toldailytopic: Many paths to God? Or just one?

[John Mortimer]

Indeed,...for where 'God' is omni-present.... there is no 'getting' to...or even moving away from 'God', in reality. There is no getting 'God'....or 'away' from 'God'. Truth or Reality is pathless. - only to a sensing-mind perceiving thru the relativity-distortion of space and time....is there there what appears to be 'seperation', 'space', 'time', 'distance', 'lack', etc. In the omnipresence of 'God'.....All forever is.

It must be love! :chuckle:

It struck me as I read that, "This is really powerful for transmuting fear".

"Perfect love casts out fear".

Once this is understood,....the second question is answered upon the existential premise of the nature of 'God' itself, which is eternally One (being One without a second). Since God is One...there is always forever...only One Presence, One Spirit, One Consciousness, One Life, One Being, One Infinity....and so on. 'Paths' only exist where 'relativity' (space/time perception) appears, where many trails are perceived to exist...leading to the mountain top. - back to space/time perception. -humanity has many religious traditions/cult-ures/schools of thought....on 'God' and the assumed 'return path home'. But did man ever leave 'God'? and is such only the myth that religions attempt to explain and provide a remedy for? Such is the case, more or less...as each system of theology/philosophy presents their own story, concepts, terms, definitions and assumptions. These viewpoints exist in space/time relativity and conceptions of mind,...yet forever there is always already the One Infinite Presence,...fully alive and conscious unto Itself,...as All that Is. I Am that.

Beautiful!

However this last part, (that I made bold), can be SO scary to accept when perceived from the dualistic perspective. It takes courage, or at least it took courage for me. When I was able, by Divine grace, to step off the edge the freedom was incredible. From a certain perspective the essence of freedom is no-fear, ("Omega"); the "Alpha" perspective is unlimited Being.

Again,...there is no getting 'God' or away from 'God', but only thru the 'lens' of our space/time perception. But such appears to be what this dimensional life is all about,...exploring all points of view...until we see out from the view of the Infinite "I" Itself.....and comprehend all, by not only knowing truth...but being It...since 'God' is really all there is, anyways

The Infinte that is forever becoming more through the experiences of in-division, creation and transcendence! :thumb:

This is where I believe the work of mathematicians like Georg Cantor is of theological importance, since it is evident there are orders of infinity. In higher dimensions, infinities can be treated as we treat numbers in three and four dimensions.

Love you man!

 

[john w]

Well, John, I don't believe in exclusivity. I don't believe my Lord Jesus Christ does either, or He wouldn't have said that when He is raised up He will draw everyone to Himself.

He didn't say they'd all join a church or read a book, He just said He would draw them to Him. Many rooms in His Father's house He said.

May God bless you abundantly.

"I don't believe in exclusivity."-Ref.

Your belief, or lack thereof, does not alter the objective truth. The book's testimony: Exclusivity. Genesis-Revelation. One LORD God, One Savior, One Way, One volume of the book, One faith................................


"He didn't say they'd all join a church or read a book"-Ref.

You made that up. There was no bigger "bible wacko/nut" than the Lord Jesus Christ. "It is written...Have ye not read?..........................................


"He didn't say they'd all join a church or read a book, He just said He would draw them to Him. "-Ref.

You would have no knowledge of "He" w/o the book by which "He" is revealed. NADA. The LORD God has chosen the book as the means by which He has revealed Himself to His creatures. Accept it.

 

[john w]

That depends on how one proves or defines what is 'true'. Many religious traditions espouse qualities and practices that can be perceived as 'good', 'true', 'praiseworthy', having true value.



Your the one 'assuming' the Bible somehow teaches that all other religious writings or holy books are false, and it alone is truth - this appears to be a 'preconceived notion'. Also the issue of the Bible being 'infallible' is another 'assumption'.

Using the counterfeit money example really doesnt hold, unless you can show where other religious traditions and teachings are attempting to 'imitate' the Bible or whatever teachings your refering to. (Some principles actually predate certain parts of the Bible, and the New Testament altogether). Just like you state the Bible stands on its own merit based on 'evidence' (what qualification or standard of 'evidence'?), other traditions value and esteem their inspired writings as well, as from 'God' (divine source).

There is only One Supreme Being.

God is One. All are relating to God, yet some systems or schools may relate better than others. - dont forget individuals gravitate towards systems they are familiar with or drawn to, at any point in time (situation, influence, environment, context). If you were born into another culture or religious tradition, you might have a very different 'point of view' than you do now. Would'nt you say that is possible and logical granting 'situational influence' ? Look on the planet now,..there are thousands/millions of different persons born into different situations/cultures/religions...and there are also many seekers who for whatever reason change their religious affiliations at a certain point in their lives. Just some more food for thought


pj

"That depends on how one proves or defines what is 'true'. Many religious traditions espouse qualities and practices that can be perceived as 'good', 'true', 'praiseworthy', having true value."-Freebase

Thanks, Bill.

The truth cannot be known. True?

The book declares it is true-that is it's testimony. Examine the evidence. It will not do to merely assert "That depends on how one proves or defines what is 'true'. Many religious traditions espouse qualities and practices that can be perceived as 'good', 'true', 'praiseworthy', having true value." and all that jazz. That is a crafty dismissal.

"Your the one 'assuming' the Bible somehow teaches that all other religious writings or holy books are false, and it alone is truth - this appears to be a 'preconceived notion'. Also the issue of the Bible being 'infallible' is another 'assumption'."-Freebase

That is its testimony which I showed you on other posts. You made that up=Assert, pound the podium, declare "victory."

"There is only One Supreme Being. God is One."-Freebase

Name the infallible source authority by which you make this judgment.

 

[Buzzword]

Jesus is the Way.

Whether those following the Way, or seeking the Truth, or living in the Life have ever heard of a man called Jesus is irrelevant.

Whether they have ever attended a church service, opened a "Bible" (or can even read at all), or know the name "Christ" is irrelevant.

Trillions upon trillions have lived and died on this planet since the beginning of humanity.

The vast, uncountable majority did not know/do not know the names YHWH or Jesus.
Is Hell full to overflowing with these masses, damned by their ignorance?
I think not.
Unless He be a God of love, there is no point to life.

Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life.
Thus, any who seek Him, by whatever name, will find Him.

 

[freelight]

God cannot be 'boxed'...........

God cannot be 'boxed'...........

"That depends on how one proves or defines what is 'true'. Many religious traditions espouse qualities and practices that can be perceived as 'good', 'true', 'praiseworthy', having true value."-Freebase

Thanks, Bill.

The truth cannot be known. True?

Depends on how one defines 'truth'. If truth is reality,..then reality being universal is the same in substance for all. If you want to qualify something as so called 'biblical' truth,..thats a matter of 'interpretation'. Truth exists. - there many points of view however about such....'translations'.

Oh, and the cute little 'freebase' moniker really is unnecessary dear.

The book declares it is true-that is it's testimony. Examine the evidence. It will not do to merely assert "That depends on how one proves or defines what is 'true'. Many religious traditions espouse qualities and practices that can be perceived as 'good', 'true', 'praiseworthy', having true value." and all that jazz. That is a crafty dismissal.

I agree that truth or reality is its own evidence. Existence being right NOW is obviously evident. I exist,....I Am (the 'being' that I Am is Self-cognizant). - no dismissal here of what is the case.

"Your the one 'assuming' the Bible somehow teaches that all other religious writings or holy books are false, and it alone is truth - this appears to be a 'preconceived notion'. Also the issue of the Bible being 'infallible' is another 'assumption'."-Freebase

That is its testimony which I showed you on other posts. You made that up=Assert, pound the podium, declare "victory."

:yawn:

"There is only One Supreme Being. God is One."-Freebase

Name the infallible source authority by which you make this judgment.

Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it?


pj

 

[john w]

Jesus is the Way.

Whether those following the Way, or seeking the Truth, or living in the Life have ever heard of a man called Jesus is irrelevant.

Whether they have ever attended a church service, opened a "Bible" (or can even read at all), or know the name "Christ" is irrelevant.

Trillions upon trillions have lived and died on this planet since the beginning of humanity.

The vast, uncountable majority did not know/do not know the names YHWH or Jesus.
Is Hell full to overflowing with these masses, damned by their ignorance?
I think not.
Unless He be a God of love, there is no point to life.

Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life.
Thus, any who seek Him, by whatever name, will find Him.

Nope. You cannot seperate the living word, from the written word. The LORD God does not. You made that up.


The LORD God is holy-# 1 attribute-not love.

The cross. No other way.

"The vast, uncountable majority did not know/do not know the names YHWH or Jesus."-Buzzword

Speculation, an assertion. The book says otherwise.

You'd have no knowledge of "Jesus," w/o the book by which God chose to reveal Him-None.


Law of non contradiction. End of thread again.

 

[john w]

Depends on how one defines 'truth'. If truth is reality,..then reality being universal is the same in substance for all. If you want to qualify something as so called 'biblical' truth,..thats a matter of 'interpretation'. Truth exists. - there many points of view however about such....'translations'.

Oh, and the cute little 'freebase' moniker really is unnecessary dear.



I agree that truth or reality is its own evidence. Existence being right NOW is obviously evident. I exist,....I Am (the 'being' that I Am is Self-cognizant). - no dismissal here of what is the case.



:yawn:



Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it?


pj

"Depends on how one defines 'truth'....Reality itself is its own"-Freebase

Albert Camus/Jean Paul Sarte has spoken.


The truth cannot be known. True statement?

Name your infallible souce authority for assessing "truth."

 

[john w]

"Name the infallible source authority by which you make this judgment."-John W


"Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it? "-Freebase

Translation:

1.Subjectivity-what is true for you, may not be true for me, and vica versa.

2. Re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

3. Really?

Next fool.

 

[freelight]

Existence is One

Existence is One

"Depends on how one defines 'truth'....Reality itself is its own"-Freebase

Albert Camus/Jean Paul Sarte has spoken.


The truth cannot be known. True statement?

Name your infallible souce authority for assessing "truth."

We have a different approach to epistemology.

Again,.....Existence itself is Self-authenticating, as Life or Consciousnessness. Consciousness itself is all there is.

A 'book' is not 'truth' itself,...but may express or articulate symbols and analogies of truth, inspired by Source. Only 'God' Alone is Absolute, Eternal, Infinite, Omnipresent, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Universally and Individually real.

"Name the infallible source authority by which you make this judgment."-John W


"Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it? "-Freebase

Translation:

1.Subjectivity-what is true for you, may not be true for me, and vica versa.

2. Re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

3. Really?

Reality is actually neither subjective or objective,...but is the full totality of what is actually Being, what is truly existing as 'Actual', here, now. Absolute reality is total, perfect, complete, all, one, and is always already present (eternal/infinite). Existence is the same for all in its essence, - 'difference' and 'relative perception' arises in the distortion of space/time and the mind's interpretations.

The mind might enjoy re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic of its own conceptions. But Infinite Spirit never sinks nor diminishes its unlimited perfection.



pj

 

[john w]

We have a different approach to epistemology.

Again,.....Existence itself is Self-authenticating, as Life or Consciousnessness. Consciousness itself is all there is.

A 'book' is not 'truth' itself,...but may express or articulate symbols and analogies of truth, inspired by Source. Only 'God' Alone is Absolute, Eternal, Infinite, Omnipresent, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Universally and Individually real.



Reality is actually neither subjective or objective,...but is the full totality of what is actually Being, what is truly existing as 'Actual', here, now. Absolute reality is total, perfect, complete, all, one, and is always already present (eternal/infinite). Existence is the same for all in its essence, - 'difference' and 'relative perception' arises in the distortion of space/time and the mind's interpretations.

The mind might enjoy re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic of its own conceptions. But Infinite Spirit never sinks nor diminishes its unlimited perfection.



pj

Translation: Far out....the inner id....


"Reality is actually neither subjective or objective,...but is the full totality of what is actually..."-Freebase

Let me read that after a few hits from my bong.



Thanks for you're cooperation.

 

[Buzzword]

Nope. You cannot seperate the living word, from the written word. The LORD God does not. You made that up.


The LORD God is holy-# 1 attribute-not love.

The cross. No other way.

"The vast, uncountable majority did not know/do not know the names YHWH or Jesus."-Buzzword

Speculation, an assertion. The book says otherwise.

You'd have no knowledge of "Jesus," w/o the book by which God chose to reveal Him-None.


Law of non contradiction. End of thread again.

You seriously, honestly, and wholeheartedly believe that the quadrillions of people who have lived and died on this planet before and since Christ walked the earth who NEVER EVEN ONCE, because of whatever circumstance, had the CHANCE TO CHOOSE the man named Jesus or the God named YHWH because they had never heard (ie, through no fault of their own) are and will be sentenced to suffer eternally?

You realize that includes people who lived in the Western Hemisphere during the first century A.D., right?

Have fun with that.
According to the book you keep your god in, he couldn't have ministered to anyone except the twelve and those in Israel during his lifetime.
He didn't go to Asia, Europe, Africa, Australia, or North/South America.
So I guess you just say "Screw those billions, they weren't in the right place at the right time so god must hate them."
Your "god" is the one atheists can't believe in.
It (not he) is too small. It fits in the box you have built for it.

Mine has revealed Himself to all humanity through a variety of names at a variety of times in a variety of ways, because He is not imprisoned within MAN'S written word.

He does not live in houses built by hands...including pages filled with words.

Just as He is not limited to one name, He is not limited in the tools He can use to reveal Himself.

 

[john w]

You seriously, honestly, and wholeheartedly believe that the quadrillions of people who have lived and died on this planet before and since Christ walked the earth who NEVER EVEN ONCE, because of whatever circumstance, had the CHANCE TO CHOOSE the man named Jesus or the God named YHWH because they had never heard (ie, through no fault of their own) are and will be sentenced to suffer eternally?

You realize that includes people who lived in the Western Hemisphere during the first century A.D., right?

Have fun with that.
According to the book you keep your god in, he couldn't have ministered to anyone except the twelve and those in Israel during his lifetime.
He didn't go to Asia, Europe, Africa, Australia, or North/South America.
So I guess you just say "Screw those billions, they weren't in the right place at the right time so god must hate them."
Your "god" is the one atheists can't believe in.
It (not he) is too small. It fits in the box you have built for it.

Mine has revealed Himself to all humanity through a variety of names at a variety of times in a variety of ways, because He is not imprisoned within MAN'S written word.

He does not live in houses built by hands...including pages filled with words.

Just as He is not limited to one name, He is not limited in the tools He can use to reveal Himself.

Transalation: Humanism-I cannot believe that God, if He exists, would make known to "the quadrillions of people who have lived and died on this planet before and since Christ walked the earth who NEVER EVEN ONCE, because of whatever circumstance, had the CHANCE TO CHOOSE the man named Jesus or the God," so He did not. What I cannot understand, I will not believe, or accept. Its called my mind is my "god," a sophisticated form of idolatry.

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me." John 12:32

"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9

Romans 1:
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:



"Just as He is not limited to one name, He is not limited in the tools He can use to reveal Himself"-Buzzword

Nope:
1. Law of non contradiction.

2. What the book says, God says. The only tool He chose to reveal Himself objectively is the book.

3. One God, One Saviour......................exclusivity. Gen.-Rev.

4." Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12

PS:Never trust anyone who begins his/her "argument" with:


"You seriously, honestly, and wholeheartedly..."

That means they are not "serious...honest....wholehearted....," and are putting forth humanist drivel, and emotional appeals.



End of thread again.

 

[Yazichestvo]

Transalation: Humanism-I cannot believe that God, if He exists, would make known to "the quadrillions of people who have lived and died on this planet before and since Christ walked the earth who NEVER EVEN ONCE, because of whatever circumstance, had the CHANCE TO CHOOSE the man named Jesus or the God," so He did not. What I cannot understand, I will not believe, or accept. Its called my mind is my "god," a sophisticated form of idolatry.

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me." John 12:32

"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9

Romans 1:
"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:



"Just as He is not limited to one name, He is not limited in the tools He can use to reveal Himself"-Buzzword

Nope:
1. Law of non contradiction.

2. What the book says, God says. The only tool He chose to reveal Himself objectively is the book.

3. One God, One Saviour......................exclusivity. Gen.-Rev.

4." Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12

PS:Never trust anyone who begins his/her "argument" with:


"You seriously, honestly, and wholeheartedly..."

That means they are not "serious...honest....wholehearted....," and are putting forth humanist drivel, and emotional appeals.



End of thread again.

That tone isn't helping you- calm down. There's no need to get so cross over Christ. It's really excruciating.

You would damn hordes of people based, not on their character, but on what they understand or believe in. You essentially turn morality into a guessing game. You talk about intellectualism as "idolatry"- the substitution of the actual thing being worshiped for it's image. Well, is it really any different to reject basic kindness and love for fellow man in the name of a God who is supposed to embody these very same attributes? It seems like you place your Bible before your sense of morality. With no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper with instructions on it (your idol) , you end up focusing more on God than on good.

 

[freelight]

Pure Being....the only reality........

Pure Being....the only reality........

Translation: Far out....the inner id....


"Reality is actually neither subjective or objective,...but is the full totality of what is actually..."-Freebase

Let me read that after a few hits from my bong.

No 'hits' on a bong necessary. However, approaching Life from a different perspective and premise, is essential to intuit what is being shared. It helps to to aquaint yourself with the person your speaking to as well, as far as their religious tradition or philosophical disposition. You can do that by researching their basic profile info., threads, archived-posts, religious affiliation, metaphysical training, world-view, blogs, writings, signature links, etc. - 'common sense referencing'. - also expanding consciousness is essential as well, for engaging in 'creative dialogue'.

Thanks for you're cooperation.

The pleasure is mine - just remember,..there are other points of view out there - yours is not the only or exclusive one existing. But Existence itself is the one universal reality common to all, being all. Consider what is beyond space or time, yet exists for all time and eternity, what alone is infinite. That 'reality' is 'God', and is present here now. This Isness, is all there is....of all there is.

Stretching your awareness beyond mental constructs and religious dogma can do wonders, because the Infinite is not constrained or bounded by human thought or opinions.


pj

 

[john w]

That tone isn't helping you- calm down. There's no need to get so cross over Christ. It's really excruciating.

You would damn hordes of people based, not on their character, but on what they understand or believe in. You essentially turn morality into a guessing game. You talk about intellectualism as "idolatry"- the substitution of the actual thing being worshiped for it's image. Well, is it really any different to reject basic kindness and love for fellow man in the name of a God who is supposed to embody these very same attributes? It seems like you place your Bible before your sense of morality. With no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper with instructions on it (your idol) , you end up focusing more on God than on good.

Given:

"Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it? "-Freebase

...give me time to take a few days to get high. My bong water needs to be changed. I'll get back to you. Groovy? Far out. Peace.

 

[john w]

No 'hits' on a bong necessary. However, approaching Life from a different perspective and premise, is essential to intuit what is being shared. It helps to to aquaint yourself with the person your speaking to as well, as far as their religious tradition or philosophical disposition. You can do that by researching their basic profile info., threads, archived-posts, religious affiliation, metaphysical training, world-view, blogs, writings, signature links, etc. - 'common sense referencing'. - also expanding consciousness is essential as well, for engaging in 'creative dialogue'.




The pleasure is mine - just remember,..there are other points of view out there - yours is not the only or exclusive one existing. But Existence itself is the one universal reality common to all, being all. Consider what is beyond space or time, yet exists for all time and eternity, what alone is infinite. That 'reality' is 'God', and is present here now. This Isness, is all there is....of all there is.

Stretching your awareness beyond mental constructs and religious dogma can do wonders, because the Infinite is not constrained or bounded by human thought or opinions.


pj

"...,.....Existence itself is Self-authenticating, as Life or Consciousnessness. Consciousness itself is all there is. A 'book' is not 'truth' itself,...but may express or articulate symbols and analogies of truth, inspired by Source. Only 'God' Alone is Absolute, Eternal, Infinite, Omnipresent, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Universally and Individually real.Reality is actually neither subjective or objective,...but is the full totality of what is actually Being, what is truly existing as 'Actual', here, now. Absolute reality is total, perfect, complete, all, one, and is always already present (eternal/infinite). Existence is the same for all in its essence, - 'difference' and 'relative perception' arises in the distortion of space/time and the mind's interpretations...Stretching your awareness beyond mental constructs and religious dogma can do wonders, because the Infinite is not constrained or bounded by human thought or opinions."-Freebase


Hold that thought. I need to eat a few "special brownies," and astroproject, to be able to analyze the above. I'll get back to you. Cool?

 

[Yazichestvo]

Given:

"Reality itself is its own authority. The source is Life itself, this pure conscious Being that I Am. This Existence is One, yet reflects an infinite variation of colours and form. (Remember, 'God' is Light). Wonderful, isnt it? "-Freebase

...give me time to take a few days to get high. My bong water needs to be changed. I'll get back to you. Groovy? Far out. Peace.

When I try to make a point, you insult me. If I insult you, will you make a point? Or are you pretty much a one trick pony? (Or rather, a one trick ***)

 

[john w]

That tone isn't helping you- calm down. There's no need to get so cross over Christ. It's really excruciating.

You would damn hordes of people based, not on their character, but on what they understand or believe in. You essentially turn morality into a guessing game. You talk about intellectualism as "idolatry"- the substitution of the actual thing being worshiped for it's image. Well, is it really any different to reject basic kindness and love for fellow man in the name of a God who is supposed to embody these very same attributes? It seems like you place your Bible before your sense of morality. With no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper with instructions on it (your idol) , you end up focusing more on God than on good.

"You would damn hordes of people based, not on their character, but on what they understand or believe in. "-Yazichestvo

No, the book does:

1. "Character" needed: the righteousness of God. Romans. All come short. Rom. 3:19-23.

And hence, the dbr. Accept it.

2."but on what they understand or believe in"-Yazichestvo



Nope: Wrong definition of faith.


One to Yazichestvo: Do not jump off that buildiing. You will be killed.

Yazichestvo: I do not know that, or believe that. Therefore, you are wrong.What I believe determines objective truth.


" Well, is it really any different to reject basic kindness and love for fellow man in the name of a God who is supposed to embody these very same attributes? "-Yazichestvo

Nope. The # 1 attribute in the book is the LORD God's holiness, not His love. Intolerance for sin. You, and the rest of the lost world, do not want to hear that. You want praise, patting each other on the back, telling each other how good you are. Too bad. You might be cleaner than other rats, but you are still a rat. Dirty.

Irrelevant. The LORD God's estimation of you: guilty, shut up, you come short-Rom. 3:19-23.

Memorize it: the righteousness of God.

And hence, the cross of Christ. No other option. None.

"It seems like you place your Bible before your sense of morality. With no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper with instructions on it (your idol) , you end up focusing more on God than on good."-Yazichestvo

1. Slower: What scripture says, the LORD God says.

2. Translated: Your "morality" is subjective, not objective: Judges 21:25


Contrasts.

"you end up focusing more on God than on good."-Yazichestvo



You would have no concept of "good," or "bad," w/o an objective standard by which to assess it. And you would have no concept of God, w/o an objective standard to know Him.


Your standard is "Well, this is what I think 'good' is, and what 'God' should be=your mind is your "god." Subjectivity.

"no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper" -Yazichestvo

The US laws are an imposition of morality. They are written on a sheet of paper. An objective standard.

A judge to Yazichestvo: :"You broke the law. Guilty."


Yazichestvo:"But judge, don't you know that there is more to morality, to the law, beyond a sheet of paper?"


Next.

 

[john w]

When I try to make a point, you insult me. If I insult you, will you make a point? Or are you pretty much a one trick pony? (Or rather, a one trick ***)

Bear with me. My rolling machine broke down. Give me a few hours to get a buzz on, so I can analyze your posts, and Freebases's, and read Albert Camus. Can you dig it?

 

[Yazichestvo]

"You would damn hordes of people based, not on their character, but on what they understand or believe in. "-Yazichestvo

No, the book does:

1. "Character" needed: the righteousness of God. Romans. All come short. Rom. 3:19-23.

And hence, the dbr. Accept it.

2."but on what they understand or believe in"

Nope: Wrong definition of faith.


One to Yazichestvo: Do not jump off that buildiing. You will be killed.

Yazichestvo: I do not know that, or believe that. Therefore, you are wrong.What I believe determines objective truth.


" Well, is it really any different to reject basic kindness and love for fellow man in the name of a God who is supposed to embody these very same attributes? "-Yazichestvo

Nope. The # 1 attribute in the book is the LORD God's holiness, not His love. Intolerance for sin. You, and the rest of the lost world, do not want to hear that. You want praise, patting each other on the back, telling each other how good you are. Too bad. You might be cleaner tthan other rats, but you are still a rat. Dirty.

Irrelevant. The LORD God's estimation of you: guilty, shut up, you come short-Rom. 3:19-23.

Memorize it: the righteousness of God.

And hence, the cross of Christ. No other option. None.

"It seems like you place your Bible before your sense of morality. With no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper with instructions on it (your idol) , you end up focusing more on God than on good."-Yazichestvo

1. Slower: What scripture says, the LORD God says.

2. Translated: Your "morality" is subjective, not objective: Judges 21:25


Contrasts.

"you end up focusing more on God than on good."-Yazichestvo



You would have no concept of "good," or "bad," w/o an objective standard by which to assess it. And you would have no concept of God, w/o an objective standard to know Him.


Your standard is ""Well, this is what I think 'good' is, and what 'God' should be=your mind is your "god." Subjectivity.

"no personal sense of morality beyond a sheet of paper" -Yazichestvo

The US laws are an imposition of morality. They are written on a sheet of paper. An objective standard.

A judge to Yazichestvo: :"You broke the law. Guilty."


Yazichestvo:"But judge, don't you know that there is more to morality, to the law, beyond a sheet of paper?


Next.

I see I'm going to have to spell out my argument a bit more.

Your God's morality is no more arbitrary than mine. According to you, no doubt, he could decide it was moral to murder babies, and you would be the first to applaud him in his brilliant decision because you wouldn't rely on your internal sense of morality to tell you that this was wrong. When you say you are good, you mean only that you are an automaton who follows orders. Without some emotional sense of good, you're basically an empty shell.

What is good must be based on kindness and compassion for others, or else it looks fairly arbitrary by comparison. For instance, a God who tortures others for pleasure can proclaim that it's moral all he likes. Just because he's big and all-powerful doesn't change the fact that it's pointless and cruel.