toldailytopic: Libya's Muammar el-Qaddafi is dead, discuss.

[serpentdove]

Vengeance is repulsive.

Evil is repulsive. "Vengeance is sweet." ~ William Painter Jer 46:9

:listen: There's more to come.

"[T]he day of the Lord. While this phrase often refers to an eschatological judgment on earth (such as in Joel 1:15; Zeph. 1:7; Mal. 4:5; 1 Thess. 5:2; 2 Pet. 3:10), it also may refer to a historical day. In this case it refers to the Egyptian defeat (cf. Lam. 2:22)..." opcorn: MacArthur, John Jr: The MacArthur Study Bible. electronic ed. Nashville : Word Pub., 1997, c1997, S. Je 46:10

"...Ezekiel says a nation called “Put” will be part of the alliance. Josephus identifies “Put” as “ancient Lybios” — the territory that today we call Libya and Algeria. Interestingly, both countries today are deeply hostile to Israel and closely allied with Russia..." Full text: What is the "War of Gog and Magog"? Pt. I Joel Rosenberg Blog

 

[serpentdove]

Killing a murderous monster like Qaddafi is no load on anyone's conscience. But killing him after he has given up, without trial, that should be on everyone's conscience.

It's true (Ezek. 25:12–17; Heb. 10:30). Vengeance belongs to God (Psa. 94:1; Rom. 12:19). But Qaddafi is not coming back (Ga 6:7-8). :burnlib:

"That's all I have to say about that." :freak: ~ Forrest Gump

 

[drbrumley]

He got as fair treatment as he gave. I don't care in the slightest way that he might have surrendered at the last moment.
As for a trial, do you suspect he was innocent?

are we a better people or not? are we governed by laws or not?

as how I see a trial turning out, well that is just irrelevant isn't it?

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk

 

[The Barbarian]

We are better than that. But we aren't in the shoes of the Libyan people, most of whom have a friend or a relative who ran afoul of this brutal thug. It was pretty much a foregone conclusion that unless he surrendered to a western power, he was going to be killed when they caught up with him.

The Libyans are saying he was caught in a crossfire between rebels and loyalists, but that doesn't seem very likely right now.

 

[serpentdove]

...arbie's reputation for being a racist.

You weren't supposed to notice that because he calls you :noway: a racist (Isa 29:15,16). :mmph:

With Christ's presence, one can overcome racism (Ac 17:26). If Barbie ever humbles himself before God, he'll get over it (Eze 36:26). :thumb:

See:

Darwin's Plantation: Evolution's Racist Roots

John Woolman: Quaker mystic and abolitionist

John Newton: Reformed slave trader

William Wilberforce: Antislavery politician

Sidebar: Bob Enyart is our William Wilberforce of today continuing the good fight--now :mario: against the wicked practice of abortion.

 

[some other dude]

Yes, there's hope for barbie if he will ever choose to accept Jesus. :thumb:

 

[MrRadish]

That contradicts itself.
Someone ought to be punished in your own words, because their own suffering will teach them about inflicting suffering on others.

Killing someone doesn't teach them a thing. And there are other, albeit more difficult, ways of teaching people not to inflict suffering without hypocritically inflicting suffering on them yourself.

Murderers kill innocent people, and rightly should feel remorse. Killing a murderous monster like Qaddafi is no load on anyones conscience. It's a happy day when that freak leaves us.

Christian doctrine teaches that there's no such thing as an innocent person.

Anyway, all this misses my original point, which is that even if you decide that you want to 'educate' someone by hurting them, vengeance should not be your motivation. Vengeance is an inherently self-perpetuating cycle of violence, and the desire to inflict it for its own sake (and therefore to take joy in it) is an emotional reaction no more deserving of indulgence than hatred or anger.

 

[some other dude]

Killing someone doesn't teach them a thing.

Nonsense. It teaches them not to do that (whatever it is) ever again. Guaranteed.

 

[The Barbarian]

I see Sot still thinks of Arabs as just "brown people." Many Arabs look like Southern Europeans. But what do you expect of a supposed "chemist" who thought that potassium nitrate reduces sexual desire?

Racism is just one of the many misconceptions he's carrying around.

 

[some other dude]

I see Sot still thinks of Arabs as just "brown people." Many Arabs look like Southern Europeans. But what do you expect of a supposed "chemist" who thought that potassium nitrate reduces sexual desire?

Racism is just one of the many misconceptions he's carrying around.

:chuckle: Silly barbie, spreading his lies.

 

[rexlunae]

Still waiting for the Obama press conference where he takes full credit for this.

Am I allowed to remind you you said that when he holds a press conference praising the efforts of Libyans and the international community, especially our NATO allies? That is the tone he's set so far, at least.

Well, here's the press release. How does he do?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/10/20/remarks-president-death-muammar-qaddafi

Seems like he credits "a coalition that included the United States, NATO and Arab nations" and "the courageous Libyan people". And it contains this little nugget: "And now, working in Libya with friends and allies, we’ve demonstrated what collective action can achieve in the 21st century."

US policy does deserve a fair amount of credit here, as do American soliders. This is also acknowledged. But it seems like you're exactly wrong about Obama's reaction.

 

[Anubis]

While I'm glad he's gone, I'm not glad as to how he was deposed. Still, I can't say I blame the Libyan people for removing him in such a manner. Oppressive dictators usually don't fare well with the mob, just look at what happened to Mussolini.

 

[WizardofOz]

Someone who has laid down arms, surrendered, and begged for their life should not be murdered. I don't care who that someone is or what they've done.

It's really indefensible. Say what you will about Qaddafi. The people who murdered him and cheered when he was murdered are no better.

 

[Rusha]

Good riddance. Another loser dictator bites the dust.

This ...

 

[Nick M]

Killing someone doesn't teach them a thing.

No, it prevents them from murdering again.

 

[some other dude]

The people who murdered him and cheered when he was murdered are no better.

The people who executed and cheered the death of a murderous tyrant who oppressed his people are no different from him? :freak:

 

[MrRadish]

No, it prevents them from murdering again.

By that logic the best way to stop murder is to kill everybody. Someone who hasn't murdered before is just as capable of doing so than somebody who has.

It's much better to change somebody's mind, or to find out whatever drove them to murder in the first place and see if it's a problem worth solving, than to kill them. Of course, this isn't always possible, but that doesn't mean that instances where you do have to end someone's life is something to be celebrated.

But again you're missing my point. In cases where you do consider it necessary to kill someone, vengeance should have nothing to do with it. You're not killing them for what they did, you're killing them for something they're about to do that you've got no other way of preventing.

 

[Nick M]

By that logic the best way to stop murder is to kill everybody.

That isn't logic you imbecile. That is unjust. It is justice to kill a murderer.

 

[MrRadish]

That isn't logic you imbecile. That is unjust. It is justice to kill a murderer.

Why is it more beneficial to society to kill a person who has murdered than to identify the internal and external factors that motivated them to do it, deal with them, then allow them to live a fulfilled life?

What's the point of 'justice' for its own sake? What even is justice?

 

[WizardofOz]

The people who executed murdered and cheered the death of a murderous tyrant who oppressed his people are no different from him? :freak:

Let's call it like it is