Here she admits that the new birth is received passively. Does she have a free will?
No one is born again without hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2.
The word "Gospel" is not in the Calvinist vocabulary.
The Simplicity of the Gospel / The Complicated Religions
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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Here she admits that the new birth is received passively. Does she have a free will?
No one is born again without hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2.
The word "Gospel" is not in the Calvinist vocabulary.
beloved57
Well-known member
You don't believe the Gospel. You deny that Christ death alone saved them He died for!
Salvation has been provided for everyone, Hebrews 2:9. So that now, "Whosover that shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved" Romans 10:13.
beloved57
Well-known member
False teaching. You deny that Christ death alone saved them He died for! You deny Him to be a Saviour!
So you do not know whether you are saved or not?
Your theology is garbage.
How many times have I quoted John 3:16?
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believes in him should not perish, but have ever lasting life."
Does that sound like I don't believe that Jesus is the savior?
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach daily that sinners Christ came to save die in their sins. So you deny Hes a Saviour !
If you do not receive what Christ has done for you, you will die in your sins.
beloved57
Well-known member
Now admit that you teach and believe that sinners Christ died for are going to perish in their sins anyways! That denies that He is the Saviour.
No one will die in their sins that have..."But as many as received him (Jesus) to them gave he the power to become the sons of God" John 1:12.
Ask Mr. Religion
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The passivity of regeneration ("born again") is an instantaneous event. God, by His omnipotent acting produces in the man (that is, in the will) new qualities. Then God excites those faculties to action.
God effects regeneration by the heart-turning power of his Spirit without any cooperation from man. Here fallen man's renewal is only passive and subjective inasmuch as he is a mere subject receiving the action of God.
In other words, a sinner cannot believe, repent, accept the gospel and come to Christ unless God first sovereignly and graciously gives that sinner new life by the power of his Word and Spirit (as in Eze. 36:26). After that regenerative event, the person will not not want to believe and, given his own will to believe, will know he has been born anew.
The regenerative instantaneous event is much like that initial electrical spark that brings the engine to life. Likewise, the regenerative event quickens the spiritually dead to life.
AMR
musterion
Well-known member
So Luke13:3 is false.
HOGWASH!
In the New Testament those that became Christians did so by hearing and believing the Gospel. No one receives the Holy Spirit or is born again without hearing and believing the Gospel.
Listen to what Paul says to the Galatians.
"This only would I learn of you, Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (because you did something) or by the hearing of faith?" (hearing and believing the Gospel) Galatians 3:2.
To the Romans he said,
"So then faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.
Peter wrote.
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed (Adam) but of incorruptible (Christ) by the word of God (the Gospel) which lives and abides forever" 1 Peter 1:23.
On the day of Pentecost 8,000 Jews heard and believed Peter's Gospel and received the Holy Spirit, Acts 2:41, Acts 4:4.
AMR is anti-Gospel and is anti-Christ.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach that sinners Christ died for are going to perish in their sins anyways! So you don't believe that Christ death alone was enough to save them He died for.
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Use the whole counsel of Scripture to reconcile apparent contradictions
Use the whole counsel of Scripture to reconcile apparent contradictions
Luke 13:3 is no more false than is Acts 11:18:
"When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, 'Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.' "
Accordingly the whole counsel of Scripture should be used to reconcile what on the surface appears to be contradictory. Repentance is not a condition of the gospel offer nor a condition of salvation, strictly speaking. Repentance is never a cause of grace or a condition of grace, rather repentance is always a consequence of grace.
Not a few think that repentance is saying a prayer, sorrowful weeping, and some regret. No doubt there is an aspect of these things that may accompany repentance. But the very word repentance is pregnant with the view of actually turning from one's sins. That said, we know from Scripture that the unregenerate cannot turn from their sins until regenerated. Repentance is a fruit of the faith that comes from regeneration. Never in Scripture is repentance given a treatment that implies repentance is means to our being born-again versus the way faith is credited with the instrumentality of accomplishing one's re-birth (e.g. Eph. 2:8).
Repentance and faith are both necessary for salvation, but they are related to justification in different ways. Faith alone is the instrument by which Christ is received and rested on as Savior. Justification is by faith, not by repentance. But faith (and therefore justification) cannot exist without repentance. Repentance is as necessary to salvation by faith as the ankle is to walking. The one does not act apart from the other. I cannot come to Christ in faith without turning from sin in repentance. As one cannot have true faith without faith yielding works, so one cannot have true faith without simultaneously having repentance. Genuine repentance is the proof of one's faith.
Because of the close association between faith and repentance in Scripture (e.g., Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21; Hebrews 6:1), when we talk about conversion in terms of the logical order of salvation, we often speak of these two as alternate sides of one coin, or some similar analogy. In general, then, repentance unto life (Acts 11:18) is the ordinary, proper, and reasonable heartfelt reflex of saving faith (Heb.10:39). The Pharisees demonstrated the exact opposite reaction (Matthew 21:32). This does not negate the historical experience of salvation, whereby we are often brought to great hatred and disgust at our own sin, and turn from it to look unto Jesus (Heb.12:2), the object of our faith. But it is not the turning that delivers us nor the faculty of faith (nothing in man), but Christ the object of faith outside of man. Nor should we wish to deny that further acts of repentance even after we "first believed" may feel stronger than our earlier repentance. This only makes sense, as stronger faith only opens our heart's understanding further, both to the nature and corruption of sin, as well as the surpassing greatness of the Savior. This is but growth in grace.
“Then God also granted repentance to life to the Gentiles” (Act 11.18). The Arminians hold that it is in our power to repent. No, we can harden our hearts, but we cannot soften them. This crown of freewill has fallen from our head. No, there is not only impotency in us, but obstinacy (Acts 7:51). As Thomas Watson once wrote, therefore beg God for a repentant spirit. He can make the stony heart bleed. His is a word of creative power. See here.
AMR
Use the whole counsel of Scripture to reconcile apparent contradictions
Nice try, brother.
Luke 13:3 is no more false than is Acts 11:18:
"When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, 'Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.' "
Accordingly the whole counsel of Scripture should be used to reconcile what on the surface appears to be contradictory. Repentance is not a condition of the gospel offer nor a condition of salvation, strictly speaking. Repentance is never a cause of grace or a condition of grace, rather repentance is always a consequence of grace.
Not a few think that repentance is saying a prayer, sorrowful weeping, and some regret. No doubt there is an aspect of these things that may accompany repentance. But the very word repentance is pregnant with the view of actually turning from one's sins. That said, we know from Scripture that the unregenerate cannot turn from their sins until regenerated. Repentance is a fruit of the faith that comes from regeneration. Never in Scripture is repentance given a treatment that implies repentance is means to our being born-again versus the way faith is credited with the instrumentality of accomplishing one's re-birth (e.g. Eph. 2:8).
Repentance and faith are both necessary for salvation, but they are related to justification in different ways. Faith alone is the instrument by which Christ is received and rested on as Savior. Justification is by faith, not by repentance. But faith (and therefore justification) cannot exist without repentance. Repentance is as necessary to salvation by faith as the ankle is to walking. The one does not act apart from the other. I cannot come to Christ in faith without turning from sin in repentance. As one cannot have true faith without faith yielding works, so one cannot have true faith without simultaneously having repentance. Genuine repentance is the proof of one's faith.
Because of the close association between faith and repentance in Scripture (e.g., Mark 1:15; Acts 20:21; Hebrews 6:1), when we talk about conversion in terms of the logical order of salvation, we often speak of these two as alternate sides of one coin, or some similar analogy. In general, then, repentance unto life (Acts 11:18) is the ordinary, proper, and reasonable heartfelt reflex of saving faith (Heb.10:39). The Pharisees demonstrated the exact opposite reaction (Matthew 21:32). This does not negate the historical experience of salvation, whereby we are often brought to great hatred and disgust at our own sin, and turn from it to look unto Jesus (Heb.12:2), the object of our faith. But it is not the turning that delivers us nor the faculty of faith (nothing in man), but Christ the object of faith outside of man. Nor should we wish to deny that further acts of repentance even after we "first believed" may feel stronger than our earlier repentance. This only makes sense, as stronger faith only opens our heart's understanding further, both to the nature and corruption of sin, as well as the surpassing greatness of the Savior. This is but growth in grace.
“Then God also granted repentance to life to the Gentiles” (Act 11.18). The Arminians hold that it is in our power to repent. No, we can harden our hearts, but we cannot soften them. This crown of freewill has fallen from our head. No, there is not only impotency in us, but obstinacy (Acts 7:51). As Thomas Watson once wrote, therefore beg God for a repentant spirit. He can make the stony heart bleed. His is a word of creative power. See here.
AMR
Ask Mr. Religion
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Robert Pate's Desperation To Be Seen
Robert Pate's Desperation To Be Seen
When you can publicly commit to standing still and engaging me substantively, an actual discussion may take place. Until that time, carry on with your opinionated posts. I am sure some will read them, much as they read blogs or editorials. Those that want to actually dig deeper and be edified in the process will, unfortunately, have to look elsewhere than your naked opinions. :AMR:
AMR
Robert Pate's Desperation To Be Seen
Thank you for yet another blog entry, Robert, but please do not try to engage when you have no intention of doing so in substance. You have been answered, but any answer given you that does not comport with your own blogged opinions is summarily dismissed with the usual invective.
When you can publicly commit to standing still and engaging me substantively, an actual discussion may take place. Until that time, carry on with your opinionated posts. I am sure some will read them, much as they read blogs or editorials. Those that want to actually dig deeper and be edified in the process will, unfortunately, have to look elsewhere than your naked opinions. :AMR:
AMR
Are you B57's father?
I refuted your post throughly and completely and all that you can come up with is that?
musterion
Well-known member
The point there wasn't that Gentiles were being saved -- the promise of that goes at least as far back as Moses. What they were surprised at is that "dogs" were being unquestionably saved while their own prophesied priest-nation remained in obstinate unbelief. That was NOT what they had been told to expect...hence, Paul and the revelation of the mystery.
So back to Luke...the Reformed view is that reprobates cannot repent and the elect won't perish. That makes His warning meaningless.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach that sinners Christ died for are going to perish in their sins anyways! So you don't believe that Christ death alone was enough to save them He died for.