toldailytopic: Shooting at the Arizona Safeway. How could we help prevent tragic even

[Nydhogg]

I meant pistols.

Typically people refer to a semi-automatic pistol as a handgun and to a revolver as a revolver.

That's why I said it that way. I'm sorry if I looked like an idiot.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

How does the mainstream media sleep at night? If you watch NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, etc you would think the shooter was a right wing nutball instead of the left wing wacko that he really was.

It's amazing how irresponsible the mainstream media is.

 

[Ktoyou]

Actually they do, when it's coupled with social change that makes ownership of guns a taboo. I think I only know one person who owns a gun, for hunting. If you take this argument ad absurdium then you can legalise anything, such as carrying firearms onto planes, or having abortions, or etc. The idea that 'someone, somewhere, might break the law' is sufficient to legalise it, then why have any laws to start off with?

Shootings of this scale are far rarer in countries with tighter gun legislation. In the UK, 0.17 people per 100,000 die from being shot, with a murder rate of 1.28/100,000 overall. Knife crime accounts for the highest category of weapons leading to fatalities. In the US, there is a murder rate of 5.0/100,000 with firearms being the main cause of death.

The UK has probably the strictest gun crime laws in the world, and there is a link between gun crime and murders.

The most recent attempted assassination was when an MP was stabbed last year. The MP survived and no one else was injured. Before that, the only thing I can think of is the Grand Hotel Bombing, Brighton, in which 5 people died.

This is not to say of course, that the UK is perfect, which it definitely isn't. It has one of the highest crime rates in the EU. However, gun crime is mercifully low.

What are you crabbing about?

Have you read, "Life at the Bottom: The Worldview that Makes the Underclass"

"The combination of relativism and antipathy to traditional culture has played a large part in creating the underclass, thus turning Britain from a class to a caste society. ... Henceforth what they had and what they did was as good as anything, because all cultures and all cultural artifacts are equal. Aspiration was therefore pointless: and thus they have been immobilized in their poverty -- material, mental, and spiritual -- as completely as the damned in Dante's Inferno. Having in large part created this underclass, the British intelligentsia, guilty about its own allegedly undemocratic antecedents, feels obliged to flatter it by imitation and has persuaded the rest of the middle class to do likewise." :dizzy:

Well, at least there is no gun problem, right? Wonderful.

 

[Alate_One]

How does the mainstream media sleep at night? If you watch NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, etc you would think the shooter was a right wing nutball instead of the left wing wacko that he really was.

It's amazing how irresponsible the mainstream media is.

Lets be real here, the guy was NUTS. I am not sure we can really ascribe "left or right" to someone that thinks the government is engaging in mind control through the use of GRAMMAR. :kookoo: We do know he was anti-government, and the loudest howls against government lately have come from the right.

And it wasn't members of the left that had to go out and remove statements that implied violence from their websites . . .

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Lets be real here, the guy was NUTS. I am not sure we can really ascribe "left or right"

Why not just believe the people who knew him?

 

[MaryContrary]

Lets be real here, the guy was NUTS. I am not sure we can really ascribe "left or right" to someone that thinks the government is engaging in mind control through the use of GRAMMAR. :kookoo: We do know he was anti-government, and the loudest howls against government lately have come from the right.

And it wasn't members of the left that had to go out and remove statements that implied violence from their websites . . .

They should never have taken it down. Anyone who sees that pic as promoting violence is a complete moron. One shouldn't cater to morons.

 

[Alate_One]

Pass a law that requires that all citizens twenty years old and upward must carry a loaded firearm and at least 20 rounds of amunition whenever they are not in their home. This solution will make for a safer and freer country.

This is short sighted and moronic. Firing a weapon in a populated area has a high chance of hitting innocent bystanders as much as anyone causing a crime. We have trained people that carry guns, they're called police.

Plus the type of weapon that was used in the crime, hit 20 people in about 10 seconds. No one could react fast enough to stop him. The only thing that stopped him was having to reload. There was a young man carrying a gun on the scene, he was only able to help tackle the guy after he was already subdued. The public does not need access to the kind of firepower that can kill so many people in such a short period of time.

 

[genuineoriginal]

I would rather go to prison than own a firearm. Particularly one to be carried in public.

The penalty would not be imprisonment, it would be loss of citizenship.

 

[Persephone66]

You can't prevent crazy.

 

[Alate_One]

They should never have taken it down. Anyone who sees that pic as promoting violence is a complete moron. One shouldn't cater to morons.

Looks like crosshairs to me, but if that doesn't convince you how about Sharon Angle's statements on a radio show?

Angle: I feel that the Second Amendment is the right to keep and bear arms for our citizenry. This not for someone who's in the military. This not for law enforcement. This is for us. And in fact when you read that Constitution and the founding fathers, they intended this to stop tyranny. This is for us when our government becomes tyrannical... Manders: If we needed it at any time in history, it might be right now. Angle: Well it's to defend ourselves. And you know, I'm hoping that we're not getting to Second Amendment remedies. I hope the vote will be the cure for the Harry Reid problems.

I can get plenty more examples. Show us recent examples from the left. I am honestly interested in seeing if the "both sides do it" mantra is actually true.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Actually they do, when it's coupled with social change that makes ownership of guns a taboo. I think I only know one person who owns a gun, for hunting. If you take this argument ad absurdium then you can legalise anything, such as carrying firearms onto planes, or having abortions, or etc. The idea that 'someone, somewhere, might break the law' is sufficient to legalise it, then why have any laws to start off with?

Shootings of this scale are far rarer in countries with tighter gun legislation. In the UK, 0.17 people per 100,000 die from being shot, with a murder rate of 1.28/100,000 overall. Knife crime accounts for the highest category of weapons leading to fatalities. In the US, there is a murder rate of 5.0/100,000 with firearms being the main cause of death.

The UK has probably the strictest gun crime laws in the world, and there is a link between gun crime and murders.

The most recent attempted assassination was when an MP was stabbed last year. The MP survived and no one else was injured. Before that, the only thing I can think of is the Grand Hotel Bombing, Brighton, in which 5 people died.

This is not to say of course, that the UK is perfect, which it definitely isn't. It has one of the highest crime rates in the EU. However, gun crime is mercifully low.

During the reign of Vladimer Tepes, the crime rate was the lowest recorded in history.
Of course, the reason the crime rate was so low was the number of impaled criminals on the side of the road at every entrance to a town...

 

[Persephone66]

How does the mainstream media sleep at night? If you watch NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, etc you would think the shooter was a right wing nutball instead of the left wing wacko that he really was.

It's amazing how irresponsible the mainstream media is.

From what I could tell, he had an interest in both extremes.

 

[genuineoriginal]

This is short sighted and moronic. Firing a weapon in a populated area has a high chance of hitting innocent bystanders as much as anyone causing a crime. We have trained people that carry guns, they're called police.

You must like seeing jackboots stomping on a human face.

 

[Alate_One]

You must like seeing jackboots stomping on a human face.

Better than seeing a bullet go through one . . .

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I can get plenty more examples. Show us recent examples from the left. I am honestly interested in seeing if the "both sides do it" mantra is actually true.

Why are you even bringing this up? The shooter was clearly a left wing lunatic.

You are no different than the left wing mainstream media, attempting to deflect/hide the fact that the guy was on your side.

I don't understand why you do that. When right wing nutjob does something stupid I don't try and hide it, I ask for his execution just the same yet acknowledge that he was a right winger gone astray.

Why are you so afraid to acknowledge the obvious truth?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Better than seeing a bullet go through one . . .

Enjoy the Zyklon B.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I can get plenty more examples. Show us recent examples from the left. I am honestly interested in seeing if the "both sides do it" mantra is actually true.

You mean like this?

ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, never made much about this?

 

[Sherman]

How does the mainstream media sleep at night? If you watch NBC, ABC, CBS, CNN, etc you would think the shooter was a right wing nutball instead of the left wing wacko that he really was.

It's amazing how irresponsible the mainstream media is.

One would think the mainstream media is filled with beanie brains the way they spin doctor everything.

Here are the facts about this shooter and infer what you will from it.
1. He was a fan of Adolf Hitler's Mein Kampf
2. He was a fan of Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels' Communist Manifesto.
3. He was a marijuana smoker. Sorry dopers.
4. Disqualified from service for having drugs in his system.
5. Arrested in October 2007 for possesion of drug paraphernalia.
6. He is an Atheist.
7. He is mentally ill-probably schizophrenic.
8. He is leftist
9. He was obsessed with Giffords.
10. He practiced 'conscience dreaming'
11. Oh and yes, he was obsessed with the 2012 Mayan prophecy.

A regular fruitcake if you ask me.

 

[The Barbarian]

Its ironic that on the news this morning they were complaining about the political climate in the US, and then blaming Palin for this shooting.

Putting crosshairs on one's political opponents has consequences, yes. Remember the congresswoman who was shot had her office vandalized not long after Palin suggested "reloading" and "taking out" those she had targeted.

Palin isn't the only one guilty; she's just one of the more egregious examples of promoting violence.

You may remember that a couple of nutcases were arrested after they took seriously some talk about taking President Bush out. Fortunately, they didn't do anything but talk about doing it on the net.

The fact that she took down the page, and one of her advisors tried to present the cross-hairs as surveying images, pretty much shows she understood what it was all about. If some democrat did that to republican congressman, and a nutcase took them seriously, imagine what Palin would be doing.

She'd be screaming her head off about democrats assassinating republicans.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Putting crosshairs on one's political opponents has consequences, yes. Remember the congresswoman who was shot had her office vandalized not long after Palin suggested "reloading" and "taking out" those she had targeted.

Yet it turns out the guy was a flaming lefty so blaming Palin is obviously in error.