I wanted to hear Bob for myself, so I listened to the audio file. Sure enough, at the end of his remarks on the UMC Friday March 26th, 2004 (show #62) he said the very words quoted previously, namely "They're all together going to Hell."

:sigh: "All" quite commonly doesn't mean "each and every, without exception," even in Scripture. It's a figure of speech, a type of hyperbole. People use it all the time.

Bob also made the phenomenally insightful comment that "Jesus never quoted the New Testament."

He started out discussing many of the New Testament passages in which homosexuality is condemned, because many dismiss the Old Testamet, saying things like, "Oh, that was the Old Testament." Bob pointed out that Jesus often quoted the Old Testament as God's authoritative word. The comment that He never quoted the New was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

As for Bob himself, who talked about how United Methodists evidently don't read Romans because it's "too long" and then talked only about Romans chapter one, this United Methodist suggests Bob read the chapter after chapter one, that would be chapter two. Don't take anything for granted.

Romans vol. I, II, III

He doesn't spend all 18 hours examining the first chapter.

 

[Freak]

Originally posted by Turbo

:sigh: "All" quite commonly doesn't mean "each and every, without exception," even in Scripture. It's a figure of speech, a type of hyperbole. People use it all the time.

Does that mean what Enyart said was ok? After all, it's just hyperbole, right? :kookoo: